My hope is that the current way the LC works is how it stays. I'm hoping they're too busy with other stuff and hurrying to get it out that they don't notice it's only putting a cooldown after discharges.
A cooldown after every crit would make me die a little inside.
Umm yay, this pretty much kills the idea that TLC would help counteract the nerf on Elemental shaman dps. I hope they have something good coming for us, cause the news keeps getting worse and worse.
I do wonder what good options are for a second trinket now. Seems the obvious one is the dps caster upgrade from ZA and use that and the Icon at the same time. And of course Skull of Guldan. But other than that is there anything worth using? Sextant (if it drops for your guild), Shiffar's again? Shame the ashtongue one is so worthless.
Calculating the TLC nerf (damn mages abusing it's mechanics)
C = crit
C - C^2 (crit minus chance to get a two-in-a-row-crit)= chance to get a TLC charge
So for our standard 40% crit:
0.4-(0.4*0.4)
0.4-0.16
0.24
24/40 = 60% of normal, ie: 40% nerf of TLC damage. (DEP figures are 126 & 78, which comes to a 39% nerf)
I'm not sure whether this is correct. You might still get a charge from the second crit in case the first one did not trigger one (because there was another crit in front).
Let p be the chance to get a charge, and c your crit chance. Then
" We're still running tests as well as reading your feedback, and we've already fixed at least two bugs adversely affecting elemental shaman dps on the public test realms. You need to be patient, I respond and provide information when I'm able. "
now i check worldofraids and i see:
Shaman
• Elemental Mastery: It is no longer possible to get two consecutive guaranteed critical strikes from using this ability.
• Eye of the Storm: This talent can now trigger while the Shaman is sitting.
is this like a joke? because its not 1st of april... i am just.. speechless.
" We're still running tests as well as reading your feedback, and we've already fixed at least two bugs adversely affecting elemental shaman dps on the public test realms. You need to be patient, I respond and provide information when I'm able. "
now i check worldofraids and i see:
Shaman
• Elemental Mastery: It is no longer possible to get two consecutive guaranteed critical strikes from using this ability.
• Eye of the Storm: This talent can now trigger while the Shaman is sitting.
is this like a joke? because its not 1st of april... i am just.. speechless.
That Eye of the Storm is really nice when I think about it, 6 knock back free seconds at only the cost of an auto attack critical hit (if you time it right).
Did I read that right? Lightning capacitor was changed again so that all charges trigger a 2.5 second cool down rather than just the first?
I don't suppose anyone knows how we not compare to enhancement on the DPS front after these resent "buffs"?
Ok, seriously it's only ONE ptr push since the blue post, nothing to go crazy about. It's a hell of a lot better for them to take their time instead of releasing half a ton worth of changes and
1) breaking stuff
2) putting our hopes TOO high and nerfing us afterwards
3) still not accurately gauging our DPS.
Umm yay, this pretty much kills the idea that TLC would help counteract the nerf on Elemental shaman dps. I hope they have something good coming for us, cause the news keeps getting worse and worse.
I do wonder what good options are for a second trinket now. Seems the obvious one is the dps caster upgrade from ZA and use that and the Icon at the same time. And of course Skull of Guldan. But other than that is there anything worth using? Sextant (if it drops for your guild), Shiffar's again? Shame the ashtongue one is so worthless.
That is also what I am wondering, we are just about to kill Kara. so I should have access to the sexant soon. I was thinking Sextant and Quags till I can the trinket out of ZA.
I'm wondering if anyone did tests on Dr. Boom after the TLC nerf; I'm mostly curious about a TLC + Sextant VS Sextant + Quags scenario (my PTR character does not have Quags).
Anyway, 2.3 is most likely going to go live next week. I had to suspend my WoW account due to November exams, but I took the opportunity where you have to enter the reason for cancelling, and mentioned that the stacking 2.3 nerfs on elementals made me quit. I'm curious if lots of us would do this (and then of course renew the subscription later), would it be noted by someone, somewhere?
I don't suppose anyone knows how we not compare to enhancement on the DPS front after these resent "buffs"?
Based purely on anecdotal evidence that the specs are close to even on live, and considering that enhancement got several pve buffs, I'd say your chances are not good.
Has anyone modeled the Skyfury Totem yet? I searched but could not find anything. I am curious on how it stands up since haste is the new "thing" for us. I haven't gotten void so I might pick it up anyways just to fill that gap in my gear.
[e] Ok aparantly on Wowhead it shows as a 15% proc hmm I suppose at this point I wonder how much of an impact it is over loss of damage and other effects from other totems then.
Has anyone modeled the Skyfury Totem yet? I searched but could not find anything. I am curious on how it stands up since haste is the new "thing" for us. I haven't gotten void so I might pick it up anyways just to fill that gap in my gear.
Simply put, useless for pvp, better than Void for pve (how much depends on your gear, as haste scales with it). Teron trinket still beats it by a margin.
Has anyone modeled the Skyfury Totem yet? I searched but could not find anything. I am curious on how it stands up since haste is the new "thing" for us. I haven't gotten void so I might pick it up anyways just to fill that gap in my gear.
[e] Ok aparantly on Wowhead it shows as a 15% proc hmm I suppose at this point I wonder how much of an impact it is over loss of damage and other effects from other totems then.
I've got a basic model, although I have yet to sit down and figure out how to handle "double procs"
I've got a basic model, although I have yet to sit down and figure out how to handle "double procs"
If it doesn't have a cooldown and has a 15% chance to proc and if it procs while already up renews the duration I can model it for you if you want. Let me know and I can post some stuff. Does LO cause it to proc?
If it doesn't have a cooldown and has a 15% chance to proc and if it procs while already up renews the duration I can model it for you if you want. Let me know and I can post some stuff. Does LO cause it to proc?
Sweet! Saves me doing it then
At this stage, I don't know whether LO can proc it or not, but if you can work one with, and one without, it should give us a model when we figure it out (and for practical reasons, using the one without will be better for the moment).
Given that there's no cooldown, the probability p for the effect from the Skyfury totem to be active at any given moment equals the probability that it procced during the last 10 seconds.
As an approximation:
p = 1 - 0.85^n
where n is the number of lightning bolts cast within 10 seconds. Let s be your LB casttime, then
n = 10/s. Depending on whether LO can cause the totem to proc, n has to be multiplied by 1.2.
Then, for an unhasted 2 seconds LB casting time
p ~ 0.56
in case LO can't proc it, and
p ~ 0.62
otherwise.
Of course, to be precise, one would have to consider the effect the proc itself has on the casttime s, given by the equation
s = 2 / (1 + h + p * 0.06)
where h denotes the number of % haste you have. For h = 0, p becomes roughly 0.57.
Obviously, the more haste one stacks, the bigger p will get, because the buff duration remains 10 seconds.
Here is a quick and dirty graph showing the effect of haste on the average amount of haste gained from the Skycall Totem (not taking into account the proc itself, so the "real" values should be slightly higher).
At the risk of looking foolish, a spell penetration question (I KNOW).
I've always been on the wagon that spell penetration is useless in PvE. Certainly it is, no question, in the vast majority of cases. I was just wondering if anyone has spotted any instance or raid mobs at all with any nature resistance which might justify carrying a +spell pen ring or +spell pen elixir.
This has come to mind due to 2 things:
1) I did two heroic ramparts runs this week. I haven't been to ramparts since level 61, so I got a surprise when the dragon at the end (Nazan) resisted my spells like crazy. He clearly had high NR (200-250 probably).
2) I'm very suspicious about tainted elementals on the Vashj fight due to a bad run of resists on them (which led to me requesting a swap to a different area of elementals where I could get help on tainteds). No such issues on Vashj, normal elementals, striders or naga elites. But the same thing recurred with tainteds on 4 separate evenings- could still easily be just dumb bad luck, but I was wondering if anyone has managed to parse their resist rates on stuff over time.
I have zero spell penetration gear.
It made me wonder if there's some mobs with a small amount of NR out there. The mantra has always been that there's nothing worth bothering about due to curses, but there isn't an NR curse.
I'm thinking of trying to find where I left a stack of spell pen Elixirs and bringing them to Illidari Council next time. I'm pretty sure they get some sort of resistance buff.
This is, of course, assuming that the patch doesn't go live as is, making me little more than a benchwarmer.
Given that there's no cooldown, the probability p for the effect from the Skyfury totem to be active at any given moment equals the probability that it procced during the last 10 seconds.
As an approximation:
p = 1 - 0.85^n
where n is the number of lightning bolts cast within 10 seconds. Let s be your LB casttime, then
n = 10/s. Depending on whether LO can cause the totem to proc, n has to be multiplied by 1.2.
Then, for an unhasted 2 seconds LB casting time
p ~ 0.56
in case LO can't proc it, and
p ~ 0.62
otherwise.
Of course, to be precise, one would have to consider the effect the proc itself has on the casttime s, given by the equation
s = 2 / (1 + h + p * 0.06)
where h denotes the number of % haste you have. For h = 0, p becomes roughly 0.57.
Obviously, the more haste one stacks, the bigger p will get, because the buff duration remains 10 seconds.
Here is a quick and dirty graph showing the effect of haste on the average amount of haste gained from the Skycall Totem (not taking into account the proc itself, so the "real" values should be slightly higher).
You forgot one thing: Buff time "lost" when it procs within 10 seconds of another proc.
You forgot one thing: Buff time "lost" when it procs within 10 seconds of another proc.
I don't think so. The buff is not active in case no proc occured during the last ten seconds. It's active if there was at least one proc, including multiple procs.
But if it procs on cast 1, then on cast 2 again, that's one of our "15" procs used up with 1 cast worth of use.
The fact that two procs happened after another does not affect the procchance further along. It is not as if that proc "used up" a proc that otherwise would have happened somewhere in the future, unless of course the number of procs per minute is somehow limited by the game. Without such a restriction, the procs occur entirely independent of each other, and my math should be correct.
If you get 2 procs in a 10 second period, you will have the buff for 10 seconds, plus the time between the two procs.
So if I get two procs on LB 1 & 3, there will be ~14 seconds of the buff, for two procs. It's a similar sort of thing with Clearcasting (if we get a crit chain, charges are "lost").
I see what you mean, but it does not affect the calculation. It's exactly the same for clearcasting: the mana cost of your current spell is reduced in case you got at least one crit out of the last two casts .. 1 - (1-c)^2.
Don't look at it in terms of lost charges, optimal distribution of procs or anything like that.
Here's a short program I wrote in C to test my assumptions (I apologize for the missing intendation):
}
printf("estimation of procchance: %f\n", (double)uptime/ITERATIONS);
}
While not beautiful, I think it captures how the totem works: for each cast, if the buff is active, increase the counter for total uptime while decreasing the buff-timer. Then get a random number and see whether it's within the 15% proc range. If it is, (re)set the timer to 10 seconds (5 casts in this case).
The fact that two procs happened after another does not affect the procchance further along. It is not as if that proc "used up" a proc that otherwise would have happened somewhere in the future, unless of course the number of procs per minute is somehow limited by the game. Without such a restriction, the procs occur entirely independent of each other, and my math should be correct.
I remember doing the clear cast calculations and I have to agree with chant. Past proc do not affect anything other than calculating number of LB per 10 secs from being hasted. Since there is no cooldown 2 procs in a row doesn't make one loose anything. I've been working on a ele dps sim but then got really busy at work. Hopefully i'll have somthing later today.
11/02/07, 6:04 PM
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