D4vE

I picked up a [Messenger of Fate] yesterday and will try it out next time I am on tank duty. Too bad [Gauntlets of Enforcement] don't have dagger skill rating included (no idea why, because fast daggers are excellent tank weapons), so I am kinda stuck with T5 with the Messenger.

Anyways, Kings Defender never outperformed TF, but, depending on fight, the tanks with Mallet of Tides or Brutalizer are equal or slightly better compared to me in terms of TPS (especially on low armor targets like Teron Gorefiend).

TF is still pure gold in certain situations, for example Archimonde, while waiting for the fear or offtanking Void Reaver or Bloodboil, when rage is a non-issue.

 

world

Of all the possible places to use a Thunderfury, Hydross is not one of them, considering that he would be immune to it for half the fight. And anyway, Improved Thunderclap is such an amazing utility skill without simply relying on it as a -20% attack speed to a single target.

 

◊ Turik

Probably because Paladins cant use daggers, and they suck for devestate.

 

◊ Fellwraith

There's good reasons for that. Daggers are absolutely horrible for devastate. They get a default AP speed multiplier of 1.7 vs 2.4 for axes, swords and maces. Even if they are 1.4 speed vs the 1.6 you have on the other tanking weapons, the AP speed multiplier should outweigh the bonus Heroic Strike TPS. Daggers were ok before we got devastate, but they should be the last option we look at for tanking weapons, particularly when most of them are so fast now.

Brutalizer and Mallet of the Tides both reduce your opponent's chance to dodge, block, and parry. That's really important when you have to land a shield slam during an aggro transition. I would much rather have a guaranteed "snap" than save 3 talent points and 13 rage on my thunderclap (especially since I like several of the lower tier talents in Arms for tanking builds).

I'm sorry but I consider this weapon an antique, and I see very little math in this thread that proves to the contrary. I could just as easily point to the anecdotal evidence that our MT and I two-tanked Voidreaver last week. That doesn't mean Mallet of the Tides or Blazefury are superior tanking weapons, there's a lot of other factors that play into our threat generation.

 

Virac

According to some research by Theras (discussed here), this is now only a reduction of miss and dodge chance.

 

Meyla

I don't think TF is far superior then weapons like MotT/Brutalizer. If you got MotT and still want to get TF, leave it be. Honestly it's kinda waste of time, yes it's legendary, but MotT gives you much more with only 13rage more spent per 30s (if you are the one that refresh TC). Im using MotT and my TPS is fine always, dont think TF would change anything.

 

mils

Did some tests on morgrium last night and MotT generated more TPS than TF. That was well into the encounter too so standard cast cycle rotation. Was not hard to get Tclap efficiently into the cast cycle for the mallet and it had a higher TPS average than TF. (using omen)

Also at one point when I have the mallet equipped I reached ~150 hitpoints, which if TF was equipped would have been lights out...

TF has finally been shelved

 

D4vE

I never thought about it in terms of AP normalization to be honest, the difference in devastate damage is 25 dmg per devastate if you assume a 1k AP tank. Anyways nowadays my main agro generation seems to come from HS.

Analyzing one of our recent Gorefiend kills (since it is close to unlimited rage scenario): Loading...

Obould did 69 devastates, with a dagger he would have done 1725 damage (2579 threat) less.

Changing from a 1.6 speed weapon to 1.4 speed weapon in theory with unlimited rage allows you to do 12.5% more HS. Means 14 more HS in above linked example, 2464 more damage (3683 threat) plus 4102 extra threat.

I do realize that faster HS speed is very hard to "model" and only starts to shine when you have unlimited rage (hence above given example is very much in favor for HS). But generally assuming it sucks because of a (in my opinion) crappy 0.35 modifier for your AP, which is relevant for exactly 1 of your agro moves, is a bit quick on the trigger.


And I never claimed TF to be superior in any way, but for looks maybe =)
In fact I did state quite the opposite. Yes it is antique, but it also still is a fantastic tank weapon and I love to have it in certain situations, like in the examples above. This is also the reason I passed all mallets and brutalizers to our other tanks, as soon as those are equipped I will pick up one myself and will have a direct comparison.

TF is clearly not worth farming for nowadays, but if you have farmed MC for 1 year to get your hands on one, it's really hard to let go. Since it is still performing equally or just slightly worse than TBC loot, "legendary" is truly the right description =)