[Rogue]: Rupture Formula

Ghond · 05/26/07, 9:46 PM

Does anyone know what the Formula for determing how much your rupture ticks for is?

Tried searching thru the forums for it..but had no luck.

Saeryn · 05/26/07, 10:30 PM

Rupture Average: (1000 + .24*AP)*MangleBuff*SerratedBladesBuff

Not my math, for the record. Pulled it from http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/th...sid=1&pageNo=1

nachrichter · 05/26/07, 10:35 PM

I believe it used to be base + 0.24*AP, but I don't know if it's changed since 2.0. I haven't been able to make myself level my rogue past 62, so haven't got anything to check that against.

On that note, though, it was my understanding that Rip had the same base+0.24*AP formula at lvl60. I have played my druid a great deal, and with ~2300ap a mangled rip (+30% dmg) does ~3k damage over 12seconds. At ( 1092 + X*AP ) * 1.3 * 1.1, X ends up being around 0.44. Unless I'm missing something, that's a large change. Hence my concern that the Rupture formula has changed on me when I wasn't looking.

Ichichop · 05/26/07, 10:56 PM

Is there a coefficient on AP based on the number of CP you have? Otherwise rupture would eventually scale to the point where you would only want to use 1cp ruptures..

ex:
(1000 + 0.24*AP)*MangleBuff*SerratedBladesBuff
vs
(1000 + (0.2*CP)*0.24*AP)*MangleBuff*SerratedBladesBuff

Trilly · 05/26/07, 10:57 PM

I posted some numbers a few weeks ago in this thread.

To recap:

5 cp Rupture (1564 AP) - 180/tick (8 tick) = 1440 damage
5 cp Rupture (1564 AP) w/ FindWeakness - 199/tick (8 tick) = 1592 damage

5 cp Rupture (1834 AP) - 189/tick (8 tick) = 1512 damage
5 cp Rupture (1834 AP) w/ FindWeakness - 208/tick (8 tick) = 1664 damage

Is there a coefficient on AP based on the number of CP you have?

The ticks were slightly different when I was using <5 cp's, so I believe so.

Athinira · 05/26/07, 10:58 PM

Yes there is a difference. Druids Rip use the same scaling btw. but im not sure of the exact number for lower ranks.

nachrichter · 05/26/07, 11:08 PM

5 cp Rupture (1564 AP) - 180/tick (8 tick) = 1440 damage
5 cp Rupture (1564 AP) w/ FindWeakness - 199/tick (8 tick) = 1592 damage

5 cp Rupture (1834 AP) - 189/tick (8 tick) = 1512 damage
5 cp Rupture (1834 AP) w/ FindWeakness - 208/tick (8 tick) = 1664 damage

(1440 - 1000) / 1564 = 0.2813
( (1592 / 1.1) - 1000 ) / 1564 = 0.2860

(1512 - 1000) / 1834 = 0.2792
( (1664 / 1.1) - 1000) / 1834 = 0.2796

I'll go grab some actual Rip numbers, for science.

Saeryn · 05/26/07, 11:20 PM

Combo points invested definitely affect damage per tic. Tested on the Unliving Residents outside Kara about 15 seconds ago. My rupture ticks for 96-97 with one combo point invested and 171-172 with five invested. I have 1542 AP at the moment.

I'll go ahead and see if it stays consistent while I'm waiting outside.

Ghond · 05/26/07, 11:40 PM

Originally Posted by Saeryn

Rupture Average: (1000 + .24*AP)*MangleBuff*SerratedBladesBuff

Not my math, for the record. Pulled it from http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/th...sid=1&pageNo=1

I really like the comparitive math this guy did here. One thing i was curious about is how accurate is his Rupture damage forumula?

I'll have to go and play around with it to see if i can correctly model this in game.

Ghond · 05/26/07, 11:46 PM

Originally Posted by Ichichop

Is there a coefficient on AP based on the number of CP you have? Otherwise rupture would eventually scale to the point where you would only want to use 1cp ruptures..

ex:
(1000 + 0.24*AP)*MangleBuff*SerratedBladesBuff
vs
(1000 + (0.2*CP)*0.24*AP)*MangleBuff*SerratedBladesBuff

I'm not sure what the exact coefficient is. But in my bit of expirementing...
I found that as you go from 1cp to 5cp you get much more damage per tick.

From 1 -> 2, small increase
From 2 -> 3, small increase
From 3 -> 4, large increase
From 4 -> 5, medium increase

Not quite exact numbers, but the idea is if your going to be running a rupture that goes its full length, you should always use 5cp and if you don't NEVER go less than 4cp.

nachrichter · 05/26/07, 11:48 PM

More data would be great. Trilly's numbers came out to ~0.28 coefficient, unless I'm missing a multiplier somewhere, or some other relevant factor.

Have some Rip numbers to post, working out coefficients, atm.

nachrichter · 05/27/07, 12:07 AM

2303ap, no mangle
5cp 405/406 ticks :: ~2433dmg :: ( 2433 / 1.1 - 1092 ) / 2303 = 0.4862
4cp 351/352 ticks :: ~2109dmg ::  ( 2109 / 1.1 - 894 ) / 2303 = 0.4443
3cp 270/271 ticks :: ~1623dmg ::  ( 1623 / 1.1 - 696 ) / 2303 = 0.3385
2cp 189/190 ticks :: ~1137dmg ::  ( 1137 / 1.1 - 498 ) / 2303 = 0.2326
1cp 108/109 ticks ::  ~651dmg ::   ( 651 / 1.1 - 300 ) / 2303 = 0.1267

2303ap, mangled
5cp 527/528 :: 3165 :: ( 3165 / 1.3 / 1.1 - 1092 ) / 2303 = 0.4869
4cp 456/457 :: 2739 ::  ( 2739 / 1.3 / 1.1 - 894 ) / 2303 = 0.4435
3cp 351/352 :: 2109 ::  ( 2109 / 1.3 / 1.1 - 696 ) / 2303 = 0.3382
2cp 246/247 :: 1479 ::  ( 1479 / 1.3 / 1.1 - 498 ) / 2303 = 0.2329
1cp 141/142 ::  849 ::   ( 849 / 1.3 / 1.1 - 300 ) / 2303 = 0.1275

1711ap, no mangle
5cp 378/379 :: 2271 :: 0.5684
4cp 323/324 :: 1941 :: 0.5088
3cp 249/250 :: 1497 :: 0.3886
2cp 175/176 :: 1053 :: 0.2684
1cp 101/102 ::  609 :: 0.1482

1711ap, mangled
5cp 491/492 :: 2949 :: 0.5671
4cp 421/422 :: 2529 :: 0.5111
3cp 324/325 :: 1947 :: 0.3890
2cp 228/229 :: 1371 :: 0.2693
1cp 132/133 ::  795 :: 0.1496

So, that's consistent one way, and not another, and it's probably going to take someone more creative than I am to resolve the rest of that question.

Rip tooltip
5cp 1092
4cp 894
3cp 696
2cp 498
1cp 300

• Aldriana · 05/27/07, 4:03 AM

Looks to me like the base damage of Rip is not what we've been postulating. Based on that data set, we see that increasing AP by 592 increases the damage of 5pt Rip by ~162. This means each AP is increasing the damage of a 5pt rupture by roughly 162/592 = .274 damage; but that's after the 10% bonus, so it's increasing the base damage by .249 per AP. Now, that looks a whole lot like it's supposed to be .25, so lets posit for the moment that the damage of a 5 point Rip is supposed to be X + .25 AP. Then 1.1 * (X + .25 * 2303) = 2433... solving for X yields ~1636.

Now, curiously enough, TT Rip is 1092, and 1.5 times 1092 is 1638 - very close to our number. So it looks to me like the base Rip damage is 50% higher than listed, and the actual Rip damage output is given by 1636 + .25*AP.

Lets check this for 1711 AP: 1638 + 1711/4 = 2066 - throw in the 10% bonus, and we have 2272 damage, which would indeed tick for 378 and 379. So it's at least plausible.

Unfortunately, the lower combo point numbers don't work out so elegantly, so this still isn't a full picture of what's going on; but for 5 combo points, 1.5*1092 + .25*AP seems accurate.

Latito · 05/27/07, 5:17 AM

One thing that many people seem to be missing is the fact that Rip lasts 12 seconds (6 ticks) no matter how many combo points, Rupture ticks longer with more combo points (4, 5, 6, 7 or 8 ticks). Obviously Rip ticks will increase substantially with more combo points when compared to Rupture which relies more on the increased number of ticks.

Grimmlokk · 05/27/07, 5:25 AM

Yeah Rupture's unmodified damage per tick only goes up by 11 per CP I believe. 5.5dps.