Thread of Ultimate Stupidity - Page 1926

ca� ge · 01/16/12, 1:43 PM

Hey everyone im just wondering what seems to be better becasue i have seen some people with one H hand of morchok and a souldrinker but some with both HoM so im wondering which is best?

TechMeh · 01/16/12, 1:44 PM

Hello,

I'm a level 53 Warlock Afflict/Demo dual spec. I'm wondering what spell rotation I should best use? I'm currently following this guide's rotation, However being at 53 I have not gained some of the spells yet listed. Would it be best to continue using what I can of this spell rotation?

Zakath · 01/16/12, 4:30 PM

Question about SMF vs TG. I currently have 2 Hand of Morchok 397. I also won a Gurthalak 384. Now, I've been wondering if I should switch to TG when a 397 2H drop in our raid. I'm the only melee dps in our roster and I could take test it out, but if it's not worth it, I'd prefer letting one of our tanks take it for off-spec or pvp.

TLDR:
2x 397 HoM vs 384 Gurthalak / 397 Mace, should I stick with my SMF weapons until I get 403 Gurth ?

tjl1982 · 01/16/12, 7:31 PM

Originally Posted by Zakath

Question about SMF vs TG. I currently have 2 Hand of Morchok 397. I also won a Gurthalak 384. Now, I've been wondering if I should switch to TG when a 397 2H drop in our raid. I'm the only melee dps in our roster and I could take test it out, but if it's not worth it, I'd prefer letting one of our tanks take it for off-spec or pvp.

TLDR:
2x 397 HoM vs 384 Gurthalak / 397 Mace, should I stick with my SMF weapons until I get 403 Gurth ?

Looking at your gear, I'd probably go SMF for the more consistent DPS and the fact that you'll need less hit as SMF vs TG in order not to be rage starved. Gurthalak can provide great DPS if RNG is in your favor, but you may find yourself rage starved at times w/ sub 15% hit. TG has been pretty equal to SMF this patch, so a lot will depend on what is available to you.

palalight · 01/17/12, 3:43 AM

Hello guys, from last "fix" we had i`m alaways falling to bottom of the recount. Now ive spend last days trying to reforge all the items to haste then crit then back to mastery but nothing change, the diference between me as pala ret and others mdps is huge.
I want to ask if is worth to play with 2 t12h and 2 t13 in boss fights like morchok hagara warmaster, it will be any chance to have some gain in dmg and dps playing like this?
Im preaty sure that the dps i have at ultraxion zonozz will rise when i will have the trinket from spine, the dmg from yorshaj spine and madness will be higher aswell when i will have the BFL trinket.
I dont have the trinket from spine and i will be probably the last to get, i dont have BfL ...
On world of logs we have the logs from last 2 weeks raids any help will be great.

Pyryte · 01/17/12, 9:25 AM

Originally Posted by Hoipolloi

Whackacrow,

To clarify your rotation it's better to see it as a priority list which is always as follow:

1) Flame Orb
2) Living Bomb
3) Pyroblast from proc
4) Fireball

Use combustion with reasonable ignites (this depends on your toon and gear) and scorch while moving.

AOE is situational. The best aoe is spreading combustion so if you need to do aoe damage fast try to plan for this. After that it will depend on number of targets. In general what I do is if there are more than 5 targets I Flame blast then flamestrike spam. This will eat mana so you must also take that into consideration. If there are 4 or less targets I keep living bomb up on each and keep a regular rotation spreading all ignites with impact procs. My gear has me at about 32K single target dps and by spreading ignites I will do around 40K dps; spreading combustion can bring this number up to 70K for the duration and Blast wave/flamestrike on multiple targets is about 50K. (yoshr adds for example)

With your gear you should be doing closer to 30k dps so you're biggest problem is likely just not enough casting. To increase your dps ask yourself if there was any possible way you could've gotten more casts off in an encounter. Since we can cast while moving, this means that if you're not on GCD or casting at any time during the fight; there is room for improvement. We can have 100% active times; moving is no excuse for us to not be dpsing.

Hope this helps.

It's also good to note that any Fire mage should start off with Scorch, unless you have a demo/destro warlock or similar class that gives the 5% crit debuff.

However, I don't really agree with the AoE dps given above. Spamming flamestrike is useless, you only want to put another flame strike down after your previous one has faded. If you're ever dealing with AoE, your best bet is to impact whichever dots you have on your main dps target. Obviously if you can impact a combustion that will give you the biggest dps, but if you dont have combustion up, impacting ignite/LB/Pyro will still deal a considerable amount of damage.

When the adds start coming in, ie. yorsahj black blood adds start spawning, try to get the best ignite you can, and keep your other dots up, hopefully you get an impact proc to just impact everything off to the adds. Once they are grouped up hit everything with a blastwave for blastwave damage + flamestike (assuming you're specced into it). If you didn't have an impact proc prior, blastwave is also a great way to fish for an impact proc. If blastwave still leaves you with no impact proc, line up a dragon's breath to hit everything and hopefully that will give you an impact proc. If you're still left without an impact proc at this point, if the adds still have a decent amount of health, you're left with 2 options. You can either refresh your dots via single target dps on your main target, and blast wave again once it comes off cooldown, or you can arcane explosion spam to fish for an impact proc then refresh your dots and impact them off.

Also, as an offtopic question, I've seen contradicting reports as to whether it's better to refresh living bomb prior to it falling off, or to let it fall off and get the explosion damage. I've also heard from some people that even if you refresh it, the explosion will still happen when it would have fallen off, but after testing it on the dummy, I couldn't reproduce this. My gut tells me that if you have multiple mobs it's better to let it fall off and explode then refresh it, vs. single target it would be better to refresh it.

It's also worth mentioning that there are many times in a single dps priority where it falls off anyway, right at the end of a fireball cast, etc. and then is refreshed upon GCD cooldown. Does anyone have any more insight into this?

Verado · 01/17/12, 9:26 AM

Just wanted to thank everyone involved with the shadowcraft site and the dps engine for the great work and effort you've put into it.

Solva · 01/17/12, 9:34 AM

I haven't had the chance to get Gurthalak yet so I can't test it myself in a dummy.

Therefore the question is, would we notice a significant increase in procs from Gurthalak, as arms, if we reforge and gem for mastery, considering mastery in arms provides an extra attack.

Keep in mind that Gurthalak proc is 2% and I noticed with napkin maths that if I reforged and gemmed mastery I would gain an approximately 25% increased chance of an extra attack.

Has anyone theorycrafted about this?
Has anyone tested this?

odyz · 01/17/12, 10:30 AM

Originally Posted by Pyryte

Hagara strat

Are you referring to 25 man? We never stack in the middle in any of our 10 m HM kills on hagara.

Originally Posted by Pyryte

Living bomb

You should never open with scorch unless there is no way to open with pryo.

You should always let living bomb explode, I ran some tests refreshing it with 1-2 seconds left (sorry can't post the log, I'm at work) and there was never the "hidden explosion" that you are referring to. If someone wants to run more tests and throw them up please do.

So you would never want to refresh living bomb in any situation, aoe or single target. Especially in aoe where the explosion can trigger impact.

Pyryte · 01/17/12, 11:06 AM

Thats the same results I was getting too, it seems it's always better to let it fall off. Usually it falls off mid fireball cast and you can just refresh it afterwards.

And yes I was referring to 25man, I haven't done any 10man attempts. So I guess that is just a discrepancy between 10 and 25.

tschaka · 01/17/12, 11:08 AM

i am looking for a Arms trinket ranking including all DS Trinkets, the VP Trinket, HC Aparatus and HC/ NHC Vessel

♦ nathanbp · 01/17/12, 11:29 AM

Originally Posted by odyz

Are you referring to 25 man? We never stack in the middle in any of our 10 m HM kills on hagara.

You should never open with scorch unless there is no way to open with pryo.

We stack in the middle for ice phases on 10 man heroic Hagara. Either way can work, but stacking in the middle seemed easier for us.

So you prepot in advance and then hardcast pyro? Are you sure that's better than prepotting a couple seconds later and opening with scorch? Pyro does do a lot of damage, but you're also wasting a couple seconds of your potion that way.

Pyryte · 01/17/12, 12:46 PM

Originally Posted by nathanbp

We stack in the middle for ice phases on 10 man heroic Hagara. Either way can work, but stacking in the middle seemed easier for us.

So you prepot in advance and then hardcast pyro? Are you sure that's better than prepotting a couple seconds later and opening with scorch? Pyro does do a lot of damage, but you're also wasting a couple seconds of your potion that way.

I generally open up with a flame orb, then potion while that's traveling in and hit a quick Scorch before getting on with my rotation. Potioning before a pyroblast wouldn't be ideal because once you hit that potion, the fight is essentially starting for you. If there was a way to hardcast Pyro then hit your potion right after it finishes cast before it puts you into combat, that would be ideal. However I'm not certain finishing the cast of pyro wouldn't put you into combat immediately, and even if it didnt, pulling that off would take some serious coordination with your tank. We all know how reliable those 5..4..3..2..1 countdowns are...

tjl1982 · 01/17/12, 12:52 PM

Originally Posted by Grimraven

But since fury is only better than arms on heroic spine, and since you need to dump all the expertise you can, since tendon does not have parry/dodge table, Morchok bracers are better.

Isn't this the Fury 4.3 BiS thread?

testthewest · 01/17/12, 1:35 PM

Originally Posted by Pyryte

I generally open up with a flame orb, then potion while that's traveling in and hit a quick Scorch before getting on with my rotation. Potioning before a pyroblast wouldn't be ideal because once you hit that potion, the fight is essentially starting for you. If there was a way to hardcast Pyro then hit your potion right after it finishes cast before it puts you into combat, that would be ideal. However I'm not certain finishing the cast of pyro wouldn't put you into combat immediately, and even if it didnt, pulling that off would take some serious coordination with your tank. We all know how reliable those 5..4..3..2..1 countdowns are...

While it's true your fight starts with your pre-pot, this also means your fight starts 1,5sec earlier than that of the scorching player (or even more due to pyro travel time).
So basically if there is a 5 sec countdown timer, you are wasting 2 sec (Flame Orb at 3sec pre-pull, Scorch at 1,5 sec pre-pull), while a Pyro-start doesn't.