Thread of Ultimate Stupidity - Page 1494

Fordragon · 01/06/11, 5:25 PM

Originally Posted by Kennian

Someone on MMO-champ droped some screengrabs from the PTR and it's showing our mastery pushing 35% instead of twenty.

rejoice!!

is this a bug?

He has more than 8% mastery that means he has reforged his gear to 14% as it shows from the screenshot.That leads to the 35% .

Radial · 01/06/11, 5:32 PM

Originally Posted by Aldriana

IP and WP used to be 20% and 50% respectively. A while back they converted it to a PPM such that autoattacking with a weapon of any speed would give the same number of poison procs per unit time. When they did so they selected the proc rate such that a 1.4 speed weapon would still proc at 20% and 50% (respectively). This resulted in PPM values of 8.57 and 21.43.

In short: the observation about a 1.4 speed weapon is designed to motivate why the PPM values are so odd.

Gotcha. Thanks for the elaboration.

Shha · 01/06/11, 5:37 PM

I think you vastly exaggerate Morsexy.

Our self heal is fine, 52% health coupled with our higher health pool, definitely works fine for a cd (10% dmg reduction isnt needed when our hp is more then 10% above other people to survive a big hit, and 60k+ self healing would be outperformed at 600k dmg taken). Granted a shorter CD wouldnt be bad, but i wouldnt trade our regen off.

As for dps, I doubt you "easily" do 23k dps on a single target fight. Highest world logs dont show 23k dps for baradin hold boss (and no the top melee there did attack from behind, there is hardly need to stack whole raid in front). 22.800 is top for a basically tank and spank boss (and again, i can with 95% certainity stay on boss whole time, during fel firestorm too - im sure TOP parses people could as well). Bottom line is - we are behind other melee (unless we talk about Ret, but they did get buffs - not sure how significant) , and way behind DKs and some ranged.

I also fail to see why we would scale better then other classes. We mostly cap our rage income already at this stage, and after that what exactly would give us better scaling? We dont have any particular modifiers to our stats, our ratings are godawful beside crit (once we take the hit out of equation in later tiers). PTR changes only emphasise this - since our extra rage in further tiers will be worth less.

Yes we scaled rather fast going from quest greens to tier 1 epics - mostly because we "double dipped" in a traditional warrior way - we got more straight damage, but we got also more rage resulting in more attacks as well. Right now however its over, the rage scaling is rather low, and with the change it wont be of much importance. All in all, i feel its rogues and dks (not sure about paladins, dont know the mechanics enough) that will scale faster from this point on.

Having said that,my concern is simple. We are melee class (a big no in cataclysm), with agreed lower utility and survivability then any other class in the game (a big no in cataclysm), with damage below top tier and sometimes downright awful, depending on encounter (a big no in any expansion). With all this in mind , nerfs really seem not in place.

Lunatie · 01/06/11, 5:45 PM

Okay so I reforged and regemmed some of my gear from 274 haste rating to 785 (+ other changes, not that important).

Got a nice dps increase of 255.

Tetzlof · 01/06/11, 5:56 PM

Originally Posted by Morsexy

I think my favorite part of heroic raid encounters is hearing on mumble "Use personal cool downs" meaning of course personal damage reduction cool downs. I guess I should take solace in the fact that we can at least glyph out of the increased damage taken during Deathwish? I mean just adjusting the stupid talent and giving us "fun" and "interesting" glyphs, to use Blizzard's own terminology, would have been nice.

Is there a melee class at this point that doesn't have a free shield wall or immunity? I would trade my 52% of health regen over 10 seconds for a 10% damage reduction on a one minute CD that I could use in berserker stance and keep up my damage like every other class can.

They're so afraid of some oddball thing in PVP or for warrior tanks that making Shield wall baseline and 20% not requiring shields, and talented 40% in the prot tree, and 60% with glyph will seemingly never happen.

As for the DPS nerfs just eyeballing my damage on my top Atramaedes parse, it seems pretty devasting at first blush.

Edit: for above post

I think you need to accumulate some gear before judging that, I can easily do 21-23k DPS on a single target fight, its just that every single fight seemingly has an AOE component, where we have classes that do so much damage its beyond comprehension. It is easy to see where somewhere in the near future warrior single target damage could possibly start to dominate as it has with every expansion and the original game. The issue being we sure as hell aren't there yet.

check my gear out, also wol 7th for 25 regular Magmaw at 24k. My gear is pretty alright. It's gonna hurt. Also you can't do 21-23k on single target fight(s) that don't have a gimmick (bonus damage) lets see the wol to back that up. BH boss doesn't count.

Shha · 01/06/11, 6:03 PM

I can see 23k dmg happening , on a fight like TB boss (which is also considerably shorter, and with most fast kills perfectly timed for DW) . But from it happening to "easily" achieving it (and it being a reoccuring thing), is a pretty large gap.

Paradosi · 01/06/11, 6:18 PM

I've seen debate on whether to use Bloodthirst or Raging Blow first in our rotation after CS. Does this buff to Raging Blow now put an end to that debate? Is Raging Blow definitely a priority after CS if this goes live?

How about 3/3 Incite? I personally found that Incite is a DPS upgrade over 3/3 deep wounds. Does that change with the HS nerf?

I'll try and get some time to test this out on PTR when it goes live and report back. But if anyone with greater math skills than myself has better insight on this, feel free to reply!

Morsexy · 01/06/11, 6:40 PM

Originally Posted by Shha

I think you vastly exaggerate Morsexy.

If it is such a non issue, I still don't see why we don't have access to an ability that isn't so penalizing in its use.

Originally Posted by Tetzlof

check my gear out, also wol 7th for 25 regular Magmaw at 24k. My gear is pretty alright. It's gonna hurt. Also you can't do 21-23k on single target fight(s) that don't have a gimmick (bonus damage) lets see the wol to back that up. BH boss doesn't count.

We're no longer sharing our WOL posts, but I'll try to get it up to show. I realize some of this is apples to oranges given a whole host of factors like our kill time vs yours, pre potting and all sorts of other stuff.

Originally Posted by Shha

I can see 23k dmg happening , on a fight like TB boss (which is also considerably shorter, and with most fast kills perfectly timed for DW) . But from it happening to "easily" achieving it (and it being a reoccuring thing), is a pretty large gap.

I would say that consistent damage output is what signifies the better player.

funkyspunk · 01/06/11, 6:44 PM

Originally Posted by Kluian

From what source?

Nature's Bounty proc effect removed and replaced with a new effect - Increases the critical effect chance of your Regrowth spell by 20/40/60%. In addition, when you have Rejuvenation active on three or more targets, the cast time of your Nourish spell is reduced by 10/20/30%.

The only thing I see removed from the notes is the swiftmend CD reduction from HT/Nourish crits.

I checked mmo-champion, as well as the PTR patch notes from the forums.

mmo-champion has both the before and after patch notes (if you scroll down past the first set of notes, u'll see the original form, the one you just pasted).

fangless · 01/06/11, 6:46 PM

I still think nerfing a spell over one fight where the DPS is artificially boosted by the presence of like a dozen adds every 45 seconds or so is a bit drastic.

Cool, we're really good for one fight? Who complains?

Also, side question, when you get individual stacks for the Fury of Angerforge, what do the stacks give you stat-wise?

Thyrial · 01/06/11, 6:54 PM

Originally Posted by fangless

I still think nerfing a spell over one fight where the DPS is artificially boosted by the presence of like a dozen adds every 45 seconds or so is a bit drastic.

Cool, we're really good for one fight? Who complains?

Also, side question, when you get individual stacks for the Fury of Angerforge, what do the stacks give you stat-wise?

The issue is the game isn't balanced JUST around raiding or just around bosses. So it's not just one fight, it's anywhere in the game where AoE plays a part at all.

The individual stacks from Fury of Angerforge do nothing at least according to everything I've seen.

guacamole · 01/06/11, 7:06 PM

Anyone have any idea of the new combat stat weights regarding the new mastery change? Can only guess it will mean some more reforging etc but curious about just how good it's going to be.

Riccod · 01/06/11, 7:42 PM

hi

today i really got confused.
in this guide, its stated that we need 1332 Hitrating (with 2/3 precision) to be at 13% (spellcapped)

as you can see, i have exactly 1332 Hit, but thats 11,09% rather than 13%

whats wrong?
thx in advance

Flaer02 · 01/06/11, 7:45 PM

Originally Posted by Riccod

hi

today i really got confused.
in this guide, its stated that we need 1332 Hitrating (with 2/3 precision) to be at 13% (spellcapped)

as you can see, i have exactly 1332 Hit, but thats 11,09% rather than 13%

whats wrong?
thx in advance

You're looking at melee hit, not spell hit.

fangless · 01/06/11, 8:05 PM

Originally Posted by Thyrial

The issue is the game isn't balanced JUST around raiding or just around bosses. So it's not just one fight, it's anywhere in the game where AoE plays a part at all.

The individual stacks from Fury of Angerforge do nothing at least according to everything I've seen.

Well, ever since HB was changed to 1 rune, and became spammable, it's been the #1 AE spell in the game. Nothing was changed then because there were no AE situations in ICC, minus throwaway trash packs, that and the fact that there are so few Frost spec DKs.

It's no different of a spell now, but because of combatlogs for Magmaw, it gets nerfed. Seems like a kneejerk response, but oh well. All they had to do to tone down the apparently imbalanced damage was reduce the number of adds, and just increase their HP.