[Priest] Compensating for Tailor Envy?

Nomad_Wanderer · 05/31/07, 9:55 AM

Ok.. Drumroll. I'm a priest. and not a tailor. Worse still, I'm not a dwarf or a draenei. I'm a human priest. (Still better than NE tho :p) Our guild farms kara/gruul, is about to get Magtheridon down (26% last attempt).

http://armory.worldofwarcraft.com/#c...=Lothar&n=Malt

I know I have some more to go...
I'd like to pick up Light's Justice, and spellsurge it.
I need to pick up the t4 helm, (I already have my HH enchant, Mystical Skyfire and nightseye)
I need to put some spellthread on my pants
I need to put an enchant on my wrists, and a boar's speed on my boots.
I need to get a better wand.

I know that purple != epic gear, but even after doing the above, gathering a healthy supply of badges ~70) I'm still trying to find gear pieces that can compete with the Whitemend/Primal Mooncloth combo. It seems like the current Karazhan itemization is more multi-stat balanced, with STA, INT, etc. While the Whitemend/Primal combo has stats that are more focuses to a raiding priests (+Heal,MP5, etc).

I am very happy that my enchanting can add +40 healing, and only another enchanter can use that bonus.. But most priests have ~400 intellect and the whitemend set bonus does that alone, without considering the stats. The talasite owl is an awesome trinket, dont get me wrong... but TBH, I'd trade it for an additional flat 5% in a heartbeat. (Along with those stats)

One person I spoke with mentioned that the Whitemend/Primal Mooncloth combo is designed to be this powerful for a purpose, and the scales are tipped in the tailor's favor right now, but once our guild gets into SSC, and more t4/SSC items start dropping that should return to balance.. They went into a long drown out post about how the mats for the whitemend/primal combo are similar to a guild's need to overcome the prepatory hurdles that are Kara/Mag/etc.

I'm okay with that..I guess.... But is "suck it up and deal, until your guild gets further in the game" really the answer? I hope not.

There must be other gear choices I'm missing? I've tried looking for good lists, like http://www.wow-loot.com/priest.htm , but I'm not finding them.

The EJ community is very bright and often has the inside lines on items that people overlook, or just don't notice. Can someone point me towards some more "raid focused" priest gear, or otherwise comment on helping me improve/compensate for 'tailor envy'?

rbbrdckybk · 05/31/07, 11:33 AM

Gear seems mostly fine to me.

Might want to consider replacing your Darkmoon trinket with the Bangle of Endless Blessings. If the reported proc rate of 15% on the Bangle is correct, it should be superior to the Darkmoon card before you even consider the Bangle's activated effect. Just requires farming Botanica until you get it.

Also, another note in case you don't know: non-tailors can wear the Whitemend set. You just don't get the set bonus without 350 tailoring (which likely means that it isn't worth it for most).

Nomad_Wanderer · 05/31/07, 11:45 AM

Yeah.. I've been concentrating on other things lately aldor exalted shoulder enchant right now.. Before that I only made about 12 attempts for the bangle.. 3 of them were pugs, and the one time it dropped... The pug pally outrolled me

.. Was pretty disheartening, so I stopped trying for a couple weeks.

I'm going to continue to try for it, because a bangle proc + Masq Gown + Bangle use = some serious regen.

Jayde · 05/31/07, 11:46 AM

Talk some buddies into doing BWL for a Rejuvenating Gem!

(Sadly, I'm only partially joking... because if you can swing it, it's still an awesome trinket.)

Realistically, though, your gear is pretty good. I've been looking at non-tailoring options with my Priest (as he's not Tailoring, sadly) and have very similar items in general. I'm personally a bit more MP5 focused than your gear choices--with a mix of the MP5 vs. Spirit gear to keep a bit more of an OOFSR vs. FSR regen balance.

I think your single biggest boon will be enchantments, honestly. You're missing a lot from the ones you mentioned and the lack of a head enchant (probably due to you wanting to replace it soon.) Consider getting Vitality instead of Boar's Speed for an extra 4 mp5.

Enchants are a huge delta vs. item upgrades... for instance, you're missing around 19 mp5 and over 50 +healing just from those alone--which is like having an extra item slot.

All in all though, I think you've done pretty well for yourself. You won't ever be able to reach some of the crazy stats that Primal Mooncloth has for a little while, but your stats are more than sufficient for raid healing once you finish your enchants. (Not sure I would recommend Spellsurge at this point though, it seems a bit inefficient...but just my personal opinion.)

Another trinket that some other Priests in my guild like (haven't managed to get it myself though) is the Warp-Scarab Brooch. Decent regen trinket that is quite reliable.

Kass · 05/31/07, 11:55 AM

After reading your post, I have a hard time actually discerning your personal play style - or the stats that you feel you're missing out on. Typically, players gear best when they find items that best suit their healing methods/choices.

Do you feel like you're lacking +healing, a larger mana pool, or regen while casting?

Some things that you might consider:
Helm: Enchant - Glyph of Renewal (35 healing, and 7 mp5) Thrallmar Revered
Cloak: Enchant - Subtlety
Wrist: Bindings of the Timewalker (Keepers of Time - Exalted - http://www.wowhead.com/?item=29183)
Wand: Soul Wand of the Aldor (Shadow Labs - http://www.wowhead.com/?item=27885)
Legs: Pontifex Kilt (Steamvaults - http://www.wowhead.com/?item=30543)

I personally use Gloves of Saintly Blessings (w/ 2x18Healing over T4). I also use the Gilded Trousers of Benediction from Doomwalker with all +18 Healing, unless a fight requires me to actually be concerned about stamina - for that I use T4 and before that Pontifex. IMO, really the only area that we lose out to Tailors on in the long run is the Mooncloth Belt. Everything else has comperable items. Until the Belt of the Long Road came out, there was no equivalent...and for many that still won't be an option for a while.

Either way, don't be discouraged that you don't have the Mooncloth set. You'll be fine in what you have, just be smart about your enchants, gems, and consumable useage.

Nomad_Wanderer · 05/31/07, 12:04 PM

Yeah.. the brooch is discussed in the excellent healing trinket thread in this forum..

I know I'm short on regen, so short of the bangle, the darkmoon card way my way of trying to compensate regen wise.

I was thinking spellsurge, as another thread here talks about multiple in a single group getting it, and it producing some decent regen. Then again, I'm probably going to keep my current maiden hammer.... I'm still crossing my fingers for 1 prince item, let alone two

If I had to pick, it would be the t4 helm.

I would miss the footspeed, but your right about Vitality being more important.

Thanks for your advice.

Nomad_Wanderer · 05/31/07, 12:18 PM

Wow. that's why I made the post.. I had missed those gilded trousers.. They are godly.

Thanks for the other suggestions.

I'm mainly trying to maximize Oo5SR. Using lots of burst renew then pause style healing, and lots of cast canceling (quartz FTW). The Gown, and spi in general help with that.

At the same time I'm trying to maximize Oo5sr without hurting my In5SR.... That usually means my +healing is little lower.. I'm okay with that. I'd rather have an xtra heal or 3 then have heals that hit a little harder.

Calya · 05/31/07, 12:29 PM

I agree with other posters; your gear is quite good (<3 the Masquerade Gown now that the proc rate's been fixed) and you're only missing some enchants to make you competitive. Aside from that, you don't have to struggle with your health pool quite as much as a tailor would, and you have the benefit of your Talasite Owl and ring enchantments. So there are some advantages with your current setup.

I posted about this in the priest theorycrafting thread, but it's also worth mentioning that Whitemend, while still a very nice set, didn't receive any buffs in the recent patch, so it lost some ground compared to T4 and Kara epics. Even before the buffs I was hesitant to make the set for myself; the lack of spirit doesn't really mesh with my playstyle (which is similar to yours, I'm a burst-and-break high-Oo5SR type), and the helm doesn't have a meta slot. At this point I'd almost say that by not being a tailor the main thing you're missing out on is PMC, and while an excellent set, it's not worth agonizing over. It isn't quite as irreplaceable as, say, Frozen Shadoweave is for a shadow priest.

So, in summary: grab a few more enchantments, and feel confident in your profession choices.

constantius · 05/31/07, 12:45 PM

Originally Posted by Kass

Wrist: Bindings of the Timewalker (Keepers of Time - Exalted

... no. Absolutely not. Not even a chance.

Wrist: Bands of the Benevolent (http://www.thottbot.com/i29249) -- Heroic Sethekk Halls.

They are almost identical to the Maiden bracers, and we all know how good *those* are (Blizz included them in our T5 kit for PTR ... and then upgraded the Hydross drop to make them obsolete ... gg).

constantius · 05/31/07, 12:52 PM

Additionally, on the "tailoring front" -- I'm a tailor. I have 3/3 PM, and 2/2 Whitemend.

I took off my Whitemend on Tuesday. I put on the pants from Netherspite (http://www.thottbot.com/i28742 -- Pantaloons of Repentence -- if you want a non-raid alternative, grab http://www.thottbot.com/i30543 -- Pontifex Kilt, as it is functionally identical) and my T4 helm.

Why? I gained almost 30 Mp5 OO5SR and lost 12 inside ... but also gained 31 intellect *non-raid-buffed*. The stat gain was obscene, and I ended up losing 12 Mp5 II5SR and 15 healing to gain it.

As far as weapons go, I would suggest you look at getting two weapons. Light's Justice is not really designed for Spellsurge, IMO -- I would put +81 healing on Light's, and then get the staff from Magtheridon if you can swing it (Crystalheart Pulse Staff -- http://www.thottbot.com/i28782) for a Spellsurge enchant. Alternatively, the mace from exalted Sha'tar or the Maiden mace would do equally as well.

The shoulders from Curator are equivalent in almost every way to the Primal Mooncloth, excepting the set bonus.

The two irreplaceable pieces (IMO) are the chest and belt (PM). Nothing comes close until T5. The person above who said that Belt of the Long Road would replace PM ... hrm ... not really.

Belt of the Long Road - http://www.thottbot.com/i30036
13 Stamina
18 Intellect (+4)
33 Spirit
Yellow Socket -- use Dazzling Talasite
Blue Socket -- use Royal Nightseye
(+7 Healing Socket Bonus)
73 Healing S&E (+7)
(+4 Mp5)

Primal Mooncloth Belt - http://www.thottbot.com/i21873
12 int (+7)
11 spirit
Yellow Socket -- use Dazzling Talasite
Blue Socket -- use Royal Nightseye
(+3 Int Socket Bonus)
81 Healing S&E (+9)
8 Mp5 (+4)

So is 13 stamina, 3 intellect, and 22 spirit worth 10 healing and 8 Mp5? That's your judgement call to make. It'd be nice to have Long Road for stam fights, but otherwise, PM stays on.

Kass · 05/31/07, 1:23 PM

If I'm not mistaken I said:

IMO, really the only area that we lose out to Tailors on in the long run is the Mooncloth Belt. Everything else has comperable items. Until the Belt of the Long Road came out, there was no equivalent...and for many that still won't be an option for a while.

Maybe I should have said...there was nothing offered as a different option really until that new belt pattern. The OP was asking for options outside of completely overhauling professions. I pointed out the one item that I feel definitely gives a tailor an edge over others is the PMC Belt. Then again, as an enchanter he has the ring enchants. Alchemists could be said to have another edge with Alchemists Stone. Each profession has its benefits, but it doesn't necessarily mean one is definitely more worth it than another.

Nomad_Wanderer · 05/31/07, 1:32 PM

Originally Posted by Kass

Each profession has its benefits, but it doesn't necessarily mean one is definitely more worth it than another.

This I disagree with... I do believe that if given the choice to do it all over again, I would be Alchemy/tailor..and Draenei...

These two professions seem more 'connected/intune' with priests/casters...then enchanting/Jewelcrafting.. Those two seem more fit to be generic/unfocused to any particular subset.

I really do appreciate all the comments.. I was under the impression that most of the priest healers out there were using WM/PMC.. In other words, I was starting to think that tailoring was the new 'fear ward'...

It's good to see some people that aren't.

Elerion · 05/31/07, 1:35 PM

With the combination of marginal gear upgrades being less critical for healers than dps, and healers' general lower income, I think you'll find that there are far more healers going without tailoring than there are caster dps'ers.

Arnive · 05/31/07, 4:01 PM

I think you guys are overrating the Primal Mooncloth set bonus, to be honest. I'm wearing 3/3 PM with a decently high amount of spirit (533) self buffed, and even then the set bonus only gives 18 mp5 while casting and nothing while not (obviously). Depending on the fight the benefit of this pseudo 18 mp5 changes, but I'd hardly say it's game breaking. It accounts for less than 10% of my buffed casting mp5, and figuring in time spent oofsr it's less than 3%.

And to echo what others have said, leave Spellsurge to your paladins and pick up +healing on your weapons.

Arnive · 05/31/07, 4:22 PM

bah, double post - yay for database errors >.<