After a month of research and writing, I have my ideas for a guild down on paper. I've got some time to kill while I contact friends to post their recommendations of me here, so I thought I'd ask for a final sanity check and some specific feedback.*

First, regarding the recommendation thread, am I correct in believing that positive reviews of a half dozen rank 14s is significant? If you read their posts, do you feel that I have established some level of PvP credibility? If I don't, will any number of people posting on my behalf do so and, if yes, how many? How many people do I need to get to post to eliminate any reasonable doubt that this is a fraud, that these are all really my alts? My goal is to establish PvP credibility so I can create interest among talented PvPers off server; do you think this is a step in that direction?

You can find my "What this guild is about" thread here. If this is the only thread someone reads, does it contain the appropriate information? Is it too long? Does it communicate a clear idea? Is it sexy and/or exciting?

I've described my position on looting here. It is a sum-zero/loot-council hybrid. Do I explain it clearly? Taking into account these are all PvPers and we'll be PvEing only to supplement our PvP activities, does this system make sense? Do you think it will work? How would you change it?

These are the guild's values. Have you ever seen a PG-13 expectation for guild chat and Ventrillo channels? Does it come across as a selling point? Does it come across as overly prudish? Are there any other values that I other guilds have in their charters that I might want to consider including in mine?

My game plan is here. It has turned out to be the most visited thread. Is it clear? Is it insightful? Is it logical? Are there any sections I should expand upon?

My completely untested thoughts on Arena 5x5 Teams are here. I assert that Arena 5x5 teams are the most intimate relationship in the game due to their duration of three months and the teamwork and dependency required. Is that a reasonable conclusion? I then go on to state the expectation that guild members will PvP together in guild designated teams; by taking the choice away of whom they team with, I'm having them treat it as work, having them put aside their egos and having them get along. Does this strike you as genius or idiocy? Am I right in thinking that drama could ensue if we free-for-all the formation of 5x5 teams? Is this likely to end up causing more drama? Do you see this as any different than the fact you can't choose who you do a 40-man raid in a PvE guild?

This is the thread on my recruiting philosophy. Does it ramble too much? Does it communicate the qualities of the type of person I'm looking for? Does it strike you that I have low standards in so far as I'm willing to accept people regardless of gear, level or faction? Does it strike you as overly high standards or unrealistic that I expect people to have read through all these threads? Am I correct in concluding that anyone who applies now, while I have nothing but lofty ideas and people saying good things about me have a) the ability to delay gratification, b) not loot whores, c) serious about building this guild with me if they do in fact transfer in from another server or roll a new character?

I created a thread on the issues other guilds have experienced and how this guild will attempt to avoid the same problems. Do any of the three items I list resonate with your experiences? I ask that as a proxy for whether or not it will resonate with others.

Stepping back to the larger perspective, does my idea of a PvP Arena guild make sense to you? Does making such a guild use the same sort of logic that supports the rise of PvE guilds forming to do raid level instances? Do I manage to make it clear how this guild will differ from other guilds with regards to its focus?

Any feedback people would like to provide would be welcome.

*Feel free to reply on my forums; just be aware that people have reported problems viewing the forums after registering. Until I can track down exactly why that is, just reply as a guest.

For some reason your second link points to this RFC:

http://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc1738.txt

I like the humor in it :) Also it's obvious that you screwed up the link badly when looking at it.

I inserted an extra "url=" into the link. Thank you for pointing that out; I've corrected it.

One point, more with the wording than the actual principle:

The only reason to 'game' the system is to improve your own reward from it - i.e. a solely selfish fact (unless you're extremely alturistic and conspire with someone else to game the system solely for their behalf, which would probably be a rather odd turn of events and isn't likely to come up); as such, these sentances don't seem to be consistent.

fwiw I think you will build a lot more comradarei and tighter guild infrastructure if you all decide to reroll on a new server when tbc is released. the process of leveling together is a very bonding experience.

also player locations/connections. imo for both PVE and PVP it really helps if everyone in the guild is running on stable connections, good PCs, and on the same continent and even timezone. I <3 the kiwi/aussie players but because they have inherent transoceanic lag it sometimes can lead to frustrations with frequent DCs, lag, or voice comm issues. and at some future date I have to imagine Blizz hosting aussie servers down under or at least in singapore/etc.

Hey guys looks at my forum, here, here, here, here, and here

Here's your chance to tear my ideas apart Shail. Not everyone can have the privilege of being a member of Elitist Jerks. So I'm thinking about founding a guild and am looking to make it the best guild possible. Other people have found value in the other threads and if you read through what I've written, you'll find I asked those questions for a reason and considered everyone's replies. In a nod to alleviating Kaubel's moderating workload, I've asked people to reply on my forums. If you feel that it is wholly inappropriate, you can report it as such and the moderators can throw it in the Shit Heap and ban or warn me.

In your other post critical of what I'm doing, even you note the value to be found in the threads. You stated your preference that a) they could have been rolled up into one thread and b) they could have been spaced apart more. In regards to a), I kept them all these questions in one thread. In regards to b), I haven't posted a new thread in a week and this will probably be among my last posts on this topic because obviously, I may have other things to do soon.

I have one chance to found a guild well. Considering that it could affect the quality of the recreational time of anywhere between 5 to 100 people, I think it's worth doing well. In my other threads, I've asked people for help and they've provided it. I'm doing it one last time to discuss the specifics of my conclusions.

I respectfully point out, you do have the option of not opening the thread.

Rerolling on a new pvp server is a great idea, for a new guild, I think. The levelling experiences are good, you'll get insight into who has loot issues, do pvp together from the start, get a handle on personalities, get to roll into places together when people are being camped/etc, and, since TBC is a basically full gear reset, you'll lose nothing but the time it takes to level to 60.

Oh, and you'll get more Blood Elves(Or Dranei) and that will be an enormous help in 5v5 and 3v3 and 2v2 because rumor has it AoE Silence, and +to hit are good in pvp.

While rerolling on a new PvP server is certainly a fun experience, there is the downside that new PvP servers have a habit of collapsing down into ghost towns after a few months. I played on Altar of Storms when it opened, crazy fun world PvP with mostly balanced factions - but these days the server is down to ~25% of its release population, according to the people that still play there. Release PvP servers seem like a much better option when you're looking for stability.

I think the probability of retention may be higher now that there are the new races, and the fact that many people have been waiting to start over with them for a long time, but we'll see.

I for one am also starting over on a PVP server with the best PVP team I can make, RL and gaming people I know from multiple servers/games, and have much the same goals as Igni.

so is this an admission that your "best practices" posts have pretty much just been a recruiting tool? heh.

Lol, I thought that as well Elendril.

The only way to establish credibility such that you'll draw people cross-server is to have done something in game. All the theory in the world won't help you get decent xserver apps.

Honestly, this thread (unlike the other ones) doesn't seem to have much value. The answers you're asking about are in the other threads.

I'm not referring to the best practices posts. I'm interested in establishing my credibility through the thread I have on the Bleeding Hollow forums.



You're right. But this is a PvP guild, so I asked several level 14s and lots of other people I've lead in PvP raids to speak on my PvP ability. I don't have any experience leading a guild and that is theory I've been asking for.

Would this be a bad time to mention that all the best players left BH a long time ago and it's pretty much a shadow of its former self? No one's going to want to transfer or roll there, that's for sure.

Best, Post, Ever

On topic, do these X-server start up guild tend to work? There are often posts on real forums recruting people for these super guilds, anyone been in one of these that actually worked?

And I respectfully point out that have the option of closing this bullshit of a thread.

If you want to advertise here, it's going to cost more than your charming personality.

For what it's worth, I've had a few people cite these "Best practices" threads as examples of some of the worst our forum has to offer -- just typing things, for the sake of seeing one's words in print on a screen. Seeing it turn into shameless self-promotion pretty much seals the deal in my eyes.

Yup.

From here on, "Best Practices" theads automatically get heaped.