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-   -   [Rogue]: Rupture Formula (http://elitistjerks.com/f31/t12366-rogue_rupture_formula/)

 Ghond 05/26/07 9:46 PM

[Rogue]: Rupture Formula

Does anyone know what the Formula for determing how much your rupture ticks for is?

Tried searching thru the forums for it..but had no luck.

 Saeryn 05/26/07 10:30 PM

Not my math, for the record. Pulled it from http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/th...sid=1&pageNo=1

 nachrichter 05/26/07 10:35 PM

I believe it used to be base + 0.24*AP, but I don't know if it's changed since 2.0. I haven't been able to make myself level my rogue past 62, so haven't got anything to check that against.

On that note, though, it was my understanding that Rip had the same base+0.24*AP formula at lvl60. I have played my druid a great deal, and with ~2300ap a mangled rip (+30% dmg) does ~3k damage over 12seconds. At ( 1092 + X*AP ) * 1.3 * 1.1, X ends up being around 0.44. Unless I'm missing something, that's a large change. Hence my concern that the Rupture formula has changed on me when I wasn't looking.

 Ichichop 05/26/07 10:56 PM

Is there a coefficient on AP based on the number of CP you have? Otherwise rupture would eventually scale to the point where you would only want to use 1cp ruptures..

ex:
vs

 Trilly 05/26/07 10:57 PM

I posted some numbers a few weeks ago in this thread.

To recap:
Quote:
 5 cp Rupture (1564 AP) - 180/tick (8 tick) = 1440 damage 5 cp Rupture (1564 AP) w/ FindWeakness - 199/tick (8 tick) = 1592 damage 5 cp Rupture (1834 AP) - 189/tick (8 tick) = 1512 damage 5 cp Rupture (1834 AP) w/ FindWeakness - 208/tick (8 tick) = 1664 damage
Quote:
 Is there a coefficient on AP based on the number of CP you have?
The ticks were slightly different when I was using <5 cp's, so I believe so.

 Athinira 05/26/07 10:58 PM

Yes there is a difference. Druids Rip use the same scaling btw. but im not sure of the exact number for lower ranks.

 nachrichter 05/26/07 11:08 PM

Quote:
 5 cp Rupture (1564 AP) - 180/tick (8 tick) = 1440 damage 5 cp Rupture (1564 AP) w/ FindWeakness - 199/tick (8 tick) = 1592 damage 5 cp Rupture (1834 AP) - 189/tick (8 tick) = 1512 damage 5 cp Rupture (1834 AP) w/ FindWeakness - 208/tick (8 tick) = 1664 damage
(1440 - 1000) / 1564 = 0.2813
( (1592 / 1.1) - 1000 ) / 1564 = 0.2860

(1512 - 1000) / 1834 = 0.2792
( (1664 / 1.1) - 1000) / 1834 = 0.2796

I'll go grab some actual Rip numbers, for science.

 Saeryn 05/26/07 11:20 PM

Combo points invested definitely affect damage per tic. Tested on the Unliving Residents outside Kara about 15 seconds ago. My rupture ticks for 96-97 with one combo point invested and 171-172 with five invested. I have 1542 AP at the moment.

I'll go ahead and see if it stays consistent while I'm waiting outside.

 Ghond 05/26/07 11:40 PM

Quote:
 Originally Posted by Saeryn (Post 367278) Rupture Average: (1000 + .24*AP)*MangleBuff*SerratedBladesBuff Not my math, for the record. Pulled it from http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/th...sid=1&pageNo=1
I really like the comparitive math this guy did here. One thing i was curious about is how accurate is his Rupture damage forumula?

I'll have to go and play around with it to see if i can correctly model this in game.

 Ghond 05/26/07 11:46 PM

Quote:
 Originally Posted by Ichichop (Post 367286) Is there a coefficient on AP based on the number of CP you have? Otherwise rupture would eventually scale to the point where you would only want to use 1cp ruptures.. ex: (1000 + 0.24*AP)*MangleBuff*SerratedBladesBuff vs (1000 + (0.2*CP)*0.24*AP)*MangleBuff*SerratedBladesBuff

I'm not sure what the exact coefficient is. But in my bit of expirementing...
I found that as you go from 1cp to 5cp you get much more damage per tick.

From 1 -> 2, small increase
From 2 -> 3, small increase
From 3 -> 4, large increase
From 4 -> 5, medium increase

Not quite exact numbers, but the idea is if your going to be running a rupture that goes its full length, you should always use 5cp and if you don't NEVER go less than 4cp.

 nachrichter 05/26/07 11:48 PM

More data would be great. Trilly's numbers came out to ~0.28 coefficient, unless I'm missing a multiplier somewhere, or some other relevant factor.

Have some Rip numbers to post, working out coefficients, atm.

 nachrichter 05/27/07 12:07 AM

Code:

```2303ap, no mangle 5cp 405/406 ticks :: ~2433dmg :: ( 2433 / 1.1 - 1092 ) / 2303 = 0.4862 4cp 351/352 ticks :: ~2109dmg ::  ( 2109 / 1.1 - 894 ) / 2303 = 0.4443 3cp 270/271 ticks :: ~1623dmg ::  ( 1623 / 1.1 - 696 ) / 2303 = 0.3385 2cp 189/190 ticks :: ~1137dmg ::  ( 1137 / 1.1 - 498 ) / 2303 = 0.2326 1cp 108/109 ticks ::  ~651dmg ::  ( 651 / 1.1 - 300 ) / 2303 = 0.1267 2303ap, mangled 5cp 527/528 :: 3165 :: ( 3165 / 1.3 / 1.1 - 1092 ) / 2303 = 0.4869 4cp 456/457 :: 2739 ::  ( 2739 / 1.3 / 1.1 - 894 ) / 2303 = 0.4435 3cp 351/352 :: 2109 ::  ( 2109 / 1.3 / 1.1 - 696 ) / 2303 = 0.3382 2cp 246/247 :: 1479 ::  ( 1479 / 1.3 / 1.1 - 498 ) / 2303 = 0.2329 1cp 141/142 ::  849 ::  ( 849 / 1.3 / 1.1 - 300 ) / 2303 = 0.1275 1711ap, no mangle 5cp 378/379 :: 2271 :: 0.5684 4cp 323/324 :: 1941 :: 0.5088 3cp 249/250 :: 1497 :: 0.3886 2cp 175/176 :: 1053 :: 0.2684 1cp 101/102 ::  609 :: 0.1482 1711ap, mangled 5cp 491/492 :: 2949 :: 0.5671 4cp 421/422 :: 2529 :: 0.5111 3cp 324/325 :: 1947 :: 0.3890 2cp 228/229 :: 1371 :: 0.2693 1cp 132/133 ::  795 :: 0.1496```
So, that's consistent one way, and not another, and it's probably going to take someone more creative than I am to resolve the rest of that question.

Rip tooltip
5cp 1092
4cp 894
3cp 696
2cp 498
1cp 300

 Aldriana 05/27/07 4:03 AM

Looks to me like the base damage of Rip is not what we've been postulating. Based on that data set, we see that increasing AP by 592 increases the damage of 5pt Rip by ~162. This means each AP is increasing the damage of a 5pt rupture by roughly 162/592 = .274 damage; but that's after the 10% bonus, so it's increasing the base damage by .249 per AP. Now, that looks a whole lot like it's supposed to be .25, so lets posit for the moment that the damage of a 5 point Rip is supposed to be X + .25 AP. Then 1.1 * (X + .25 * 2303) = 2433... solving for X yields ~1636.

Now, curiously enough, TT Rip is 1092, and 1.5 times 1092 is 1638 - very close to our number. So it looks to me like the base Rip damage is 50% higher than listed, and the actual Rip damage output is given by 1636 + .25*AP.

Lets check this for 1711 AP: 1638 + 1711/4 = 2066 - throw in the 10% bonus, and we have 2272 damage, which would indeed tick for 378 and 379. So it's at least plausible.

Unfortunately, the lower combo point numbers don't work out so elegantly, so this still isn't a full picture of what's going on; but for 5 combo points, 1.5*1092 + .25*AP seems accurate.

 Latito 05/27/07 5:17 AM

One thing that many people seem to be missing is the fact that Rip lasts 12 seconds (6 ticks) no matter how many combo points, Rupture ticks longer with more combo points (4, 5, 6, 7 or 8 ticks). Obviously Rip ticks will increase substantially with more combo points when compared to Rupture which relies more on the increased number of ticks.

 Grimmlokk 05/27/07 5:25 AM

Yeah Rupture's unmodified damage per tick only goes up by 11 per CP I believe. 5.5dps.

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