Thread of Ultimate Stupidity - Page 644

jonish · 11/14/09, 6:37 PM

Originally Posted by Pasch

Garbage, bullshit, rubbish. SW:P haste stacking was rarely possible to keep running and even if you could keep it running for an entire fight it was a smaller gain than hasted VT and DP. I have no clue how you can't see that - VT is by far our strongest dot and DP is way better than SW: P if an Unholy DK is present.

If you cannot see that keeping a drastically increased SWPain rolling was the reason we were seeing those kinds of potential numbers then I don't know what else to tell you. VT has always done significantly more damage than SWPain, but SWPain maintaining haste amounts was the biggest increase we were getting. That is now gone leaving us with the left overs.

oakpope · 11/14/09, 6:40 PM

With Haste being a much more wanted stat, I was trying to think outside the box for new talents tree for shadow pve and I was thinking of this, just to try and have some fun : a 30/0/41 bizarre thing.

I tried it on a dummy in the ptr, with a premade priest, and I was a little surprised to see that I was doing the same dps than with a classic 13/0/48.

Has someone thought about some same weird talent trees with the 3.3 patch ? Am I wrong to think it could be on par with the classic talent tree ?

jmaldo7076 · 11/14/09, 6:41 PM

Hey, i was jw if what pet would actualy be better for a mm hunter on most fights... Would you guys prefer the 100% uptime of the -5% armor from the wasp... or simply the 100% uptime 320 ap from wolf?. there both feriocity so they both have call of the wild and instatn rez.

Pasch · 11/14/09, 6:42 PM

Originally Posted by jonish

If you cannot see that keeping a drastically increased SWPain rolling was the reason we were seeing those kinds of potential numbers then I don't know what else to tell you. VT has always done significantly more damage than SWPain, but SWPain maintaining haste amounts was the biggest increase we were getting. That is now gone leaving us with the left overs.

Edited my post right after posting, sorry. The difference between keeping a normal-hasted SWPain running and a max-hasted SWPain rolling is not as high as you may think, it's only around 600 dps difference (higher if you're a Troll and engineer) if you can manage to keep it with running Heroism/Potion/Black Magic for an ENTIRE FIGHT which is only going to happen in a dream world.

bule · 11/14/09, 6:49 PM

The wasp would most likey be wasted because if you have a warr/rogue then you already have an armor reduction debuff. I would go with the wolf for the AP.

jonish · 11/14/09, 6:53 PM

Originally Posted by Pasch

Edited my post right after posting, sorry. The difference between keeping a normal-hasted SWPain running and a max-hasted SWPain rolling is not as high as you may think, it's only around 600 dps difference (higher if you're a Troll and engineer) if you can manage to keep it with running Heroism/Potion/Black Magic for an ENTIRE FIGHT which is only going to happen in a dream world.

I'll agree with you there , but things like PI , glove tinker , etc have relatively short cooldowns and can be stacked again to increase the SWPain via a hard refresh of the spell. The haste stacking was putting SWPain at or above the damage output of VT with haste stacking. Going from live where SWPain is the lowest output spell we have to the highest output DoT on PTR via haste stacking was a drastic increase. That is gone now. There has to be a compensation somewhere else to give the increase back. The increase we will be getting from the VT and DP haste change is nothing compared to what we truly need , and I would much prefere not waiting until Cataclysm or later(more than likely later) to get these changes.

Pasch · 11/14/09, 7:03 PM

Originally Posted by jonish

I'll agree with you there , but things like PI , glove tinker , etc have relatively short cooldowns and can be stacked again to increase the SWPain via a hard refresh of the spell. The haste stacking was putting SWPain at or above the damage output of VT with haste stacking. Going from live where SWPain is the lowest output spell we have to the highest output DoT on PTR via haste stacking was a drastic increase. That is gone now. There has to be a compensation somewhere else to give the increase back. The increase we will be getting from the VT and DP haste change is nothing compared to what we truly need , and I would much prefere not waiting until Cataclysm or later(more than likely later) to get these changes.

In my opinions it's way, way too much hassle for such a small benefit not to mention you will have to wait for cooldowns to line up to be able to do what you describe, losing additional DPS in the meantime plus you need the various crit-debuffs to be present when you want to stack all your haste. You can also only pot once per fight. We will also see quite a boost in multi-target DPS scenarios due to haste on VT.
I would much rather prefer a correctly working hasted SWPain after having seen some of the fights in ICC and would love to see a change to Mind Blast and/or SWDeath to make them more attractive to cast in T10 gear instead of just spamming Mind Flay.

♦ Kurisu · 11/14/09, 7:31 PM

Originally Posted by bule

The wasp would most likey be wasted because if you have a warr/rogue then you already have an armor reduction debuff. I would go with the wolf for the AP.

The wasp provides the minor armor debuff given by druids/warlocks, you're thinking of the worm sunder/acid spit.

Krasher · 11/14/09, 8:28 PM

Originally Posted by Veange

All boss level mobs have ~5% unmitigatable partial spell resistance

Spell penetration - WoWWiki - Your guide to the World of Warcraft

Yeah that's more than I was seeing in any parses where the CoE debuff was not even present, so CoE is definitely a waste of damage dealing spell.

Thank you so much, both of you

The Real Chroi · 11/15/09, 12:05 AM

Maybe I missed it somewhere in the previous 17 pages, but isnt icewqalker as an enchant for boots a bit pointless?
I mean, my hit is too high as it is (339) and I have plenty of crit (51.12%) unbuffed. I have only changed my off-spec to kitty maybe a week ago (Main is resto...dont look me up, you will laugh at my spec) and already have gear that puts me at a lvl where I think the AP would be better than icewalker as an enchant.

Uldaflora · 11/15/09, 12:31 AM

Originally Posted by The Real Chroi

Maybe I missed it somewhere in the previous 17 pages, but isnt icewqalker as an enchant for boots a bit pointless?
I mean, my hit is too high as it is (339) and I have plenty of crit (51.12%) unbuffed. I have only changed my off-spec to kitty maybe a week ago (Main is resto...dont look me up, you will laugh at my spec) and already have gear that puts me at a lvl where I think the AP would be better than icewalker as an enchant.

Agi is better if you are hit capped. But you will probably lose hit if you get better loot, so Icewalker can become later the beter enchant egain.

The Real Chroi · 11/15/09, 12:42 AM

cool. Thanks. I'm guessing that wont be for a while. As I am about 70 over the cap and have almost no chance of getting a token at the moment (Kitty is my OS and still plenty of Guild members who need T9.5 for MS) I will stick with greater assault for now

Teyanna · 11/15/09, 1:08 AM

Ok was under the impression this was a Tanking thread why are we discussing Agi/crit and cat dps. Isnt agi/crit or agi/hate a waste of a socket , Sure Agi provides dodge but at the end of the day considering the ridiculopus configuration on leather peices id be more inclined to think stacking stamina is the only thing to do, Havent found a peice that has any sockte bonus worth sacrifice single straight stats for. Am i missing the bigger picture becuase full Stam gemmed with tier 9 and 25toc gear I still barely scrape 38k hp unbuffed. fully raid im close to 50k yet i hear people saaying 50k is minimum for heroic togc

Guess that what comes from not raiding much. Still any reasonable suggestion on Trimuph gear vs tier gear especially for us Leather wearers Getting pretty tired of seeing hitrating and yellow sockets LOL oh and The triumph badge Trinket for dodge worth it or not worth it ...thoughts plz :-)

Teyanna · 11/15/09, 1:40 AM

Oh sorry let me Clarify what i mean by "Ridiculous configuration" MOst leather peices have either red or yellow sockets (referring to melee dps/tanking) they also have a Buttload of hit , Currenty im sitting at almost 400hit WTF!!! and think i may have 1 socket bonus as Ive gemmed for Stam I sit at about 43% crit as bear so thats more than enough to get procs on Savage defense considering That with the new Skill that alows Ticks of lacerate to crit Its pretty much always up and with The greatness card and mongoose proc almost always up Agi and Crit gems = a huge waste of time for Tanks at any given time my agi sits at 1700 and I was under the impression that the SOFT cap for crity was 55% so gemming for crit as bear IMO is a huge waste of stam.

Question: In BC the tier gear made sense in WOTLK it only half makes sense it seems like they made 90% of leather gear for rogues and as an after though said Meh it should be ok for Druids as well.

Question: Defense has been pretty much made redundant for Bear (givin that you agi is at least moderate) how does one go about choosing a trinket when 95% are made for the broad tank rather than specific tank classes I mean Caster dps and healers get differnt trinkets , Ranged dps and melee dps both benefit from the trinkets yet Tanks all differ slightly with excepotion to pallys and prot warrior who both use shields. Why hasnt blizzard considered makiing tanking trinkets that Cater for Feral druids maybe slightly selfish but Cant help thinking they feel we have enough already.

But I want more.

Feel free to look me up on armory and poke fun at my Origin of nightmares

cant seem to get a decent run on toc 25 and when we do it bugs with fizzle on fecking holiday

Trivsel · 11/15/09, 2:45 AM

My current gear setup is a bit badly weighted between haste and crit i have 24,74% crit and 421 (502 with stone) haste unbuffed. And i have 2943 sp with fel armor. So I have pretty much sp and to little haste and crit is unecessarily high i think.
So my question is:
Should i gem some haste instead of spell power? Will that increase my dps?