[Healer] Meta Gem Selection - Page 2

CasT · 04/05/07, 6:50 AM

Originally Posted by sulliwan

I have 18 stam and 5% stun resist on my healing helmet because no matter how I tried to set up the 10 gems in my healing gear, it would have always meant a far greater loss of healing capability from using the gems to meet requirements for either Bracing or Insightful Earthstorm Diamond than I would have gained from the meta.
The easiest way to get requirements for Bracing is probably using 1 Luminous Noble Topaz and Teardrop Living ruby in all other sockets, but for my gear that would have meant losing pretty much all the socketbonuses which add up for more than the gain from the meta is.
The requirements for healing gems are totally ridiculous, with the exception of maybe paladins, I don't see any healer using yellow gems in their healing gear. And even for paladins, I'm pretty sure Royal Nightseye or Teardrop Living Ruby is a superior choice over Gleaming Dawnstone or Luminous Noble Topaz.

I am starting to lean away from the 5% stun resist. As a resto pvp druid my goal is to never put my self in the stun position. I think that 5% on spellcast or every 20th cast will reduce my HT till the speed of 1.5s or 1s regrowth will be of more value.

This is ofc just a thought that im working on atm. Testing needs to be done before a final verdict.

CasT · 04/05/07, 7:01 AM

Originally Posted by sulliwan

I have 18 stam and 5% stun resist on my healing helmet because no matter how I tried to set up the 10 gems in my healing gear, it would have always meant a far greater loss of healing capability from using the gems to meet requirements for either Bracing or Insightful Earthstorm Diamond than I would have gained from the meta.
The easiest way to get requirements for Bracing is probably using 1 Luminous Noble Topaz and Teardrop Living ruby in all other sockets, but for my gear that would have meant losing pretty much all the socketbonuses which add up for more than the gain from the meta is.
The requirements for healing gems are totally ridiculous, with the exception of maybe paladins, I don't see any healer using yellow gems in their healing gear. And even for paladins, I'm pretty sure Royal Nightseye or Teardrop Living Ruby is a superior choice over Gleaming Dawnstone or Luminous Noble Topaz.

I am starting to lean away from the 5% stun resist. As a resto pvp druid my goal is to never put my self in the stun position. I think that 5% on spellcast or every 20th cast will reduce my HT till the speed of 1.5s or 1s regrowth will be of more value.

This is ofc just a thought that im working on atm. Testing needs to be done before a final verdict.

• Playered · 04/05/07, 8:17 AM

As a Druid I have really quite slow heals, I also tend to chain off a couple of instants alot.
Mystical Starfire Diamond has low requirements, a unique proc im unable to get elsewhere, and it allows me to 'break the barrier' of my slow spells often. I really doubt I would give it up currently, Insightful Earthstorm Diamond really interests me as I am a mana regen junky however the functionality of this gem suits me in other ways, heck I rarely run low on mana either thanks to consumables + bangle/innervate.

Rogar · 04/05/07, 3:18 PM

After using the Insightful Earthstorm Diamond for a few weeks, one of our druids has concluded it's not worth keeping. Given the amount of HoTs he uses compared to other classes, if "buy 50 get 1 free" isn't good enough for a druid, I don't see how could it possibly be better for other healers.

According to wowhead, the Mystical Skyfire Diamond's procbuff only lasts 4 seconds. That doesn't lend itself to manipulating the five-second rule.

Anyone know of a site where you can model and validate various gem combinations in gear, including socket and metagem bonuses? Something graphical like wowhead's talent calculator, but in the context of sockets would be very welcome. Hell, even a spreadsheet would be great -- anything where I can easily compare the various permutations available. Something like this, which I painstakingly crunched myself with 6 sockets and 3 socket bonuses:

80 heal, 6 mana/5, 23 int
63 heal, 12 mana/5, 18 sta
54 heal, 6 mana/5, 23 int, 18 sta
45 heal, 6 mana/5, 8 int, 42 sta
36 heal, 4 mana/5, 8 int, 54 sta
27 heal, 2 mana/5, 8 int, 66 sta

I didn't include the 2% reduced threat or the 5% stun resist because neither really matters in the current raiding content.

Xoya · 04/05/07, 3:48 PM

Not to derail, and if there's a better thread for this please point me to it, but seeing as I am finally getting to the point where I'm starting to get some good socketed gear I'd like to know how many hitpoints I should be looking for. This relates to the topic in that some of you have discussed using the stam meta gem so that you can stack healing/mp5 elsewhere once you've gotten to this hitpoint minimum. What's the hitpoint minimum most of you are going for?

Xelopheris · 04/05/07, 5:08 PM

Your 6.6k is a very good base amount to go for before buffs. Looking at your guild progression, the biggest amount of damage you'll be taking any time soon is from Aran. With 6k health, you can survive one nuke, and get a LHW off on yourself before the next. With your gear and spec, you hit for a minimum of 1700 with a max rank LHW. With a fort buff and MotW on top of that, you'll easily be able to survive a second nuke. If he gets a third off on you, then tell your people in interrupts to do their job, and your other healers.

Xoya · 04/05/07, 6:24 PM

I guess I must have logged out with my stam gear on last night. In my "normal" healing gear I have only 6179 unbuffed, but I do sacrifice a little regen and healing for stam as needed. How about unbuffed hitpoints for just trash and the like? In a few weeks we should be starting Gruul's Lair, so I am really looking to get the best stats I can in that time, from heroics and gems as needed.

SindirHH · 04/05/07, 7:31 PM

I currently have the Insightful Earthstorm Diamond, and just like our clearcasting talents you can go on strings of having it proc 5ish times per fight. That is very nice to have, I personally love it.

◊ Tanilin · 04/05/07, 7:40 PM

Originally Posted by Xoya

I guess I must have logged out with my stam gear on last night. In my "normal" healing gear I have only 6179 unbuffed, but I do sacrifice a little regen and healing for stam as needed. How about unbuffed hitpoints for just trash and the like? In a few weeks we should be starting Gruul's Lair, so I am really looking to get the best stats I can in that time, from heroics and gems as needed.

I am currently running around 6k unbuffed for most fights (roughly 7.2k buffed with fort and mark). This is my main healing suit. I swap in a +48 sta offhand when I'm doing heroics or slightly more difficult fights.

On "you really need hp fights" (i.e, Aran), I swap in sta gear to get up to 8 or 8.5k. I expect to do the same (or slightly more) for Gruul. I have an arena set which gets me up to 9k unbuffed, so it's just a matter of deciding how much I need the sta.

Kass · 04/06/07, 6:48 PM

I believe this question has essentially already been answered…

From the first page of the Healing Trinket Selection thread:

Originally Posted by Praetorian

For me, Scarab of the Infinite Cycle ( http://www.thottbot.com/?i=59592 ) is, in practice, one of the best trinkets I've ever had. It's going to be very, very hard to replace.

Take a look at the Procs and you’ll see that the Mystical Skyfire Diamond and the Scarab of the Infinite Cycle basically follow the same concept. With a very easy gem requirement to meet as a Priest (since we basically go Red or Blue or Purple), the Mystical Skyfire Diamond becomes the obvious best choice if you have relatively balanced gear to start with. By balanced gear, I mean you have enough Stamina to actually live, and enough +Healing that the only reason you’d need more is because you’re addicted to +Healing.

Additionally, there really is no reason for a raiding spec Priest to run out of mana. Smart talent selection, heal choice and proper timing of Shadow Fiends, Inner Focus, and Potions should always keep a Priest with enough mana to last a long encounter. Sure some days I chug more and/or bigger Potions than others, but as my GL always says, it does a healer and a raid no extra benefit to end the fight with 80% mana. For me the Insightful Earthstorm Diamond was never an option when compared with the Mystical Skyfire Diamond and the Bracing Earthstorm Diamond.

I had initially considered taking the Bracing Earthstorm Diamond over the Mystical Skyfire Diamond, but after reading the Healer Trinket thread, I realized the benefit of the cast proc over 26+ Healing. Don't get me wrong, I'd love the 2% threat redux, but like someone said above...in a raiding environment, that shouldn't be an issue.

CheshireCat · 04/09/07, 12:57 PM

Originally Posted by Kass

I believe this question has essentially already been answered…

From the first page of the Healing Trinket Selection thread:

Take a look at the Procs and you’ll see that the Mystical Skyfire Diamond and the Scarab of the Infinite Cycle basically follow the same concept. With a very easy gem requirement to meet as a Priest (since we basically go Red or Blue or Purple), the Mystical Skyfire Diamond becomes the obvious best choice if you have relatively balanced gear to start with. By balanced gear, I mean you have enough Stamina to actually live, and enough +Healing that the only reason you’d need more is because you’re addicted to +Healing.

Additionally, there really is no reason for a raiding spec Priest to run out of mana. Smart talent selection, heal choice and proper timing of Shadow Fiends, Inner Focus, and Potions should always keep a Priest with enough mana to last a long encounter. Sure some days I chug more and/or bigger Potions than others, but as my GL always says, it does a healer and a raid no extra benefit to end the fight with 80% mana. For me the Insightful Earthstorm Diamond was never an option when compared with the Mystical Skyfire Diamond and the Bracing Earthstorm Diamond.

I had initially considered taking the Bracing Earthstorm Diamond over the Mystical Skyfire Diamond, but after reading the Healer Trinket thread, I realized the benefit of the cast proc over 26+ Healing. Don't get me wrong, I'd love the 2% threat redux, but like someone said above...in a raiding environment, that shouldn't be an issue.

This was my original conclusion as well, and starting from the same data point-- My Scarab had convinced me that fast cast heals are a pretty incredible utility boost. (And my socket situation was such that the 26 healing/2% threat and the int/mana return gems were either impossible or would have required significant sacrifice to make them useful.)

However, I'm yet to be completely convinced after a night or two of raiding with my new gem. The proc rate is definitely high enough to be useful, but the short duration makes it difficult to actually land a useful heal-- if no one needs a heal right when it goes off, the proc will go to waste.

Since my only practical alternative with any foreseeable gear set is the stam/stun resist gem, I'm going to stick with it for a while.

It helps on some fights more than others-- anything with damage spread out among several players, or a tank in danger of spike death, is going to benefit a lot more than a tank taking predictable damage.

◊ Tanilin · 04/09/07, 3:17 PM

I'm happy enough with the Mystical Skyfire Gem in my T4 hat that I will probably always use it in my healing set. A lot of the procs go to waste, but it has saved a few tank deaths already (or at least scary moments), which is good enough for me.

• moz · 04/09/07, 3:48 PM

Gem selection is pretty straightforward for paladins (at least I think so) and match up well to some of the more desirable meta-gems.

I had no issue putting a bracing earthstorm diamond in my T4 helm, due to the fact that the only gems I really use are +18 healing (red) and +8/10 spell crit (yellow). I also have the gem from Ramparts (11 heal/4 spell crit) which is excellent and also orange. This works fine with my Gladiator's stuff too since I use the same gems (weighted more for spell crit) -- so I plan to pop a destructive earthstorm diamond in the Gladiator's hat when I get it. After thinking it over when I first started socketing my gear I can see how it would get annoying real fast for some other classes and their respective gem selections though :o.

• Erongg · 06/13/07, 8:59 PM

Bit of a thread res here...I socketed a Mystical Skyfire gem about a week ago and I just can't say enough about it. It goes off all the time, has no internal cooldown, procs off of anything (water shield, totems, etc), and seriously helps on many AoE encounters. 1.3 second Chain Heals are just fantastic. It dwarfs the effect of the Scarab of the Infinite Cycle. It would be a hard sell to get me to choose a different meta gem.

Ragnor · 06/14/07, 2:39 AM

You should have seen it before the haste nerfs in 2.1

but yeah it's still the best meta gem imo, at least for paladins and shaman.

subscience · 06/14/07, 2:50 AM

Mystical Skyfire Diamond is amazing. It reduces GCD (I can spam back to back R1 HWs, 1.0s cast, if this procs between), seems to have no-or-low internal cooldown (I've had near back-to-back procs), and is definitely tits for PvP healing or any fight you have to spam heals (CH on Hydross).

CasT · 06/14/07, 3:36 AM

Best of all: It reduces cast time of Hearth Stone to five seconds ^^

Phun · 06/14/07, 5:00 AM

Originally Posted by subscience

Mystical Skyfire Diamond is amazing. It reduces GCD (I can spam back to back R1 HWs, 1.0s cast, if this procs between), seems to have no-or-low internal cooldown (I've had near back-to-back procs), and is definitely tits for PvP healing or any fight you have to spam heals (CH on Hydross).

Does it really reduce GCD? If this is true, that would be the selling point for me. In case I'm spamming heals back to back and happen to start a 0.75s Flash Heal after it procs, will I be able to move seamlessly into a new heal without waiting for the GCD?

subscience · 06/14/07, 11:01 AM

Originally Posted by Phun

Does it really reduce GCD? If this is true, that would be the selling point for me. In case I'm spamming heals back to back and happen to start a 0.75s Flash Heal after it procs, will I be able to move seamlessly into a new heal without waiting for the GCD?

That is the behaviour that I have noticed, yes. Like I said above, I like to spam 1.0s Healing Waves to put up Healing Way / Ancestral Healing on the tank and when I get a Skyfire proc between 1.0s casts, I can fire them off back to back, immediately. I usually cannot do this due to GCD (and my latency is usually under 80ms).

Edit- As far as I can tell, it looks like it resets GCD completely, but I can fully test this theory later when I get home.

Shakkha · 06/14/07, 11:49 AM

Originally Posted by Phun

Does it really reduce GCD? If this is true, that would be the selling point for me. In case I'm spamming heals back to back and happen to start a 0.75s Flash Heal after it procs, will I be able to move seamlessly into a new heal without waiting for the GCD?

no it does not.

I used to have it on my old T4 helm, i haven't cut back one yet, but i will do it once i get T5 helm, because it is an amazing gem.

Anyway when it proced and i would do a FoL right after (usually because i had launched it before realizing i had focus), i got hit after the FoL by the GCD, because FoL becomes 0.75sec cast time spell.

So i'm sorry but it does not reduce the GCD.

Ragnor · 06/14/07, 7:05 PM

Pretty sure it doesn't bypass GCD... will check later when I get home

subscience · 06/15/07, 2:53 PM

Originally Posted by Shakkha

no it does not.

I used to have it on my old T4 helm, i haven't cut back one yet, but i will do it once i get T5 helm, because it is an amazing gem.

Anyway when it proced and i would do a FoL right after (usually because i had launched it before realizing i had focus), i got hit after the FoL by the GCD, because FoL becomes 0.75sec cast time spell.

So i'm sorry but it does not reduce the GCD.

I didn't mean that it reduces GCD on the current spell- I mean that I've experienced behaviour that reduces GCD on the spell that proc'ed the gem and the subsequent hasted spell can be fired off before your normal 1.5s GCD.

Floria · 06/15/07, 3:24 PM

There's been a lot of confusion about Haste effects. Most likely what is going on is simply latency. Your 1.5 second casts are being drawn out to closer to 2.0 second casts due to a bit of lag, and when haste happens, your cast is shortened to 0.75 seconds, which is then drawn out to 1.25 seconds or so. Close enough to the GCD that you don't really hit it, but you notice a difference.

Back before the GCD being 1.5 seconds, people used to cite 2.0 seconds for a similar reason, and it took many Blue posts before people would believe it. Thorough testing has shown that only Bloodlust reduces the GCD, and that other haste effects are wasted on 1.5 second/instant casts except to make up loss due to latency.

Starfire · 06/15/07, 5:06 PM

Insightful Earthstorm Diamond - Well, the requirements are much easier to get now, its just 2 red, 2 blue, 2 yellow.

Okay, so, getting 2 red/blue is well... easy. I lucked out on the yellow, between Exodar-Life Staff and Doomwalker's Legs both require 1 yellow gem for their socket bonus (2mp5 for the staff, +9 healing for the legs).

I'll say this much, I do not believe Insightful Earthstorm has a hidden cooldown of any signifance. I got 2 procs within 3 casts my first night having this metagem in Tempest Keep.

I think it is quite nice for my "shifting" playstyle. There is one thing to note. Well, speculation right now, but I -will- keep a closer eye on this. I do believe the procs I mentioned earlier both came from circle of healing, so, maybe that has something to do with it.

My views on a "proc" haste are rather... poor. I know haste rating would be good, but procced haste is "meh" to me. If I am renew spamming, haste rating won't do anything. If I am healing the main tank, very rarely am I ever spamming, I am usually casting and cancelling. Only time I am truely spamming is for trash cleanup duty with flash heal.

I just don't think it is a proc I can use. I won't need to cast super fast everytime.

SindirHH · 06/17/07, 3:57 AM

Insightful is where it is at! I had it when it was 5 per color and the socketing was painful, I switched to the haste proc, and sure it was nice, but nothing like having to cast a heal in... 4-5 seconds? There are often times where I pause in healing to regen and it always seemed to proc during that time.