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Old 01/14/11, 10:33 AM   #22921
direscream
 
Troll Druid
 
Ner'zhul
Theralion's Mirror - Item - World of Warcraft

Am I wrong or is this trinket's proc potentially worthless, literally, to only Balance druids? As in, what happens if the "proc" occurs right when I leave my current eclipse state and going to the next? Yes, the Int is nice, but thats it??

So I could loose about half, or if not, the full uptime on the proc because of the way our mastery works? I know for sure that almost, if not all, other classes's mastery is always "doing" something all the time even if its minor or a chance to proc something. Our mastery in the other hand, goes useless at certain times.

Yes I know we are getting buffed to our mastery stat, but not re-worked, aka, we still have that "dead zone" which mastery goes to 0% useful after we leave an Eclipse state. Will trinkets like Theralion's Mirror and future BiS trinkets for us in future Tiers be worthless because of our "dead zone"? For those who have it, how has this trinket been treating you?

Kinda sad, such a pretty trinket too...

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Old 01/14/11, 12:02 PM   #22922
Shinjae
Glass Joe
 
Orc Death Knight
 
Lightbringer
Hi all. First time poster long time reader.
If I understand you the right way, what you want to do is the following:
Run into Fight in UP, burst out all your runes and then switch back to FP. Right? So in fact, you're trading the 15% more DPS and increased RP gain against a 33% faster GCD. Sounds good so far. BUT: switching presence takes a GCD!
Assuming it takes you 4 GCD's to get rid of all your runes, it will take you 4 seconds in UP and 6 Seconds in FP (BS, BS, OB, OB) plus the 1.5 Seconds to get back to FP, wich results in only beeing .5 seconds faster. So you get 12% speed increase and loose 15% Dmg plus some RP. In addition, you loose all your RP by switching presence.

Not a good trade at all
I fully agree With Khamael on this last statement. Granted the runic power you lose really wouldn't be much because you exhausted most of your runic power at the end I would think it would come down to not only that 15% loss in dmg but possibly more depending on how fast your fingers are/timing. In a perfect world it might be a small but really unsubstantial gain in DPS but I do not have access to any sims on my work computer. We unfortunately have the human error aspect that we have to contend with so even if it comes out as higher DPS on a sim I do not think many, if anyone would be able to have the timing needed to be able to do this live. Staying in frost presence while DW'ing negates the chance for error.

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Old 01/14/11, 12:42 PM   #22923
Powerslave
Von Kaiser
 
Powerslave's Avatar
 
Orc Shaman
 
Twilight's Hammer (EU)
Originally Posted by Latcho View Post
This would be nice to know if someone hast tryed them. Yesterday i got them [Claws of Agony][Claws of Torment],
but im using a TG spec right now with [Akirus the Worm-Breaker] (with Landslide) + [Foe Reaper] (with Hurricane).
Considering that on my server the Maelstorm Crystals are really expensive (1200 -1500 g) its not cheap to enchant them twice with landslide just to try them out. Personally i like TG better(and next week ill probably get another epic 2-hander anyways) but if the set bonus(1000 haste) is so good i would be considering to spec SMF.
Considering raging blow and mastery are both getting buffed and HS is getting nerfed,I think it's reasonable to point out that SMF is going to be terrible next patch unless something extreme happens to the patchnotes the following weeks.

Authoritah!

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Old 01/14/11, 12:50 PM   #22924
Runtime
Piston Honda
 
Troll Warrior
 
Hyjal
So i decided to head over to the PTR today and ran a few ~5 million damage runs on the dummy.



As you can see heroic strike damage is very low compared to my other abilities and bloodthirst and raging blow has overtaken my melee damage. Is it possible that due to these changes once we have enough hit to maintain a consistent rotation that crit would be more valuable?

I decided to try it out but i didnt have alot of hit to convert to crit. Before i was at about 19% hit and 15.5% crit and after i was at 15% hit and 18% crit.




On average i felt i was doing more damage with the extra crit. I usually heroic strike when i have 60+ rage but with less hit it seemed better to wait till i had about 70 rage before i would heroic strike.

It does seem that not all the proposed changes for 4.0.6 are on the PTR. Recklessness and Inner Rage have not changed at all so the slight reversion of the Heroic Strike nerf might not be implemented as well..

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Old 01/14/11, 1:11 PM   #22925
Obstinate
 
Undead Rogue
 
The Maelstrom (EU)
Dk avoidance

Hey guys, Im a Blood DK and my friends recommended me to stack avoidance (especially parry). They told me to get 40% avoidance but that just seems impossible since parry and dodge have diminishing returns now. I'm at 27.5% avoidance and 153k HP in blood presence. Anyone knows what a good idea is to cap your avoidance at? Or just keep stacking it as long as bosses don't 3shot you? Thanks in advance

Ill link my armory:
Obstinate @ Turalyon - Game - World of Warcraft

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Old 01/14/11, 1:12 PM   #22926
gilamon004
 
Night Elf Hunter
 
Steamwheedle Cartel (EU)
What about Agility VS. Crit gems / enchanting on Survival Hunters? I'm gemming and enchanting Crit mostly...and i find myself pretty good...

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Old 01/14/11, 1:17 PM   #22927
mako
Don Flamenco
 
mako's Avatar
 
Blood Elf Hunter
 
<Bad>
Dragonmaw
Agility is worth at least 3x more than crit, mastery and (usually) haste per femaledwarf. There's no reason to gem straight crit ever, and the wrath agi enchants currently outclass the cata crit ones.

It's called Bloodlust, not Heroism. What kind of pansy name is Heroism, anyway?
<Bad> Dragonmaw US
www.damnwesuck.com
12/13 [25] Heroic - Recruiting exceptional players.

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Old 01/14/11, 1:31 PM   #22928
Meygaera
Von Kaiser
 
Meygaera's Avatar
 
Human Death Knight
 
Dalaran
I think you guys are trying to debunk the presence switching with the wrong approach. DW frost uses FP because it doesn't have enough globals to fill in UP. So if you were to start in UP there would come a time where you would be below 32 RP and have all runes on CD. This is when you would want to change to FP; at the worst you would lose up to 31 RP. You would not want to change to FP simply after 4 globals, you still the runic power resource available for FS. Depending on RNG you can acquire enough globals for UP for much longer than 4 seconds. I don't have the math with me but you can't compare 4 seconds + 1 to 6 seconds. It would be more like 30 seconds + 1 to 45 seconds.

This idea came to me a long time ago in the 4.0 patch in WotLK and I sort of gave up on it. It seemed that when I did transition from UP to FP, since I was left with no resources while leaving UP, and continuing DPS in FP seemed utterly slow and sluggish. I think UP just sucks up too many resources for DW frost, but adding ERW to mix could help, but to whether use ERW while still in UP or to use it after the switch to FP in order to jump start your FP rotation, I really don't know which is better.

[edit] I'm pretty sure the GCD for switching presences is actually 1 second, so this would favor starting in UP slightly more than what you thought before, since you only lose 1 second for switching presences.

Last edited by Meygaera : 01/14/11 at 4:57 PM.

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Old 01/14/11, 1:37 PM   #22929
Deathwing
Bald Bull
 
Deathwing's Avatar
 
Orc Warrior
 
Black Dragonflight
What slight reversion to heroic strike?

Also, would you mind doing a similar test(doesn't have to be 4) on live, so we can get a comparative dps increase? I'm guessing ~10% for TG Fury, would love to see if I'm right. It also looks like 3/3 DW will be better than 3/3 incite. Heck, if there were more AE important encounters, I might even get B&T.

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Old 01/14/11, 1:40 PM   #22930
Mathos
Glass Joe
 
Dwarf Paladin
 
Kil'Jaeden
There seems to be a bug with Conviction or there's an error in the tooltip.
Paladin talent - NOT working as intented (Conviction) - Forums - World of Warcraft

People are reporting that the 9% healing buff from Conviction is only being applied to our self heals. If that is working as intended then it would significantly decrease the value of the talent. Probably warranting a move of the 3 talent points to EG, BL, or IJ depending on your current spec.

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Old 01/14/11, 1:49 PM   #22931
ovlaM
Glass Joe
 
Goblin Death Knight
 
Cho'gall
Originally Posted by Meygaera View Post
I think you guys are trying to debunk the presence switching with the wrong approach. DW frost uses FP because it doesn't have enough globals to fill in UP. So if you were to start in UP there would come a time where you would be below 32 RP and have all runes on CD. This is when you would want to change to FP; at the worst you would lose up to 31 RP. You would not want to change to FP simply after 4 globals, you still the runic power resource available for FS. Depending on RNG you can acquire enough globals for UP for much longer than 4 seconds. I don't have the math with me but you can't compare 4 seconds + 1.5 to 6 seconds. It would be more like 30 seconds + 1.5 to 45 seconds.
This is far more in line with the results I'm getting. Also, the GCD for presences seems to be 1 second.

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Old 01/14/11, 1:53 PM   #22932
Ronson
Glass Joe
 
Undead Rogue
 
Ravenholdt
Question about reforging:

Will I really see that big of a net increase if I am reforging everything into Mastery post spell-hit cap? Currently, I've just been leaving expertise and haste alone, only reforging all crit into mastery (and some hit to spell cap). Does it really make all that much of a difference, considering its still useful to swing faster and get as close to expertise capped as possible?

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Old 01/14/11, 1:58 PM   #22933
Archaene
Glass Joe
 
Worgen Death Knight
 
Stormrage
The only reason for using Plague Strike / Blood Plague is for additional threat. But if you are having threat as a DK Tank, you are doing it wrong. Other than Frost Fever / BB, you should only be using DS / HS / RS.

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Old 01/14/11, 1:58 PM   #22934
Hèadbusta
Banned
 
Orc Death Knight
 
Dark Iron
Originally Posted by Khamael View Post
If I understand you the right way, what you want to do is the following:
Run into Fight in UP, burst out all your runes and then switch back to FP. Right? So in fact, you're trading the 15% more DPS and increased RP gain against a 33% faster GCD. Sounds good so far. BUT: switching presence takes a GCD!
Assuming it takes you 4 GCD's to get rid of all your runes, it will take you 4 seconds in UP and 6 Seconds in FP (BS, BS, OB, OB) plus the 1.5 Seconds to get back to FP, wich results in only beeing .5 seconds faster. So you get 12% speed increase and loose 15% Dmg plus some RP. In addition, you loose all your RP by switching presence.

Not a good trade at all
What ur failing to realize is the reason u would start off with UP is cuz of the TON more KM procs, which would be nice considering we blowing our burst right away, more crits during burst = good. You would stay in UP depending on ur frost strike reactivation rune procs, ive had such good procs once i was in UP for 30secs because i was getting oblits back to back, once u reach 0 RP + deadzone (no runes up at all) is when u would switch to frost. And yes, GCD is 1sec (Blizz made GCD fall down to 1sec min. with haste)

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Old 01/14/11, 2:12 PM   #22935
Jaron
Von Kaiser
 
Gnome Rogue
 
Doomhammer
The reason most people come here is to min-max to get the best out of their character, so if that is your interest... than yes, I would reforge. If you have 300 expertise and 700 haste on your gear, you would be around 1049 EP for those stats. If you reforge 40% of those stats over to mastery, you are looking at 1117 EP for a net gain of 68 EP - which can be between 50-70 dps increase.

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