Thread of Ultimate Stupidity - Page 1927

♦ nathanbp · 01/17/12, 1:45 PM

Originally Posted by testthewest

While it's true your fight starts with your pre-pot, this also means your fight starts 1,5sec earlier than that of the scorching player (or even more due to pyro travel time).
So basically if there is a 5 sec countdown timer, you are wasting 2 sec (Flame Orb at 3sec pre-pull, Scorch at 1,5 sec pre-pull), while a Pyro-start doesn't.

But a ~3 second hard cast Pyroblast is not an effective use of time (once in combat), so you could equally say that 2 seconds of that cast time is wasted.

tjl1982 · 01/17/12, 2:00 PM

Originally Posted by Solva

I haven't had the chance to get Gurthalak yet so I can't test it myself in a dummy.

Therefore the question is, would we notice a significant increase in procs from Gurthalak, as arms, if we reforge and gem for mastery, considering mastery in arms provides an extra attack.

Keep in mind that Gurthalak proc is 2% and I noticed with napkin maths that if I reforged and gemmed mastery I would gain an approximately 25% increased chance of an extra attack.

Has anyone theorycrafted about this?
Has anyone tested this?

The extra Opportunity Strikes/Procs would have to outweigh the lost Crit damage/Deep wounds for this to be viable. Looking at some logs, most Opportunity Strikes come out to be less than 100 total done on HM Ultraxion, so you would get 20-25 more strikes in w/ a 2% chance of proccing Gurthalak off those strikes, but losing out on crit and deep wounds. Doesn't seem viable, but I haven't simmed it.

Pyryte · 01/17/12, 2:18 PM

Originally Posted by testthewest

While it's true your fight starts with your pre-pot, this also means your fight starts 1,5sec earlier than that of the scorching player (or even more due to pyro travel time).
So basically if there is a 5 sec countdown timer, you are wasting 2 sec (Flame Orb at 3sec pre-pull, Scorch at 1,5 sec pre-pull), while a Pyro-start doesn't.

You aren't wasting any time during the countdown. The fight starts for you once you prepot. If you prepot before that hard-casted pyroblast, the fight has started for you and you're using a hardcast pyroblast in your rotation, which isn't advisable. If you flame-orb then prepot and scorch, you get an extra 1.5 seconds of prepot essentially, because it will last further into the fight.

The point of pre-potting is to do it prepull so you get to use it again, by hardcasting pyroblast you're wasting 2 seconds of the bonus intellect.

It comes down to whether losing out on 2 seconds of prepotting, and having to cast flame-orb once in combat is more of a dps loss than the gain of a pyroblast vs a scorch. There would be some RNG inherent in this calculation, depending on if the pyro crit, if you proc ignite, etc.

There definitely are times where I would hardcast a pyro to start a phase, however. For instance, on the lightning phase on Hagara, if you can determine when the feedback phase will start, you can start casting pyroblast 2 seconds-ish earlier so it lands as the phase starts.

odyz · 01/17/12, 2:18 PM

As flame orb is modified by temporary buffs as well and it being our highest dpe spell, I would think it would be best to save orb until all of your procs/stacks and potions are rolling. c/d?

As to if the 2 seconds extra cast of pryo instead of scorch are essentially 'wasted', I'll look into that more.

Pyryte · 01/17/12, 2:20 PM

Originally Posted by odyz

As flame orb is modified by temporary buffs as well and it being our highest dpe spell, I would think it would be best to save orb until all of your procs/stacks and potions are rolling. c/d?

As to if the 2 seconds extra cast of pryo instead of scorch are essentially 'wasted', I'll look into that more.

This is true, so it may be a better bet to prepot, then flame orb/scorch (or hard cast pyro if that's what you're going with).

Pyryte · 01/17/12, 2:23 PM

Originally Posted by nathanbp

But a ~3 second hard cast Pyroblast is not an effective use of time (once in combat), so you could equally say that 2 seconds of that cast time is wasted.

This is true, but to be honest, a scorch isn't an effective use of time while in combat either, unless you have to move or conserve mana.

♦ nathanbp · 01/17/12, 2:56 PM

Originally Posted by Pyryte

This is true, but to be honest, a scorch isn't an effective use of time while in combat either, unless you have to move or conserve mana.

If you're responsible for maintaining the 5% crit debuff, and it isn't on the boss (and you don't have a Hot Streak proc) then scorch is the best spell to cast. If you're grouped with a warlock or another fire mage who maintains the debuff, then you should open with something else.

Kisko · 01/17/12, 4:26 PM

Correct weapon priorities were posted on MMO-C next day after fix. Good to know you catched up Exemplar.

Two weeks ago you was swearing by Mars and women that weapon priorities didn't changed. Even though basic logic and different data, including real logs, indicated that they did.

Not surprisingly, it was just another bug in spreadsheet formulas. Regardless, amount of people who consider that spreadsheet a valuable source of information continues to diminish.

Pyryte · 01/17/12, 5:41 PM

Originally Posted by nathanbp

If you're responsible for maintaining the 5% crit debuff, and it isn't on the boss (and you don't have a Hot Streak proc) then scorch is the best spell to cast. If you're grouped with a warlock or another fire mage who maintains the debuff, then you should open with something else.

Well I agree with this to a certain extent. Once you're in combat though, it's pretty unlikely you'll go 5 minutes without getting a hotstreak proc. As for the start of the fight, that's up to your guild as to who is supposed to provide the crit debuff on the opening of the boss. If you have another mage or a warlock opening with scorch or shadowbolt/incinerate, it's probably best to just open with pre-pot, flame orb, living bomb, fireball.

PFCchen · 01/17/12, 5:50 PM

during execute phase(25% and under), i have been doing as the guide suggested "Once the boss reaches 25% HP, begin to channel Drain Soul while continuing to cast Haunt on CD and refresh Bane of Doom when required. Drain Soul will automatically refresh Unstable Affliction and Corruption when it ticks, so you should not need to worry about this."

I have been looking at my logs carefully, But i don't see a obvious DPS increase from that. my dps usually at the top before execute phase, when the boss die, i always fall behind the arms warrior and fire mage in my raid group
Is there a trick i am missing or getting ahead by warrior and fire mage during execute phase is normal?

parano · 01/17/12, 7:05 PM

are Bracers of Destructive Strength BiS for fury?

Influxreptile · 01/17/12, 7:30 PM

Originally Posted by parano

are Bracers of Destructive Strength BiS for fury?

Yes they are according to simcraft. It seems logical though as they have more strenght and expertise is a whole lot better than mastery.

Demonfire · 01/18/12, 2:38 AM

Do you have a castbar that shows you the ticks of your Drain Soul? When channeling Drain Soul and you have to cast something else like Haunt or Bane of Doom, you should always cancel Drain Soul exactly after it ticks the next time, as to not waste casting time.
Maybe your fire mage and arms warrior time their big cooldowns to fall in line with the execute phase? Affliction has a strong execute phase, but no really strong cooldowns.

ertan · 01/18/12, 3:21 AM

hello all how are you

my Roatation is pyroblast- livingbomb -flameorb -miror image- fireball ( all the time ) and when the hot streak happens ı press pyroblast again and when the all dots on the target ı press combustion

yesterday ı test my dps with 88 dummy at the start ı did 32-33 k dps and ı didnt belive my eyes

) but -racently dps drops 22 k is there a way that ı can do dps as 30 k continiusly . please advise
please check my gear Tinywizz @ Terokkar - Game - World of Warcraft

regards

Treen · 01/18/12, 4:11 AM

Originally Posted by Ronninn

Fearmemortals, just a heads up, but this information is incorrect. You absolutely cannot use Inner Rage while Deadly Calm is active as using one of these 2 abilities will lock you out of using the other ability. The same holds true for using Recklessness and Deadly Calm together, you just can't use them together.

My advise is to use Inner Rage with Recklessness as you can use those 2 abilities together, and in fights like Ultraxion with all the incoming damage when the boss is below 20% health, you can actually get good use out of Heroic Strike, so making them only cost 20 rage instead of 30 is a huge benefit.

I would also recommend using Inner Rage on cooldown when your above 75 rage and you would make the decision to use a Heroic Strike, so long as Deadly Calm is not currently being used. Even 1 HS with IR active saves you 10 rage that you can use on something else, so even though it doesn't benefit Arms as much as it benefits Fury, it can still be a bit of a rage saver.

Finally I would also suggest a great time to use IR, is right after DC is finished and you are rage capped. This way you can burn off rage with HS, and you might get 1 or possibly even 2 more HS's then you would have without IR.

you sayd exactly same think as i did.. I never told u can usse DS with RC or IR.. but one think is incorrect.. Use hs in execute phase? NEVER! there's alway better to use MS for refresh rend, when u havent CS up, cus there's still chance to 4-piece proc.. when u have cs up, use JUST execute on every gcd, when uve more then 30rage and ms use just right before the rend is ending. When u havent cs up use ms on cd.

hope it was helpfull for you..