Oren

Byebye herbalism, hello jewel crafting.

 

Maax

You should know they changed the Ribbon of Sacrifice again, it is now:

Ribbon of Sacrifice
Unique
Trinket
Requires Level 70
Use: For the next 20 sec, your direct heals grant Fecundity to your target, increasing the healing received by the target by up to 30. Fecundity lasts 10 sec and stacks up to 5 times.
Equip: Increases healing done by spells and effects by up to 73.

http://www.wowhead.com/?item=28590

Devs: Our nerfs will block out the sun!
Druids: Then we will tank in the shade.

 

DarKNecross

We have had 3 Warmths drop from 4H ; however in months of farming BWL no Rejuv Gem ):
As someone about stated, the Talasite Owl is an amazing trinket. Also, it should be noted that the Piston off of Void Reaver now has a passive 16mp5 (iirc), in addition to the proc (which was toned back down). Good replacement or additional trinket for Shard of the Scale.

 

• constantius

I'd love to grab a Talasite Owl, but I can't justify losing Tailoring (too many recipes that I can't replace, along with the cost of re-leveling) or Enchanting (just too annoying to re-level; I don't have many irreplaceable recipes atm).

If I had Herbalism or Skinning or Mining, I would have leveled JCing in a heartbeat just to get that trinket. :-(

And I like the new Fel Reaver's Piston -- if I get my hands on one, it'll definitely replace Shard of the Scale.

I've seen the new stats on the Ribbon -- it still doesn't impress me that much. I think I mixed up Ribbon and the other one - Pendant of the Violet Eye. There's no way I would equip Ribbon - 73 healing is quite nice, but the proc just isn't worth the loss of regen (for me). It would probably be a good trinket for a tree druid (although I'm not one, so feel free to correct me) -- nice static +heal for their HoTs, and a proc that can affect all healers heals to that target, that can be applied as they start their HoT rotation again (proc, Rejuv, Regrowth, Lifebloom x3 for all 5 stacks).

The new Pendant of the Violet Eye is interesting. 40 base intellect is equivalent, on fights, to:

5-minute: 11.0 Mp5 (with 5/5 Mental Strength)
5-minute: 10.6 Mp5 (with 3/5 Mental Strength)
5-minute: 10.0 Mp5 (with 0/5 Mental Strength)

8-minute: 6.9 Mp5 (with 5/5 Mental Strength)
8-minute: 6.6 Mp5 (with 3/5 Mental Strength)
8-minute: 6.3 Mp5 (with 0/5 Mental Strength)

Which, as a base effect, is reasonable, especially given that there is a 21 Mp5 stacking proc per spell cast in the next 20 seconds. However, the buff ends at the end of the 20 second period, so there's a limited usefulness to this.

Let's take a basic scenario: you proc it, cast GH:7, PoM, and Renew 10, then sit and regen some mana. Note that presently (on live) the use of this trinket does *not* trigger the GCD. Also, assume a base of 100 Mp5 inside the 5SR, and 300 Mp5 outside. These numbers don't really matter; it's the differential that will give us the information we need.

(time in minutes:seconds.partial_seconds)
0:00.0 -- hit trinket
0:01.0 -- start GH:7
0:02.0 -- REGEN TICK @ 300 Mp5
0:03.8 -- GH:7 heal lands, your sytem registers (assuming 0.3 seconds lag)
0:03.8 -- assuming you time it exactly, hit PoM
0:04.0 -- REGEN TICK @ 142 Mp5
0:05.3 -- GCD ends, hit Renew 10
0:06.0 -- REGEN TICK @ 163 Mp5
<exit spell casting>
0:08.0 -- REGEN TICK @ 163 Mp5
0:10.0 -- REGEN TICK @ 163 Mp5
0:10.x -- exit 5SR
0:12.0 -- REGEN TICK @ 363 Mp5
0:14.0 -- REGEN TICK @ 363 Mp5
0:16.0 -- REGEN TICK @ 363 Mp5
0:18.0 -- REGEN TICK @ 363 Mp5
0:20.0 -- REGEN TICK @ 363 Mp5
<trinket effect ends>
0:22.0 -- REGEN TICK @ 300 Mp5

Now, a tick is just the Mp5 # divided by 2.5, so the calculation (assuming I didn't screw up anything too badly) is pretty simple, for the 0-20 (ignore the 0:22.0 one).

Assuming no trinket, the previously listed regen would be 6 full ticks outside the 5SR, plus 4 inside. That works out to 300*6/2.5 + 100*4/2.5, or 880 mana regenerated over the 20 second period. Just assume we're in a vacuum here, so the pre/post don't concern us. Also, obviously, I'm assuming we begin outside the 5SR, or the first tick is a difference of 80 mana.

Now, with the trinket, we get a single tick @ 300 Mp5, then a tick @ 142, and 3 ticks @ 163, then 5 ticks @ 363. This works out to 1098 mana. The total difference is 218 mana regained over the 20 seconds (since the effect ends precisely at the 20 second mark, that's all that counts). The trinket is on a 2 minute cooldown.

This works out to 9 Mp5, static. This is, of course, assuming you do what I listed above. If, however, we assume two different scenarios, let's see what we get.

Scenario One: hit the trinket, cast a single spell, exit spell casting.
0:00.0 -- hit trinket
0:01.0 -- start GH:7
0:02.0 -- REGEN TICK @ 300 Mp5
0:03.8 -- GH:7 heal lands, your sytem registers (assuming 0.3 seconds lag)
0:04.0 -- REGEN TICK @ 121 Mp5
0:06.0 -- REGEN TICK @ 121 Mp5
0:08.0 -- REGEN TICK @ 121 Mp5
<exit 5SR in here>
0:10.0 -- REGEN TICK @ 321 Mp5
0:12.0 -- REGEN TICK @ 321 Mp5
0:14.0 -- REGEN TICK @ 321 Mp5
0:16.0 -- REGEN TICK @ 321 Mp5
0:18.0 -- REGEN TICK @ 321 Mp5
0:20.0 -- REGEN TICK @ 321 Mp5
<trinket effect ends>
0:22.0 -- REGEN TICK @ 300 Mp5

Total differential: 76 mana, or 3 Mp5.

Scenario Two: hit the trinket, and spam spells for twenty seconds, as fast as you can. Assume 0.3 seconds of lag.
0:00.0 -- hit trinket
0:01.0 -- start Flash
0:02.0 -- REGEN TICK @ 300 Mp5
0:02.8 -- start flash
0:04.0 -- REGEN TICK @ 121 Mp5
0:04.6 -- start flash
0:06.0 -- REGEN TICK @ 142 Mp5
0:06.4 -- start flash
0:08.0 -- REGEN TICK @ 163 Mp5
0:08.2 -- start flash
0:10.0 -- REGEN TICK @ 184 Mp5
0:10.05 -- start flash
0:11.8 -- start flash
0:12.0 -- REGEN TICK @ 226 Mp5
0:13.6 -- start flash
0:14.0 -- REGEN TICK @ 247 Mp5
0:15.4 -- start flash
0:16.0 -- REGEN TICK @ 268 Mp5
0:17.2 -- start flash
0:18.0 -- REGEN TICK @ 289 Mp5
0:19.0 -- start flash
0:20.0 -- REGEN TICK @ 310 Mp5
<trinket effect ends>
0:22.0 -- REGEN TICK @ 100 Mp5

Mana without trinket: 480
Mana with trinket: 900

Mana differential: 420 mana or 17.5 Mp5


So assuming an 8-minute fight (reasonable; haven't seen a fight so far that goes beyond that, and many are shorter, which only serve to improve the value of the 40 intellect), and assuming you are able to use the trinket effectively (let's assume you get 4 uses in, just for sake of argument, so the numbers work out evenly), the trinket will vary between 9.3 and 24 Mp5, depending on how many spells you cast during the use effect.

On the high end, if you are a paladin, this trinket rocks. FoL spam is what this trinket was *designed* for, IMO, and even with the nerfs, pallies will still be doing this.

On the low end, if you're a spirit priest, this trinket sucks. Full stop. Using 3 spells, and then exiting into the 5SR is a silly way to use this trinket. You'd be far better off using Bangle, getting the extra 130 spirit use effect as you can, and standing to regen.

In the middle, this may be useful for any person who has to do burst heals -- 3 or 4 concentrated heals, then inactivity.

Having said this, I think it'd be useful for everyone to have, if only for the 40 intellect that it comes with. Sometimes, sheer mana pool is useful (Kazzak, anyone?).

If there's holes in my reasoning, feel free to fix them.

Note that my reasoning does seem to follow that posted in the original thread concerning this trinket: Pendant of the Violet Eye - How to put it to good use?, only with the new stats taken into account. If you are able to chain-cast with a haste proc, as the shaman showed in that thread, the *old* trinket could be pushed to 24 Mp5. The new one, using reasonable spells, and lag built in, can do the same. If you are able to push further, the higher you go, the better your benefit from it. If you use Scarab of the Infinite Cycle, then this is actually a good trinket to have around. I think.

 

Calya

Nice analysis. I saved a Pendant from being sharded recently and I've been thinking it would be nice for heroics, where boss fights are short and brutal and I'm getting very little spirit regen. In that situation the 40 intellect is quite useful and I'd be casting enough spells to take better advantage of the proc.

It seems like a lot of trinkets are oriented towards "spam as many spells as you can in a 15-second window for a bigger bonus," which makes them great for FoL-spamming pallies but not so great for spirit priests. The Bangle is obviously an exception, and I love mine and can't see myself replacing it for raiding until I get an Earring of Soulful Meditation. But I've had a harder time with my second trinket slot. A Talasite Owl would be great, but I'm not willing to drop tailoring or enchanting. I think the new Eye of Gruul has some promise since you could presumably cast a downranked spell with the proc and stay out of the FSR, sort of like a weaker Clearcasting. Unfortunately this priest was an alt before TBC, so I never got a Shard or Gem.

 

Oren

For the sake of mention, the earring is the kind of trinket you would want to pair with a bangle, not replace it with. I played around on test a bit with the new earring, and even 100% inside fsr, simply chaining it every cooldown(that is however, assuming bangle proc is active....which it generally would be) is about as much regen as wearing 2 scales would be, and clearly being able to be out of fsr and pop the trinkets is simply amazing(about 1000 spirit for most of us give or take).
Eye of Gruul is still garbage as far as I'm concerned, and any numbers I've seen(I haven't worked it on my own) support that. Your second slot would have to be REALLY weak to warrant it(worse *somehow* than LCB, which since everyone pretty much has one is nearly impossible). However, as to your mention of it being like clearcasting, I'm not sure thats how it functions. If it is(that is, keeps you out of fsr), and it could be, then I could see its value increasing a little bit, but ultimately the thing that makes clearcasting in and of itself strong is that it can be chained to inner focus. That said, the likelihood of proccing eye-->clear-->IF is well...unlikely. Also, just in terms of a comparison, blue dragon is a 2% proc, and for a spirit user is quite a sizable return(can't quote you a value because i don't know your spirit, but lets just call it hundreds more than the eye takes off), and moreover has no cooldown.

 

DarKNecross

Personally, I can see the pendant as an amazing trinket for paladins, especially those of which who were heavy into crit. The 40 intellect passive comes out to be 0.61% Crit after raid buffs/talents. The proc would be good to benefit those who have low mp5 due to crit stacking.
On live at the moment, it's a stacking 14mp5 bonus, however paladin heals were producing double stacks (or two at a time). The math on that made the trinket out to be around 26mp5 if nonstop spamming while it was up every time it came up. I use it whenever I do karazhan.

 

Calya

Good point. I guess I was looking more towards the future and hoping my Bangle would eventually *have* an upgrade, if I don't want to be using it until the next expansion. But I can definitely see the value in using both together. Do the Bangle and Earring's spirit buffs stack? I figured they'd have a shared cooldown like other clicky trinkets.

My other trinket is in fact a LCPB. The reason I assumed EoG would keep you out of the FSR is because of how Auslese's Light Channeler works: if you cast a spell that's free with the buff, it doesn't trip the FSR. Of course if EoG doesn't function the same way, its value diminishes quite a bit. Even if it does work that way, I'm not really sure how viable it would be simply because there will undoubtedly be situations where the trinket will proc and I simply can't afford to cast anything but a max rank GHeal at the risk of the tank dying. It seems like it could go either way really. If it didn't have the passive +heal bonus now I wouldn't even consider it.

I have considered the Blue Dragon, but I've heard rumors that it's being changed soon to proc much less often for players over 60, which is an unfortunate but not really unexpected change. I'll probably just suck it up and buy an Essence of the Martyr and bind it to my Renews. 81 passive healing is excellent, and bigger Renew ticks never hurt anyone.

 

Oren

I'm told its actually a good bit more than that in its current form, and around that after the changes. Then again, Aus' isn't really to be trusted.

They don't share a cooldown Like I said, A LOT of spirit. Thus, even in fsr 430 spr= 40 mp5 @15%, double that with a bangle proc, and even a little more with the tailoring set.
More than anything else, I'm looking forward to clearcast proc-->double trinket-->IF, for maximum time our of fsr while still casting spells. Outside fsr, having both trinkets active is about 270 mp5 alone, plus your normal regen.

I haven't heard that, but I could see it happening. It hasn't really been an issue until now mainly because itemization has been so utterly fucked that I think most of us have found ourselves forced into mp5 gear instead of spirit gear like we used to use. That said, now that we're seeing positive improvements particularly to tier 5, it stands to reason that spirit will "make a comeback" and that items that feed off it would again be strong. IIRC(and I don't remember exactly) a dragon proc back at 60 was yielding over 1000 mana for me(and I think closer to 1200, but like I said, I don't really remember) with no tbc hidden cooldown nonsense getting in the way of multiple procs. Point being, that with T5, T6, and etc. gear having good spirit values, blue dragon could really yield some beastly returns.

Not really a fan of the essence, I really look for regeneration in my trinkets primarily, but I do utilize some things in a similar way(http://www.wowhead.com/?item=27828) fairly often.

 

Steely

Being in a small guild which only does Kara my choice of trinkets is an easy one. I use the bangle and the scarab.

My undead priest was rolled specifically for TBC so me and some friends could have an exclusive instance group. Because of this things like shard of the scale and rejuv gem are not options.

From my experience I found that staying outside the 5sr is a luxury that I am barely ever afforded. Unless somehow our tank manages to avoid a succession of hits/spells i'm pretty much chain casting. Consequently I have valued mp5 as more important that spirit.

But the bangle is just awesome. With meditation and primal mooncloth included it's 35% regen for 15 seconds. Considering it seems to proc at least once a minute, a quarter of my time i'm at 220 mp5 which really isn't that bad. Phase in the fact that you can either choose to use the trinket when it's proc is up for some even more mana goodness or wait until that friendly druid tank in the raid finds an opportunity to innervate you.

As for the scarab, it's a passive 70 healing and gives you 1.92second gheals every now and then again, what's not to like?

And for PvP. I'm currently using timelapse shard and the kara arcane resistance trinket. However I would really prefer to get http://www.wowhead.com/?item=27896. Since I'm a priest it has the same affect as walking around with a "kick me" sticker on my back.

Edit: Changed regen after Oren pointed out. (Not sure if it was a typo, bad maths, lack of sleep or wishful thinking.)

 

Oren

Honestly in the kind of smaller groups you mentioned you stick to, getting out of fsr really isn't much of an option. That said, the strength of spirit always used to lie in and of the fact that through it we could achieve the same ends that other classes got from pure mp5 items(RIP 3-PC Trans), while retaining tremendous regen outside fsr if we happened to be able to get out. Now, without that set bonus, and with current itemization values(Honestly, the spirit gems are trash - they should around 12, in my opinion) generally pushing mp5 and lacking in spirit, we've all been left to come to the same conclusion you have. Losing the additional 15% constant, was akin to losing like 35 mp5 or something like that -at 60-.

I figure it was a typo, but anyways, 35%

I'm actually not such a fan of the scarab for us in pve. I just don't really feel the buff lasts long enough for us(priests) to really get much out of it. For pallies in particular I can see it being nice, but I think just in terms of how important good spell timing is for us, not to mention cast cancels etc., I think it just screws with the rhythm of things. Decent for trash sometimes though. At the moment, I use it for pvp sometimes, but honestly I'd like to get rid of it. At this point, I don't even really find myself casting all that many non-instant spells . The more I think about it as I type this, the more I think I'll switch over to something else - kinda wish I had an eye of the dead.

I don't go anywhere without a pvp trinket in my first slot. It really is a game breaker for priests. As to the alembic, I've seen a number of people use it, but I don't have one myself. I think I'd really have to see it in action to make a determination, but that said I think we all know that mana usage and recovery is a big issue for priests at the moment, and as such I could see that trinket being pretty solid. Even if you only get a proc or two in a game, 33 resilience is certainly nothing to scoff at. I'm curious though, perhaps someone with the trinket could englighten; Does "When struck in combat" apply strictly to melee, or is any incoming damage considered? If the latter, I might have to put some effort into getting one. If not....I can't see it being truly worth the slot except when fighting rogues, as 2% is pretty low. Also, can we assume that in true TBC fashion it has a hidden cooldown?

 

dukes

If you find yourself not liking the scarab, why not go with practically everyone else in this thread and pick up a LCPB and use it on cooldown for some mana regen instead? Same amount of +healing as a base, and a better on use/proc effect.

 

Heldericht

I'm thinking of using the Eye of Gruul and Talasite Owl post patch as a paladin.

With Pendant as a reserve.

I leveled JC'ing just for the Talasite Owl because its just an amazing trinket.



But yea, anyone got any opinions on the Eye of Gruul? Seems like a great trinket, with FoL spam it'll have a lot of chances to proc.

Also, regarding the eye. Does it have an internal CD on test realms? Or can it be constantly proc'd like the Melee trinket off Gruul.

 

Geren

I picked up my Pendant of the Violet Eye the other night in Kara and have been playing around with it's uses since. Swapping it with Heavenly Inspiration mostly (passive +10mp5). Best thing I've noticed so far is that wanding counts as a spell cast for the purposes of this trinket.

Used it to pretty good effect on fights where I get some downtime and can wand while I regen mana (Curator evocations) and have gotten the proc to stack 17-18 times before the buff expires.

In the end it's a very nice trinket as long as you are vigilant in using it wisely, post 2.1 the little buff it's getting will make it just that little bit nicer.

 

◊ Shalas

No cooldown, as I got back to back procs on the PTR. If you're chaincasting FoL with no lag it's 30 MP5 and 77 healing which is obviously amazing, but with a 2% proc rate it's incredibly inconsistant.

 

Oren

With the cooldown removed, it actually becomes a viable trinket. That said, its pretty tough to assign static value to a 2% trinket, though perhaps it can be added to the pally arsenal just based on their casting more spells in general, than the rest of us. By the same token though, they would have to switch to hl to actually get full use out of the proc, which adds a bit of an uncontrollable situational element to it.

 

sulliwan

Trinket: reduces 450 mana on next spell.
Flash of light: 180 mana.

What does it do exactly if you cast a spell that costs less than 450 mana with the proc active? Does it return the extra mana or does it just make the spell cost 0 mana?

 

Egel

Isn't the trinket just 44 +healing or was it changed again?

 

• Chicken

Remember that while it's being buffed, some of the more unusual effects that proc it won't any more:

buff /bʌf/ Pronunciation[buhf]
–verb (used with object)
- to reduce or deaden the force of

 

Quasar

I'm fairly sure it simply reduces the mana cost up to 450, making any spell of 450 or below free. If it said "refunds 450 mana on next spell cast" or some such, then yes it would restore mana I presume.

JUICE! Aww I'm sorry. Did... did anyone want some juice?

 

Oren

Theres absolutely no way it refunds mana.

 

Deris

I think I want to get the Gruul Trinket, and I have a Pendant banked, I currently however use LCPB and Scarab - but really the scarab seems very meh, I'd almost rather just get another trinket and save the scarab for pvp, but even then its uses are dubious.

Gruul Trinket plus an Insightful Earthstorm Diamond as meta could be very nice. Saving Divine Favor for Gruul procs with max HL could also be good for gaining a bit of mana back.

 

Lightshadow

Quasar's hit the nail on the head with respect to how the eye works, though one thing that's worth adding is that if the spell you choose is <450 mana it won't count against your 5 second rule timer =)

 

Todorka

Regardless of this, the trinket will still remain crappy in my eyes . Its more or less a pala trinket and a pally wouldnt really benefit getting out of the 5s rule since their spirit is generally low.

As for me in 2.1 im planning to use Earring of Soulful Meditation - http://www.wowhead.com/?item=30665#z0z because the buffed version is really lovely . Also since the alchemy nerf ill be dropping herbalism for a while , so i could level JC and get my hands on Figurine - Talasite Owl - http://www.wowhead.com/?item=24127

 

Oren

Math puts Bangle+Earring above all else for priests, unless I suppose your intent was only to use the earring ofsr, in which case yeah, earring+owl.