There is really not that much to look out for in the "new" Gruul-fight. Run in, let the tank get a Sunder Armor off and start nuking with Arcane Blast/Arcane Missiles. Wand two times when you're hit by Reverb. Immediatly move out of Cave-Ins and do this intelligently: don't run zigzag and rather look where the Cave-In is coming from and where it is moving to. On Ground Slams, blink if you're getting kicked into a bad place in the Lair. What do you need a safespot for since the Shatter is hitting for so much less damage? If you have a SPriest and maybe a Shaman in your group, run with a 3 AB-rotation and use Molten Armor. If not don't be scared to use Mage Armor and rather do the 2 AB-rotation. It will greatly benefit your mana regeneration. If you have spare mana at the end of the fight you can still Arcane Blast-spam until you're OOM.
I'd go with 2/3x AB, 1x AM, 1x Scorch-rotation. Use /Stopcasting-Macros for those spells and get used to it (maybe work with a special castbar like Quartz).
Also try to use Arcane Power/PoM as soon as possible so you can use those timers 2-3 times during the fight.
About your spec/gear:
You should always have an idea what you're speccing/equipping for. Currently you're leaning towards Arcane but lack one point in Arcane Focus. You could swap your Scryer's for something like Icon or Shiffar's if you pack that last point into Focus.
So you have two nukes that are getting supported by your talents: Arcane Blast and Arcane Missiles. Putting points into another element now to support your Arcane-Blast rotation is a good idea. For good rotations Scorch is the more versatile spell, IMO. You would want to get Ignite then so your criticals do a really good amount of damage (that's actually the biggest flaw in your current spec). Elemental Precision is alright but you should also try to get Incinerate. Improved Fireblast is not necessary nor is Flame Throwing - you'll have to stand near the mob to cast Arcane Blast/Missiles anyway. Pyro for AP/PoM is nice. Your equip is looking good damage-wise though you're lacking spirit. You might want to grab the next T4-shoulders from Maulgar.
A little more specific feedback based on your gear/talents:
Your spec isn't optimal. You have imp. AM, but not burning soul. You have invested into el. Precision, indicating that you dont want to use 100% arcane spell rotations, but the lack of ignite (!!!), burning soul and imp. scorch make your fire spells practically useless.
Improved arcane missiles is only good for soloing. In raids it's useless, and far too expensive talent-point wise on top of that. If you have issues with interrupts from damage, switch to fire spells on these fights and pick up burning soul (almost the same benefit for 3 points less, plus threat reduction on top) and/or pick up 2/5 of tier4, making you 100% immune to spell pushback.
Prismatic cloak is useless and the points are better spent elsewhere, max out your arcane focus so you can use more crit and +dmg gear.
Get the lightning capacitor or shiffar's nexus horn, also eye of quagmirran and idol of the silver crescent, your trinkets are rather lackluster.
Armory me, I have tried multiple arc/fire specs and I'm very happy with my current one.
Sorry to interrupt but can I ask whether you leveled as arcane? From what I've read and heard, frost is the best for leveling. Arcane seems cooler to me. My mage is 48 now so it will be a while before I get arcane blast.
You put us in a real bind by saying "How can I improve my damage?" and then saying "Don't suggest talent changes."
The only suggestions you leave us with are:
- Play better
- Use more consumables
- Get better gear
Seriously, your talent choices are bad. That's where a chunk of your problem is. I'd hazard to guess based on your "I'm not a twitch player" comments that you also don't use a /stopcasting macro and probably don't chain cast fast enough even without /stopcasting.
There are 2 ways to play a game. One is to do whatever you feel like doing, math be damned. The other is to optimize. And never the twain shall meet.
Originally Posted by Goggles
This is a key point. The T5 2 piece set bonus is 20% more damage on Arcane Blast.
No, it's not. It's actually one of the worst boni on epic mage-sets I've encountered so far. It only applies to Arcane Blast's base damage and seems to not scale with your spelldamage
Can you please explain why my arcane blast went from ~1550 to 1850-1950 damage after I got my tier 5 2 piece bonus? That sounds like an extra 20% or so to me. Could you also tell me of any other item upgrade or bonus in game that lets you get approximately +300 damage on one of your primary spells? Yes, I said +300.
It sure as hell sounds like an amazing bonus to me.
To the original poster: The first time I specced arcane I did terrible on gruul too!. Being fire is 'easy' to do. But, you need a little practise at playing arcane to control your mana usage and rotations. After some practise I did alot better.
Don't give up - practise a little, ask other experienced arcane mages for tips - and you might be surprised at the results.
If I were you, I'd read the topics on the Mage Forum of the official site and take a look at the ones discussing deep arcane's raid viability.
Why would you EVER come here and say this?
OP: Based on where you've put your talent points *cough* you should never ever touch a fire spell, except maybe one scorch to fill in your AB cycle. Move in to get within arcane range if you have to. Arcane spec is easily the most difficult spec to play. You cannot spam one button and do well. You have to have the attention span to manage range, mana, and your arcane blast debuff all at the same time. This doesn't just help, it is required.
Your basic cycle should look like this.
ABx2, Arcane Missiles, Scorch, repeat.
You need to get your paladin's to judge wisdom, or else you will go oom from casting arcane missiles.
I would stress once again that arcane is not an easy spec to play or truly understand. You need to do research, testing and theorycraft to get to top damage as arcane. In short, you need to put in considerably more effort than just posting for help. Go read the things that Goggles linked to you, download my spreadsheet, and try to understand how mana converts to damage by adjusting arcane blast cycles.
Raiding is full of challenge. Sometimes there is fire. You have to not be in the fire.
Within the boundaries of your spec, to do high dps, you're a bit limited to AB and AM since you don't have the Fire or Frost crit talents. Gruul in particular is unfriendly towards long casts/channels, so an AB/AM rotation will likely be much better than AM spam. I don't know how it'll work on Mag or Morogrim for you though; those fights are much worse on mana.
In response to some of the comments on the T5 bonus, it increases dps but leaves dpm intact, like spell haste. In that sense, it isn't comparable to +300 damage for all fights (though for non-mana-limited fights, I'd agree with that post)
I've been trying to get some calculations to convince myself that Arcane is viable and I've come to think that Judgement of Wisdom is the key. With that up, Arcane Missiles becomes more efficient than Fireball and better dps than Scorch. Mixing it into a rotation with Arcane Blast and I'm beginning to think there is some serious damage potential for this spec. I'm planning on gathering the few pieces of gear I need to be geared better for deep arcane then trying it out for at least a week.
One of our mages went 50/11/0 about a week ago, since he was having really high +Dmg but his Crit was always coming up short when looking at meters. He tried it, actually did amazing DPS, and most of our other mages followed suit. http://armory.worldofwarcraft.com/#c...mane&n=Brunnor
The mages always have a Shadowpriest and Shaman. It really just comes down to how to make it work for you.
Normally their rotation is ABx3, AM, Scorch, repeat
Here's one of our other mages: http://armory.worldofwarcraft.com/#c...ane&n=Enervate
(He was Deep Fire, which is why his crit is really high)
All in all, their damage is just as good, if not better than it used to be, save the fact they'll never have to run the risk of aggro and their playstyle is a lot more interactive than Deep Fire.
I heard Sigurd scored an infinity on Rock Band and ascended to heaven.
@ Sigurd, aggro isnt really an issue with the talent that gives you 30% less threat than a fire mage.
In general you tend to find people shy away from an AM rotation because of its horrible mana efficiency, if you found that spreadsheet floating around you can test for yourself but a rotation with either scorch or frostbolts comes out ontop. Although 'deep arcane' as its known can be only using arcane spells* you have to try and be more flexible and work around the duration of the arcane blast debuff in the best possible way. By putting much more talents into fire or frost to really get a workable rotation.
* I get slightly confused here when looking at your talent set up, you have gone for 3 points in elemental precision when you use arcane spells way more compared to the 1 point you left off arcane focus.
I have a question: Do folks actually manage to reproduce their Dr. Boom results in raids? I need more feedback.
No, in magtheridon you will most likely be going to click cubes. In hydross you will constantly have to switch to AoEing and in lurker you have to jump around a lot. (these are your next three bosses most likely)
If its any use to you ill throw you some possible specs you could try out when you get the money (psst, bug your guild bank!)
And finally, if you are lucky enough to bank a spriest in your raids for every go (ref to OP) then you can pump much more of your dps into arcane blast spamming since no one doubts the damage that it causes, but if you have the mana to back it up.
You should probably drop those points in improved arcane missiles and improved fireblast if you're that serious about raid damage. Picking up ignite for when you need to scorch to wait for ab debuff to wear off is good.
Sorry but I am pretty sure thats really really a bad idea. Fireblast is bad DPM. The whole reason to do 3x AB, missles, scorch is that you want to cram in 'filler' spells with high DPM so that you have mana left for your real DPS spell.
Remember: for an arcane mage, mana always means more damage, because the spec has the ability to burn all of its mana in no time, unlike fire spec, which most of the time I admit I finish with plenty of mana to spare.
EDIT: but yeah I do have to agree that at first sight improved missles do seem like wasted points.
Can you please explain why my arcane blast went from ~1550 to 1850-1950 damage after I got my tier 5 2 piece bonus?
No, I can't. I'm seeing a ~150ish spelldamage-plus (20% from 668 - 772) in my Theorycraft2 when equipping two T5-pieces. Regarding the feedback from the other mages from my guild I'm quite sure that the bonus works like that.
Could you also tell me of any other item upgrade or bonus in game that lets you get approximately +300 damage on one of your primary spells?
You are making the assumption here, that a Mage with that setbonus is specced into Arcane. Recently I've been raiding with 0/0/61 and 10/48/3 and the bonus did nothing for me. Even when I specced Arcane/Fire for a AB/AM/Scorch-build I did not feel like Arcane Blast was really my primary spell. It was one of two/three spells that contributed to my DPS.
Hi Jona. I've been at least 51 points in Arcane since 2.0, and while I haven't hit up Gruul or Mag raids yet, I've been through Karazhan so many times that I could likely do it with my eyes closed. http://armory.worldofwarcraft.com/ch...her&n=Sinazeel is my Armory profile. My Riding Crop is currently in the top slot, but that's usually a Lightning Capacitor, if you want a good feel of my total gear.
Well, I don't think your gear is all that great. I'm gonna echo the sentiments earlier on that you need to invest a bit more in stats. Stamina is going to help keep you up more, especially with most of the tBC content eschewing the traditional tank&spank fights and going for fancy AoE crap. It allows some leeway with fights, since you'll be able to screw up once or twice and not die. As the saying goes, a dead mage does 0 dps. Intellect is fantastic, since having tons of mana frees you up a bit what you can do, and it will also be increasing your crit chance and damage. To that end, I feel that the tailoring BoE sets don't have much to offer for an Arcane mage. There's a notable lack of stats on Spellstrike, and +hit isn't that high a priority due to Arcane Focus. Battlecast isn't too shabby, and is likely cheaper to buy, but the lack of crit is very meh. Spellfire however, is incredible and the lack of stats on those pieces is just fine, though I'd lean toward putting Stamina gems in every blue socket I have. Also, I personally avoid using gems in their non-syngeristic slots, but I suppose the whole socketing thing is to do what you want with gear.
In actual fighting, I've found that I rarely need to actually use non-Arcane spells. I usually use a AB+AB+AM rotation. My latency/whatever lets me get off the next AB right after the debuff wears off, but while still using the shortened casting time. If I'm trying to conserve mana, I'll do a single AB instead of two, and if I'm REALLY trying to conserve mana, I'll do AB, Scorch x3, then repeat. While it seems obvious, try to use AM when you Clearcast. Same with your rawr-Pyroblast macro. This will help offset the higher mana cost of AM.
If you're having trouble with mana, try using Mage Armor instead of Molten. Yeah yeah, we all love the crit bonus, but it does you little good if you're sitting there oom. Also learn to chain consumables. Even if you're spamming AM (very high -mana per second by doing that), it'll take you a minute to go oom. Evocate, then start chugging mana gems (make the highest three ranks you have) and mana pots. Once I've gone through a fight a few times, I find that I learn how to better conserve my mana (don't start AM if Moroes is about to vanish or Prince is about to Nova, etc).
Ohhhh, one more thing! Go hit the auction house and start looking for a bunch of green staves or daggers+offhands, and a wand, of the Of Spirit variety. Install Itemrack or something of that nature, and make a set to switch out that stuff. Throw them on before you start using Evocation for another thousand or two of mana. It really helps make it not suck so much.
Arcane mages really pick up once you start factoring in buffs from other players. Paladins are awesome for this, especially Protection. BoW is fantastic, as is Kings. Salv isn't much of a priority, but can help if your tank is learning/sucks/isn'tProt. JoW is where it really shines, since each volley of AM can (and often will) proc the mana gain from JoW.
Warlocks might be viewed negatively my some mages as competition, but an Arcane Mage counts as benefitting from Curse of Shadows, and helps to convince others of using CoS instead of CoA or whatever. Shadow Priests are also useful for this, with Misery increasing damage and VT feeding mana back into you. SPriests gain about as much from Salvation as you will from JoW; With both of them, you can actually almost even out your mana gain and mana usage.
Disc priests are nice as well, what with the Divine Spirit boosting normal mana regen and Evocation. Imp DS isn't that much damage, but anything is better than nothing. Just make sure they don't try to PI you when you're about to pop AP, since they don't stack.
Shamans are very good, but only if they're a castery-type as well. Windfury is crap for us, sadly. Wrath of Air grants the largest bonus, due to AM's favoring of straight damage. Totem of Wrath is pretty cool if you can find someone specced in it. BM hunters are nice as well, since Ferocious Instinct works on ALL damage.
Consumables are very good. I'd shell out for the new Wizard Oils, along with some Adepts and Draenic Wisdom pots. Until you get more Stamina I'd use either the 20 Sta/Spirit food buffs or the Blackened Sporefish (20 STA and 8 mp5). After that I'd use the spell damage foods if you don't expect to take much damage, but damage intensive fights (such as Netherspite's aura or if you're tanking the imps in Illhoof) would see priority to the stamina foods.
Lastly, I'd consider respeccing a bit. Yeah, I know you don't want to, but that's why I'm listing it last. I'd sooner take Impact than Imp Fireball, and put points into Ignite instead of Imp Fire Blast. I might also consider not bothering with Pyroblast, since you're basically spending a talent point for another 200 damage on your rawr-macro. Not to mention that using Fireball as a replacement isn't that bad, as long as you don't have the reducing coefficient from Imp Fireball.
Good luck out there raiding. In general, it doesn't matter that much about how you spec, as long as you enjoy playing your character. It'll give you incentive to play well and such. Remember that the guilds that got Kel'Thuzad down first were Horde guilds, when the popular opinion was that Paladins made raiding 'easier'.