Replica

I vendored that about a week ago after buying the Prayer Book. I'm not sure if i should have, but in the end i never use the Prayer Book anyway.

Call me lazy, but i much prefer Talasite Owl and Heavenly Inspiration for their passive mana regen over stuff which doesn't have regen and makes me think more. I pop the Inspiration prior to each pull for Earth Shield and if i'm seeing that we're struggling (perhaps too much damage being dealt on too many people) then i'll repop an Earth Shield with it mid-fight. I've been told that's an expensive practice, but it also eases the load a lot for when other people want to regen and the like. And i chug pots like they're going out of style anyway.

I would really love a Scarab, but i find i struggle enough with mana as it is, and the prospect of having a spell which could makes me go oom quicker over the duration of a fight is not terribly appealing. It seems to me that it would be infinitely more useful as an activated ability for those "oh crap" moments rather than randomly making you cast faster.

However i have often wished i could spam Chain Heal quicker, like on Maiden for example. So if i did get one then i'd likely switch in the Scarab after popping a more powerful version of Heavenly light at the start of the fight.
http://www.wowhead.com/?item=27828 perhaps? Looks tough to get so i'll probably stick with X'iri's gift or Scryer's Bloodgem if i ever got a Scarab.

 

◊ Shalas

It suffers from the basic problem that activated +healing is fairly situational. Prior to the TBC health inflation, if you knew ahead of time that you needed a larger heal, anyone but a paladin could just cast a higher rank. That's a lot less true now, but +288 healing is also a lot less significant now. Making heals 8% larger just isn't that huge of a boost, and if you save it for when you need it (compared to using it every time it's up and just downranking if it's not needed), you'll generally use it a lot less than it's cooldown would indicate.

I've been told Paladins like them as it's sometimes thier only way to keep up with large damage bursts, though.

 

◊ Praetorian

Yeah, one of the reasons why I find it so hard to replace my Warmth of Forgiveness is that I never have any doubt whatsoever that I'm using it efficiently. It's very easy to remember to use, I have it hotkeyed, and mana is mana. There's no case of popping a timer and then having to maximize the number of spells you cast in order to get the most out of it, or the like. I pop Warmth when I'm down 1000 mana or so in virtually any fight, and if it comes up again during the same fight, I pop it immediately. It's handy.

 

Ichal

Do macros ever work with alt self cast when you havn't put it in yourself?

Or are you saying that something like this isn't working?

/use Oshu'Gun Relic
/cast [modifier:alt,target=player] Healing Touch; Healing Touch

 

GoG

I figured out a few weeks back that Oshu'gun Relic and ZHC suspiciously do not share a cool down, or rather they stack unlike ToEP and ZHC. So my boss pull technique is to pop both, ES the tank, cast healing stream, and then swap in my on use mana regen trinkets.

I think it's also worth mentioning, that the restorative totems talent us shaman have that boost mana totens by 25% also works on the talasite owl. This may change if Blizzard decides it was unintended, so I wouldn't say you should drop your 375 leather working or anything, but if you are JC or thinking about it, it's certainly a nice incentive.

Gog the Shaman
Ferall the Warrior
Orthrus the Warlock

 

SindirHH

Warmth was the one item pre-TBC I wish I could have got my hands on.

 

Gozul

Does anybody can confirm that this is a true drop from SSC ? : http://wow.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?witem=30663

Looks like a big flawed itemization by Blizzard. This is too good to be true if the proc rate > 10 %, or too random compared to a passive mana regen trinket like Warmth of Forgiveness.

 

Oren

Definately. The owl falls into the same realm, if I was a jeweler I would certainly use it. As for others, I've been trying to get a bangle for a while now, and continue to hear only good things about it. As a rule I try to stick to items that give me tangible mana gains. I have a difficult time justifying items like the prayerbook with which in order to get equivalent mana return, spells must be cast. As a spirit class, being forced into chaincasting is something we attempt to avoid when possible. That being said, the prayerbook being on a 1min cooldown, is actually worth thought just because of the cooldown, and I may try it and just macro it to a couple heals.
As for the pendant of the violet eye, whilst as a priest I have zero interest in it, a number of paladins I play with really really like it. With the speed of their heals, not to mention in conjunction with items like the casting haste trinket, not to mention shaman, I can see it being a very solid choice. I believe the math puts it in the upper 20's in regard to mp5 at optimal usage(don't quote me, its my memory, not my math).
At any rate, I still have a difficult time getting rid of shard/rejuv, the static gains are undeniable. WTB a bangle and an owl?

 

• Erongg

As with the +dmg proc trinkets, it's reasonable to assume that trinket has a hidden cooldown, especially if it works on heals.

 

Maax

I still use my Shard of the Scale and http://www.wowhead.com/?item=19955. Of all the ZG trinkets I think it actually came out of the Great Scaling Item Nerf better than it went in. It used to only affect the cast time of HT, but now it also affects regrowth. As a moonkin without naturalist, I can wear it with 5 pieces of stormrage, and actually have an emergency heal. I am not sure what if any trinket I would even replace either of them with.

Devs: Our nerfs will block out the sun!
Druids: Then we will tank in the shade.

 

Scotto

I would really like to see discussion on the Blue Dragon card http://thottbot.com/i19288... Is this trinket any good? I understand it's a fairly unreliable proc, but when it does (usually twice per fight) it is a substantial amount of mana (assuming you have a reasonable 400+ spirit). Or am I completely off on thinking this trinket is any good?

 

Oren

I guess it depends honestly. Pre-nerf T2, that is, when the bonus was still 15% regen, I used a really spirit heavy build and it was extremely strong. In addition, having all that spirit went even further via the blue dragon, in that a single proc would yield so much mana that it worked out to more than any other passive +mp5 trinket could provide. That said, multiple procs would provide exponential gains(and it procs pretty often, you can expect at least a few procs in a boss fight, and to my knowledge there is no hidden cooldown). Now, the point I've been driving toward, is that I at least have found gear in tbc thus far to be moving away from spirit and toward mp5, which is ultimately detrimental to druids and priests, and also has direct impact on trinkets like that. Additionally, I've found finding stamina to be a fairly serious issue as well, and a large majority of the strong stamina healing gear is sta/int/mp5, with no spirit to be found(badge rewards being a good example). I have less spirit at 70, than I did at 60, and for a class built around it, that just seems like shitty itemization to me. All that in mind, the tiered sets are decent spiritwise, and once I upgrade gear a bit further I may go back to the blue dragon, but I won't know if its worth it until I have some numbers to crunch. Regardless, there is definately some potential, and combinations like bangle+blue dragon could potentially be huge. The use alone on the bangle is worth 80mp5 outside fsr, so watching for dragon procs then popping the bangle could be a very solid mana gain.

So is it worth it? For now, it sits in my bank, but it isn't outdated yet. The upside is it scales, so if gear gets back to a point where spirit is again king, it may come out of retirement.

 

Lindey

Currently, I'm using Rejuvenating Gem and the Prayer Book. I've found the Prayer Book as an excellent trinket since, at the very least, if I continue casting normally for its duration I'll save around 110 mana (9 mp5).

I had a Scarab for a while as well, and while the passive +healing is great, the proc seems pretty overrated to me. Firstly, the proc only comes off direct heals which means Renew, Shield, and PoM don't proc it. Now it still does proc quite a bit even discounting those spells, but when it does, what's it doing for me? My direct heals are faster, sure, but unless its a situation where the tank is tenths of seconds from death, the improved casting speed offers very little. My heal still costs the same mana, so I don't gain longevity, and it still heals for the same amount, so I'm not benefiting there.

Looking through the other new trinkets, the Ribbon of Sacrifice and Pendant of the Violet Eye both seem terrible. I could kind of see Eye of Gruul for a Priest if you used it, then Shadow Fiended, used it then got Innervated, used it then potted, etc., but overall it seems too unwieldy to be used effectively. The SSC priest trinket looked cool for a brief moment, until I realized it was a bigger version of my Masquerade Gown proc, which has been less than impressive.

Personally, I think the best options for a priest currently are the Prayer Book and the Bangle, although I understand Bangle is pretty terrible for Shaman and Paladins. Sadly, Rejuvenating Gem seems to be the next best option so I'll use it until I get a Bangle.

 

Boevis

I don't know, right now the average resto druid is going into Karazhan/Gruul with well over 400 buffed spirit, though I'll admit the stamina issue is really giving me problems.

 

• Playered

I would say that he Scarab is more of a Shaman/Paladin trinket, whereas Bangle is the Priest/Druid one (well its spirit based...). Then either Lower City PB / EoTM as the second trinket.

Usable trinkets without passives simply fail imo, their abilities are crap compared to the basic ones that passive/use trinkets have. Untill they get looked at and buffed I would never intend to take Ribon, Pendant, or Eye of Gruul over sharding them, I dont know why but I just dont believe they will ever be made into good trinkets when other items get 'fixed'.

Im not sure how much exactly each trinket is mathematically worth for me, however I would take Bangle + Rejuv Gem (over EoTM/LCPB) given the chance because I really dislike having those use effect trinkets except Bangle (IV-Love).

Typically having around 440~ spirit fully raid buffed, thats almost 600 Spi for IV, and when waiting for IV CD theres 1-2 times you can use the spirit buff while your non-casting, or having the proc go off to get even more mana back. Not to mention it procs so often its... /love

note: Curious on the stamina issue (?), never noticed it unless your going for a gimped spirit build (over 400 unbuffed).

 

Igniter

From a friend second hand, it's said to be only offensive nature spells.

 

• Binkenstein

Screwball.

When will they make Shaman trinkets that are resto friendly?

NAC = pvp burst damage trinket
ZG trinket = more LS damage = lol

Now this.... /sigh

 

Raejin

I personally use Lower City Prayerbook and Bangle of Endless Blessings when I heal, because I'm a hotspammer who can get a lot of use out of the LCPB's clicky. I also seem to be the only druid in the guild who uses 2/5 Moonglade for the set bonus while healing, so the LCPB's bonus works well with constantly recasting rejuv on all the tanks.

I've had similar experiences as Quasar - the Scarab of the Infinite Cycle has not procced off any instant cast spells for me, at all, whereas it goes off all the time whenever I regrowth/HT. I'd certainly swap the LCPB for a SotIC if I were to do the 33/0/28 thing, but not with my current playstyle.

 

• mutagen

I quit using mine when I did a parse of BWL and saw that it wouldn't proc as much as I'd expect in bossfights, giving me a net return about that of the Mindtap Talisman. Part of the problem was the amount of healing I was canceling, that may have happened after hearing about the WoW 2.0 +healing changes (FoaF was in alpha and clued me in pretty early) and I decided to try learning how to be a WoW 2.0 priest instead of endless H2 spamming. It may have made more sense for spamming H2 and before the regen stacking thing was nerfed back a bit.

There may be some nice situations for it now but my spirit hasn't gone up all that much (unless I juggle some gear) and the other trinkets look so nice. Still combine the proc with the Bangle Use: and you might have some nice numbers!

 

dukes

I'm surprised to hear that people are having problems finding decent gear with spirit stacked on - if I were to go resto with my current healing gear (with a couple of additions, i'm STLL after a neck with spirit on it as I'm using the fallen god one off c'thun, even though there's about 4 that could drop I've never seen one of them yet) I'd be pushing over 700 I believe - part of that is putting 8 spirit gems in items that most other people would probably stack with the +healing/mana Nightseye. One example is the Earthsoul legs, which I have 2 +8 spirit gems and one epic 4int/5spirit gem - gives it a sickening 45 spirit total with socket bonus. Most of the gear isn't exactly stacked with straight mana/5, but with that much spirit, the Bangle for proc, and reflection, my regen is hardly bad, and I'm still pushing 1.2k +heal with the Serpentcrest Lifestaff, unenchanted. Even in feral gear I'm getting full mana (10k with feral spec) from ~500 in fights like nightbane with bangle active.

Current choices of trinket for me are Essence of the Martyr and the Bangle, but after reading about the prayerbook I'm considering leaving the EotM in the bank and getting one instead - I've never really used active healing trinkets well (just another thing to worry about and when do you use them most effectively?) and the prayerbook sounds like one of those things bound to a key thats easy to hit and just spam on cooldown regardless of when you're actually casting.

 

kaib

What's the intention behind stacking spirit? Especially 8 spirit jewels are a gigantic waste of perfectly good socket slots. I have 5/5 in spiritual healing and 20% mana reg while casting. 8 with BoK are 8.8. That gives me 5.5 mana/5 outside 5SR and 1.1 mana/5 inside. 8.8 spirit are also worth 2.2 +healing from the talent and 0.88 +healing from imp spirit, so a total of 3.02 +healing.

I'm usually 85% inside 5sr, at least. That means per minute I am 9s outside, granting me 9.9 mana outside plus 11.22 mana inside, equals a total of 21.12 mana per minute while also giving me 3.02 +healing.
Now a Royal Nightseye adds 9 +healing and 24 mana per minute. Now for a druid that's even worse. Ok, you have 15% more spirit, but you most likely don't have the 3 set mooncloth bonus, so only 15% while casting and you're also missing spiritual healing. Add to that the fact that you have resto talents granting you 120% of your +healing to healing touch and hots and you end up seriously gimping yourself with 8 spi gems over 9 healing/2 manatic.

Spirit is nice, but if you don't end up spending a big amount of time outside 5SR - which I really, really doubt in 25 men raid encounters, 85% is actually a fairly high number and not having clearcast + inner focus certainly doesn't help druids with this -, spirit is just a minor stat. It's good to have but you need to watch what you give up for it imo.

Also back on topic:
One thing people don't consider is also that mana reg trinkets are easier to replace then +healing/burst trinkets. I agree that the use on EotM is not exactly exciting for raid healing. But, and that's a very big but, it gives you a stat that is hard to make up for with consumeables. If you want to play your character to it's maximum potential value, you will never ever go oom if you pot up with everything avaible.
Mana regen trinkets like Shard of the Scale or the 4h one essentially mean you can pot less, but your healing output will be worse. Given that most raids should have 2 resto shamans and 2 shadowmages these days, I think it's better to focus on items that increase your healing output as between mana totems/vampiric touch and buffs/pots, you should never have seriuos mana issues if you make use of consumeables.

That sounds a bit more extreme then I actually want it to be, I still have Royal Nightseyes over +18 healing and I could use EotM along with Eye of the Dead but I end up using mana regen stuff most of the time instead of two use: trinkets, but it points towards the correct direction imo.

 

sulliwan

The math seems to support this trinket being good, at least for classes that constantly spam fast spells(for example a tree druid where most of your spells are instant).
So assuming you cast an average of 1 spell per 2 seconds, it gives you
1-(1-0.02)^(15/2) = 14% uptime for the proc. If you have 15% regen while casting from talents it should be about the same as having 12% passive regen while casting from the trinket slot. If you don't have the talent, it's more than that.
A quick and dirty spreadsheet tells me it's about 40 mana/5sec from blue dragon when raidbuffed for me.

 

Malorum

I currently use Rejuv + Mindtap and i plan on replacing the Mindtap once i get my hands on a Scarab. Its quite amazing how good Rejuv Gem is currently and how good it is going to be in the long run. I have some healers who still want to pug up BWL to get it.

 

CheshireCat

It's good point (although I would personally sacrifice a minor internal organ-- a gall bladder, perhaps, or a spleen-- if it would get 2 shadow priests and 2 resto shammies in my raid.) Still, mana available from consumables vastly outpaces both healing available from consumables and, often, the mana demands of a fight.

I think I don't gear myself by that philosophy primarily because I don't want to admit that to myself.


As a human priest, my raid buffed spirit gets pretty darn high. (10% racial, 5% SoR) Assuming you ignore all that really depressing consumable talk and still gear yourself for mana regen, that extra 15% effectiveness can make spirit-based trinkets like the Bangle and the Blue Dragon remain good choices for a very long time.

 

dukes

My original intention for stacking spirit was to see just how much I could get. I had about 10 star of elunes, so cutting a couple into spirit gems wasn't much of a waste at the time, and I still have plenty left. Getting 800 spirit raid buffed is actually quite nice as tree-spec, as it'll give every healer +200 healing on people in your group - unfortunately there doesn't seem to be much space for a tree in the MT group right now, as generally we have 2 tanks, a shaman, a paladin and a warlock. Stacking a tree in there with it would mean cutting that down to one tank getting the benefit of everything, and the second tank gets shafted. Being feral atm my healing gear isn't of great priority to me - and I use pieces like the dreamwalker legs over the earthsoul when I have to heal atm anyway, as they're practically the same but the dreamwalker has a load of mana/5 rather than the spirit I've socketed.

Also, trinket-wise, the bangle helps to make spirit a lot more efficient. It seems to proc around 1.5 times per minute, which is an extra chunk of mana back. If I wear the spirit gear and use the trinket when I get a proc, it's an extra 170-200 mana back or so, which is pretty significant when you get it proc as often as it does - ends up around 25 mana/5 aswell as having the on use for things like innervate which is pretty nifty.

I'm also amazed that the blue dragon didn't get a similar treatment to the HoJ or the 3 piece tier 2 bonuses. Being a level 60 item that is more effective at 70 is a bit weird considering that they nerfed everything else that was similar.