gophermunchr

Do you have a link? I'm sitting on 8.64% to hit, 2600 ap 40%crit unbuffed. I can go much higher on crit and ap if I ditched my 2 piece wastewalker but I would like to see some information before I go about resocketing

 

dukes

 

• sadris

Been working on this lately (not much though). Requires Java 1.6 most likely, you might be able to get by with Java 1.5. It does not support dodge(s). It applies all Rip damage in one chunk, rather than over 12 seconds. And it does not support haste, yet.

(This is very much still a work in progress!)

Extract it to a directory then run "java -cp . KittyLitter" from a command line.
You change your runtime parameters in the kl.cfg file, take all measurements in cat form.

Source code is included, if anyone wants to tell me why the white melee DPS % of total is so high

http://murtos.com/kittylitter.zip

'[The main argument against gay-marriage] always revolves around ... "the gay agenda"... Apparently all these gays only want to get married so they can adopt children, turn the children gay (probably using their mystic gay voodoo, passed gayly down from one gay generation to the next), and perpetuate their gayness.'
-- rantingkitten

 

dukes

I'll have a look at in a bit Sadris, need to finish the raid.

Just finishing an SSC clear (not a good raid for doing Illidan attempts so we're doing ssc instead) and managed to get 6th on DPS on lurker: http://homepage.ntlworld.com/graham....ff/lurker2.jpg . I was flasked (the rest weren't) but I was "tanking" the ranged adds in DPS gear, so I lost out on quite a lot then. I also wasn't powershifting (still need to get used to doing that) so I could've pulled out quite a lot more DPS. Towneh only beat me because of shadowfiend damage, nerf pets! :p

One side effect was this (the rip tick is without mangle debuff, for referrence). Rather fun :>

 

Malazaar

I have a couple of questions:

- why do you count mangle as 35 energy (2pc t6 included ?).
- as far as i see it you don't use the standard cycle, storing 81+ energy before ripping, why ?

- your white damage is so high because you completely disregard glancing blows.
- rip is 30 energy, not 35.
- you always calculate full rip damage, even with only 4 cp.
- white hits are only on one hitcheck, along with glancing and crit.

 

HaklePrime

http://www.juggernautguild.com/wws/w...29/arkadu.html

God I miss pots stacking

I think my Rips are topping out around 900 lately, that's with Mangle of course. I don't use flasks however, been sticking to Maj Agi/Fort, could probably push it a bit higher with that I assume.

 

• sadris

- why do you count mangle as 35 energy (2pc t6 included ?).
Fixed
- as far as i see it you don't use the standard cycle, storing 81+ energy before ripping, why ?
Added check for 75 energy before ripping

- your white damage is so high because you completely disregard glancing blows.
- rip is 30 energy, not 35.
- you always calculate full rip damage, even with only 4 cp.
Fixed

Original zipfile updated. Added support for Omen of Clarity at 2 PPM, glancing blows, and Haste rating.

 

Boevis

Why wouldn't you wait for 98-100 Energy before ripping? It's the only way to guarantee that you can build to 5 CPs with shred effected by mangle debuff. Yes, 0 crits is unlikely, but it does happen. 12.96% chance to not get a crit on your first 4 moves with 40% crit, 4% chance for Malorne 2/5, 3.3% chance for OOC, both of which result in a shred that can crit so 5.6% and 4.67% respectively so combined total of ~2.7% chance to require 5 specials I guess.

Pick your poison I guess

 

• sadris

Malorne or Omen of Clarity could proc and you could end up wasting energy regen ticks.

 

FunBall

For Omen of Clarity, you don't gain energy, so if that's a concern, you rip within 1 second of the energy tick to 81+, and you'll get off your mangle before energy ticks up again.

 

Boevis

Hmm, I guess. Counting Malorne and OOC (as a 2ppm) you drop to ~5% chance to not get 5 CPs in 4 abilities, vs the 7.3% chance of wasting energy tics.

 

Solstice

Incidentally, why 81 energy? Rip + mangle leaves you with 11 energy, and during the 12 seconds of mangle uptime you'll gain 120 energy assuming no Malorne proc. That's 131 energy for possibly 4 shreds. Even if you assume an extra energy tick between rip and mangle you'd still need to start on 98 energy to be certain, and that's not even accounting for misses.

I usually aim for 77+ just to be sure that if the first mangle misses I have energy to reapply before rip ticks.

 

Malazaar

81+ energy, because that is how far you can get w/o wasting energy from natural ticks. When you have 81 Energy and wait, you would have 101 with the next tick.

Ofc it's rather 81-100 energy in reality, but you can't always get to 98 energy w/o wasting some.

 

Boevis

That's why I powershift, the most I'll ever waste is 1 energy from a random +21 energy tic. 100 energy at the start of the cycle, every time.

One other reason why I favor hit and +skill on my gear is that with power shifting, while it only costs "8 energy" when you miss a shred, it pushes your cycle back 2 seconds, effectively making a miss cost 20 energy for the purposes of powershifting.

 

dukes

http://elitistjerks.com/showpost.php...&postcount=248

How the hell do you get 900 (unless you have 4 piece t6 already and even then I only get ~800 from my 700 max tick)? I only got 700 because of Blood Frenzy, but I see no way in which you could (consistently) get mangle to double-stack and so give the bugged effect (and if you know how, share! :p ).

I always use Major Agi/Fort (apart from learning, in which case I use "free" flasks if I have them), but I managed to misclick a Relentless Assault with a mark of the illidari instead of a flask of fort - seemed like a good time to use it. I need to start carrying Insane Strength pots round too (~450 AP extra with all the bonuses stacked).


I normally just wait for 70+ energy before using rip->mangle. Any more than that and there's too much chance of a wasted OoC or 2t4 proc, or having to move out of range because you just got hit by an AoE and wasting a couple of ticks (god I hate the illidari council as melee).

 

Valerian

Im pretty sure haste potions are better than insane strength potions. Insane strength is an average of 15 Str added (if chain potting) and Haste is 50 Haste rating. Haste rating can be worth a third of what str is in AP equiv terms (its worth more than that Im pretty sure) and still comes out ahead.

 

Calgar

Thought i'd throw this up here for my brother's sake. WWS report of our second Tidewalker kill, with a feral druid on full DPS duty.

722 DPS, with some hurricane usage on the murlocs...he actually managed to beat me somehow.

http://www.lossendil.com/wws/?report...&s=14502-15068

 

FunBall

Actually, I wonder if there's a bug at times for rip. My rips with mangle usually top out around 690 per tick raid buffed to the max. Every once in a while, I've had them tick for 750-790 for no apparent reason on Vashj. Am I missing a buff that would cause it to increase? In this screenshot, I have the haste buff from the Abacus of Violent Odds, but that shouldn't affect my rip tick, should it?

This has happened twice.

 

Immortal

I've noticed something strange happening to rip too when was checking WWS parse from SSC raid.

http://lossendil.com/wws/?report=ij4...bvgw&a=1&dth=0
Unfortunately i don't remember was that bear or a warrior tanking this mob.

 

dukes

Valerian: True, haste are probably better. I was mis-remembering insane str as being 150 str, rather than 120 (which makes them ~360 AP, not ~450). Luckily I haven't made any insane str yet, will test out with some haste pots next Gorefiend and see what it's like (haste + bloodlust + drums of battle, mmm)

Mangle definitely bugs on occasion, I just don't know how to get it to do it consistently. I suppose if it was consistent, people would start to know about it and then it would get fixed anyway.

As for Vashj, I have no idea what was going on there for you. Haste shouldn't be affecting DoT ticks in any way.

It may be something similar to the effect of Seal of Light bugging with Unstable Affliction - something that looks like it's COMPLETELY unrelated is causing something to screw up and gives Rip more damage.

 

FunBall

I figured if we get a few people posting their unusual rips, buffs, and mob debuffs, we might see something common causing the effect. Whatever it is adds approximately 20% (at least in the above occassion) to the rip tick.

It's almost certainly a bug, but it'd be nice to find what causes it.

 

• Falk

It seems to be poor server side coding of Mangle in general. I noticed this happening when you apply a mangle buff right as one is fading, before the first tick of a rip (I'm not 100% certain if this part is relevant). The inverse has also happens more frequently, where Mangle is up but Rip isn't getting its bonus at all. It's too tricky to duplicate 100% of the time, unlike the other hilarious mangle-related bug.

If you're curious, that second bug I'm referring to is being patched soon according to Hortus, but what happens is you can mangle a mob and click another mob INSTANTLY after you hit your mangle button. Half of the time, you'll mangle your old target, and the mangle debuff will appear on the new target a fraction of the second later, pulling it, irregardless of range or LOS. It works 100% of the time if your mangle kills off the old target. Hopefully we do Karazhan again before the next patch. I want to see if I can ninja-pull Midnight while the raid's killing the first horse.

Edit: here's a vid of it -> http://www.mediafire.com/?ftbvxvjzxbt

/endderail

 

Malazaar

That is definately hilarious - and quite easy to reproduce.

 

HaklePrime

I never said it was the norm :P Hence the word choice of 'topping out'. When all the stars align, and trinkets are procced/popped, and every melee DPS group buff is present, including hunter expose weakness and super-buffed warrior BS (courtesy of Solarion's Sapphire), our AP totals get sickeningly high. I would say my average is high 600s. (Rip tic that is)

Myself, I don't bother waiting for any energy higher than 51. Too many wasted procs, wasted time, etc. I take the Tony Robbins approach to my DPS cycles, that is to say, I know that at least one of my specials will crit in that 12 second window, it just has to. If I didn't will it hard enough, I just powershift before Mangle drops, no biggie.

Edit : Just browsed a few of our WWS, and the 800-900 rips don't appear to be fight specific either, nor were all of them with more than one potential source of Mangle.

 

Meddler

Something I've been pondering recently is the value of -AC relative to other available stats, in particular the Icon of Unyielding Courage as a possible cat trinket (+30hit, -600 AC on target for 20 secs on use, 2 min cooldown).

Did some very rough calculations as below:

Taking 2000 AC as a theoretical boss AC level after normal debuffs that's about 15% reduction, use the trinket and this drops down to 1400/11.7% reduction. This means incoming damage (that's mitigated by AC) increases from 85% to 88.3%, a 3.9% increase.

At 600 sustained dps if we assume that 20% of that is from rip then that's 0.039*500*20, another 390 damage over 20 seconds every two minutes which seems pretty poor when compared to alternatives like the Hourglass, Bloodlust Broach or even say Romulo's Poison Vial.

Up the level of dps to an optimistic 1000 (and assume a bleed immune mob) and we get 0.039*1000*20=780 damage in exchange for a two minute cooldown. Starting to look competitive with say the Poison Vial, assuming you see two procs per minute off it, but for a feral able to maintain that level of dps without rip there should be far better choices available.

Anyone able to point out any massive flaws in the above? I realise taking average sustained dps and multiplying by 20's a pretty rough method and doesn't really account very well for actual fight patterns, to be fair other clickable trinkets would also experience the same sort of issues though (waiting till a full energy bar before using any of them for example). Immediate conclusion seems to me that the Icon at least simply isn't worth the bother. Higher level items with -AC as a smaller part of the total item budget I can see as having some merit, given feral dps levels aren't up there with other top physical damage dealers (and a significant part of our dps comes from rip usually) however it still doesn't seem all that attractive a stat for the foreseeable to me. Anyone got any comments/counterarguements/explanations of points I've got drastically wrong?