Durnitol

I did a Karazahn run last night dual wielding in blues and green with 2 60 dps weapons. While I kept up a nice front of damage, I was still last in DPS as expected, and I also died the most execpt for healers. Some of that is inexperience, but a lot of it was due to the fact that I had the least HP of all the rest of the raid, and only some 3k armor.

In light of that, I started hunting around for what the optimum itemization would be for a DW PvE shaman, and I was rather disappointed in my results. At first I used only Mail, and that was pathetic. I basically only upgraded my %hit by 3 and my HP by 1k. My crit and AP were about the same! What now? time to dig into leather.

So far, I have come up with http://ctprofiles.net/2717022. Keep in mind CTProfiles is very buggy, and some stats do not sow up or are totaled incorrectly. I also chose the weapons based on the current theory of closest to 2.0speed without going below gets the most WF attacks, and they are relatively easy to get. I added some stats myself since CTProfiles is buggy.

ALL red sockets are 16 AP
ALL yellow sockets are 4 crit and 4 STR
ALL blue sockets are 6 Stam and 4 STR

The linked profile shows:

1459 AP (base 110 base AP + 214 from base 107 STR + 1125 from all stats added)
185 hit rating (11% I think? CT doesn't show the 20 Netherscale bonus or 9 from gems)
281 crit rating (12.645% crit) 83 AGI (3.32% crit) + ~5% base + 5% talent = ~26% crit
3200 added HP (since tauren get 5%, I won't put any totals)
5348 mana (My figures come up with 870 total added mana from INT, and with Ancestral knowledge, I think CTprofiles is close enough)


Since shamanistic rage basically negates the need for INT or MP5, we don't really need mana enhancement from gear. I think the ideal set of stats on armor would be Crit, STR/AP, STA, %hit, and nothing else. Item budgets are perfectly capable of granting us these statistics. However, a large % of mail items with either AGI, AP, or Crit rating have MP5 on them, apparently designed for hunters. Some of the best gear for us in leather is, of course, designed rogues and feral druids, with set bonuses applying to those classes. I don't mind sharing the weakness of low armor as a price for in your face melee, but I do mind doing less DPS, taking more damage, having less HP, AND drawing more aggro all combined into one package.

Edit: *Mar. 14, 2007*

I took a lot of whining commentary out and put what I think I can finally say is the best possible set of armor an enhancement shaman can get . I focused a lot more on AP, since I was finding my Shamanistic rage to be spiky at best with my current 1100 ap unbuffed hoping that Crusader would proc and such.

Some more theorycrafting:

Imp Battleshout = 381
Imp MOTW = 18 STR = 36 AP
Imp SoE totem = 188 AP
Trueshot Aura = 120 AP
Fel Strength Elixir = 120 AP
Relentless Assault = 360
20 STR food = 40 AP

Blessing of Kings = 10% of STR?
STR is 242 with linked gear + 38 from food and MOTW so 56AP bonus from BoK STR
I don't know if BoK multiplies AP, but let's assume not.

Total AP = 1459+1245 from bonus effects = 2704

Unleashed rage =10% so 2704*1.1 = 2974 controllable AP during raids, or 446 mana per SR proc

Bloodlust Gem use ( 270 AP for 20 sec), add 297 AP
2xCrusader instead of 2x Potency, add 194 AP (160 base + 16 for BoK + 18 for UR)
Hunter pet proc (no idea, but it's more than 0)

Obviously spiking this high will likely get you aggro, but it's fun to theroycraft nonetheless.

Since the previous edit I have acquired a Fel Edged Battleaxe for my MH and holy CRAP does that make a huge difference. Once I get an MH like BBWP or Decapitator, I will put the FEB in the OH and I think I will probably not get any better weapons until Serpentshrine and beyond.

I did a LOT of set comparisons, and found that Desolation is VERY good until you can get the gear posted. Ebon Netherscale is just better, even if by a small %. Cobrascale Hood just tops every other head slot, and if you include gems, Midnight Legguards and Ferocious Swift Kickers top their respective slots, even if you try for set bonuses. I think the main thing lacking from this build is HP, which is somewhat rectified by changing the gloves and legs to stam enchants, and getting a cloak with stam instead of the Vengeance wrap. You can swap out a few gems, too.

 

Skiace

you weren't able to find more STR mail? (or leather for that matter). that setup has only 154 strength while 392 agility. if you could find a way to get AP from strength instead of +AP you'd probably end up sacrificing some crit for AP, and you'd scale a lot better with raid buffs (ie Kings if it's available).

your Health is close to the rogue's already (7300 vs 8000) and his AP is higher because you have a lot of AGI on that setup that the rogue would get AP out of but you get only crit from. also putting +str on the weapons instead of +agi sacrifices crit for AP.

 

panny

You seem to have alot of AGI over STR, which accounts for your relatively low AP. If you must canabalize leather, go for the Feral Druid items, which usually have more str. Personally, though, I hate the idea of wearing leather.

Helm/Leggings of Desolation also seem to be a better combo than your head/legs (esp. with the set bonus/meta gem).

 

Quality

You had poor choice of items on some of your slots.





Finger
+18 Stamina
Requires Level 70
Equip: Improves hit rating by 16.
Equip: Improves critical strike rating by 20.
Equip: Increases attack power by 40.

Legs Leather
268 Armor
+27 Stamina
Durability 90 / 90
Red Socket
Red Socket
Blue Socket
Socket Bonus: +4 Hit Rating
Requires Level 70
Equip: Improves hit rating by 13.
Equip: Improves critical strike rating by 25.
Equip: Increases attack power by 60.

Deso BP + Helm for set bonus.

Bracers of Maliciousness
Binds when picked up
Wrist Leather
139 Armor
+22 Stamina
Durability 40 / 40
Requires Level 70
Equip: Improves critical strike rating by 19.
Equip: Increases attack power by 46.

Felfury Gauntlets
Binds when equipped
Hands Mail
465 Armor
+30 Stamina
Durability 50 / 50
Red Socket
Blue Socket
Socket Bonus: +3 Hit Rating
Requires Level 70
Equip: Improves critical strike rating by 27.
Equip: Increases attack power by 40.

Bladed Shoulderpads of the Merciless
Binds when picked up
Shoulder Leather
239 Armor
+27 Stamina
Durability 70 / 70
Yellow Socket
Yellow Socket
Socket Bonus: +3 Hit Rating
Requires Level 70
Equip: Improves hit rating by 10.
Equip: Improves critical strike rating by 18.
Equip: Increases attack power by 54.

Vengeance Wrap
Binds when equipped
Back
89 Armor
Red Socket
Socket Bonus: +2 Hit Rating
Requires Level 70
Equip: Improves critical strike rating by 23.
Equip: Increases attack power by 52.

 

Gatzu

Some of your item choices are just terrible, generaly agility is a waste of item value for shamans because it only adds to our crit.

My gear isn't what I would consider optimal and I am still able to be competitive on dps. Given a melee friendly fight I can at times top the damage meters.

http://ctprofiles.net/5030027

Above is my current setup. The only realy bad itemization flaw I can see is that the best gloves in the game for my playstyle are level 60 crafted ones.

 

Kirion

that’s not true. Agility is arguably better for shaman than crit raiting. You get 1 crit for 24 agi, but so as some armor, dodge that helps in solo and you get even more from BoK.

42.

 

XI-

Just as a sidenote to this, you realize that when you examine your hp and mana in ctprofiles, it is currently very buggy, and shouldn't be used as a basis for statements unless you're double checking all the math.

 

Gatzu

I don't gear up as a dps spec for dodge and armor, call me crazy.

1 crit is 32 item value while 24 agility is 55.2, so agility is almost twice as bad as crit rating.

 

• Relwin

This is seiously the most half assed enhancement shaman thread I think I've ever seen. I'll post my full gear setup when I get back from work along with the few optimal pieces I'm missing still. That is, if CTprofiles has finally updated the gear it includes.

This bear is cooler than you.

 

Sebudai

You've seriously gone completely overboard on Agility which is not a very good stat for enhancement shaman compared to the other options. Strength, Attack Power, Hit rating, Crit rating and Stamina are the stats you actually care about.

Agility is obviously beneficial to enhancement shaman, but it's expensive compared to just crit rating and you seem to favor it above all else. I think that's a mistake.

A leather piece would have to be significantly better than the mail options of the same slot for me to consider wearing it. I've really had no problem finding acceptable mail pieces. Here's a list:

Cyclone Helm
Cyclone Shoulderplates
Scaled Breastplate of Carnage
Stalker's War Bands
Gloves of Quickening
Girdle of the Prowler
Rip-Flayer Leggings
Fiend Slayer Boots

Most of the crafted enhancement mail is pretty good too, especially if you're a leatherworker and can make the BoP stuff for yourself.

Some mp5 is not terrible because you can definitely run out of mana even with Shamanistic Rage. I wouldn't focus on it, really, but it does have some benefit and is not a wasted stat.

I am currently my guilds token enhancement shaman(previously elemental, but we didn't have an enhancement shaman so here I am). I've really had no problem being competitive on everything but Maiden of Virtue. I came in 3rd(including fire totems) on our Gruul Kill wearing nearly full blues and dual wielding 71 dps claws, during which I was nearly threat capped the entire time. I actually prefer to scale back on the all out dps upgrades and include a bit of stamina in all of my gear selections and gems because of this.

 

Kirion

Not that i don't belive you, but where did you find this numbers? Always want to have some kind of spreasheet for this. I was thinking that 1 crit raiting = 1 agi in terms on itemistaion.
Also, BoK arugment still valid.

42.

 

Expigator

After playing a rogue for a long time, I've come to realize a few things with my shaman.
a)I should be more concerned with aggro
b)holy crap i can heal
and...
c)i can bring much more to a raid then a rogue can.

Now, after initially building my shaman's set into a rogue like warrior with tons of hit, crit, leather, and all the other stuff I always thought so powerful (epeen waving AP stats). I've really thought deep about what I need to have in order to provide more to my raid. I need to live longer, both to continue DPSing and to provide my buffs to my party. Thus I've stacked a lot more stamina then I normally would as a rogue, I am much more cautious about exploding on mobs, and I tried to reach a nice balance with all my gear.

My profile should have it listed, but if not I am currently wearing basically a full Karazhan epic set. I've grown accustomed to Sovereign Nightseye gems for str/stam boosts, and I look for stamina enchants first on bracers/boots/chest.

I didn't reroll a shaman to just be another rogue. I rolled it to get the most out of the class. I don't wear leather (as I haven't felt the need), I am a guaranteed 1st or 2nd on DMs in major raids (rarely only losing to rogues or DPS warriors within my party), and I have a decent 7600 hp unbuffed. My intellect is relatively high for enhancement which i feel partly is due to lack of rogue-ish leather so i am able to spot heal during *oh shit* moments.

This is probably more than was asked for in this thread. But I wanted to give my opinion of why creating a nice balance in your gear is a good idea, beyond the standard stam-str-crit pieces.

If you can't get into Kara/Gruul/etc or are still working your way there, there are definitely blue options out there (and even green) to help gear you out. Desolation set is really nice with that set bonus, trinket+axe drop in mechanar can help, Beastlord stuff isn't too bad for a starter set.

 

Coriolis

As others have mentioned agility isn't exactly the best stat for you. And I'd also like to know where the numbers for amount of crit per agility come from... and isn't the crit rating wrong? If I'm not mistaken 22 crit rating = 1 crit, and 1 crit rating = 1 agi= 1 "item value". Whatever the case may be though, it seems you get somewhere around 70% less crit from agi as opposed to crit rating per item value which makes it a not worthless but not optimal stat.

As far as actual gear goes I'm highly annoyed personally at how good the desolation set is compared to tier 4. Both set bonuses from desolation are quite nice (at least on paper don't have the 4 piece yet). Tier 4 set bonuses however are silly. 12 str? Even if I had 4 other people in my group all of which gained 2x ap from str (i.e. all warriors or feral druids, no rogues), it would come out to 120 AP gained for the party.. if 2 rogues in party goes down to less then 100.. in terms of item value this is barely better then 35 hit rating (=70 AP), and this requires a stacked melee group only applicable in a 25 man raid. And the 4 piece? Assuming the offhand weapon bonus doesn't get hit with the -50% penalty, that's still 60 damage every 10 secs, i.e. a flat 6 dps. That's 84 ap without scaling from WF or SS, so in practice about equivlent to about 50 AP. Depending on how much the proc on desolation procs it could well be better then this (although I'm guessing it's slightly worse).

Then we sit down and look at the stats. In terms of the melee stats tier 4 has some more AP (about 50-60 if you factor in the BOK), and looses about 50 combined crit/hit rating. To remind you, crit/hit= 2xap as far as itemization formula is concenred, i.e. it has worse melee damage stats, and by a decent amount. Oh and I forgot, tier 4 has one less red socket too. So what do we get for what is roughly about ~50 AP lost melee stats? Maybe about 10-20 extra stam/int, and 121 damage/healing. With the scaling on shocks, 121 damage/healing comes out to about 50 extra damage per shock, every 6 secs if you spam it without lag or mana issues. So about 10 dps, which is equivalent to about 70 AP with WF/SS scaling of AP (my WF+SS damage is about equal to my white damage).

So all in all, if you could spam shocks constantly without aggro issues and could be in a 5 melee team then tier 4 would be about as good damage as desolation, with about 10-20 extra stam/int by this extremely rough calculation.

Now if only there were more things like those crafted str mail gloves...

 

Quality

I would probably do something like this:
http://ctprofiles.net/5164379

I honestly dont see any better choices in items except possibly the neck(I didnt feel like looking.)

You could also argue that Hourglass is > Brooch.



edit: Sockets add 260 more AP aswell, if you want to be lazy.

Didnt feel like factoring in all of the socket bonuses and alot of those items arent updated.

Felfury are the best enhance gloves currently but they havnt been updated on CTprof.

Midnight leggings have 3 sockets, not two. Helm of deso has 1 socket and 1 Meta.

 

• Relwin

http://ctprofiles.net/16722

Link with current setup and eventual setup. Eventual may be modified if I ever decide to actually drop skinning for hammersmithing. I think all of my blue slots are Shifting Nightseyes with maybe one Sovereign. All yellows can generally be considered Rigid Dawnstones if they aren't an Ebon piece, in which case they're the 8 crit one. Shoulders have a glinting topaz and a str ruby. Gloves have a str ruby if memory serves as well. All other red slots should be glintings. Since I'm too lazy to do the math to see if never missing attacks gives more DPS than slotting in other stuff I have tons of hit, forgot to mention that helm has three Rigid Dawnstones there as well.

This bear is cooler than you.

 

GamingManiac

Relwin: With the new information that windfury does have a hidden cooldown of 3 seconds, wouldn't haste rating be extremely devalued for us, as well as fast weapons? In your current profile, you're using a weapon that's extremely fast (Blackout Truncheon) and lower DPS than most weapons will provide. On top of that, both of your dream weapons are enchanted mongoose. I realize 200 agility does go a long way, but I'd rather double up on crusader since the haste rating is effectively wasted if you're gunning for windfury procs while crusader compliments SR incredibly.

On a positive note, /jealous that you're armorsmith. It's really tempting to roll an armorsmith since non-armorsmith shaman itemized gear is so rare.

 

• Relwin

Well the Ebon stuff is what I'll be wearing until at least T5, along with two Deso pieces for the hit bonus. I'm hoping they actually fix the WF 'feature' so that every swing can proc WF like it should be able to. Either way, I'm trying to proc it every three seconds on the dot with the haste stuff, and more white hits never hurt anyone.

This bear is cooler than you.

 

ayb

Back to resto!

http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/th...geNo=1&sid=1#3

 

Gatzu

I'm surprised no one is using those mana steal gloves, whenever I take those off to test I go oom very quickly and am unable to spam my abilities. Quicky question how often does that unraveler trinket proc for you, I haven't been able to pick it up to test for myself

Also to Sebudai I'd go pick up all those karazhan mail dps but I try to pass the ones with agi to hunters because its clearly itemized better for them. Kinda depressing when Desolation is practicaly beating out T5 when you count the set bonuses.

 

Malan

Yah the WF 5/4 workaround is getting corrected. 3 sec cooldown is going to be on all ranks.

 

• Relwin

Grasp has been done to death in the other thread. Short story, good for grinding, bad for overall raid DPSing.

Trinket is a 10% proc chance on crit if my memory serves me rightly.

This bear is cooler than you.

 

Gatzu

Which thread? I missed out on reading that be pretty intrested to see the explination for why its a dps downgrade.

 

• Relwin

This bear is cooler than you.

 

GamingManiac

I imagine it's because you can't effectively use Shamanistic Rage if you're constantly moving around to kill new mobs (unless you're fighting something that takes 30 seconds to kill). Meanwhile in raids, it's a lot easier to fill up your bar with SR. Therefore when SR isn't as valuable, the gloves become more useful. Just my personal theorycraft. I've never had the stuff made

 

Gatzu

Well like I said before even with 2500ap SR isn't enough mana to spam ES and SS every cooldown. Some times JoW can't be applied so I wouldn't want to rely on it. On a fight like gruul for example it isn't reasonable to expect it to be up all the time or even at all.