swills

Does anyone have confirmation on where Feral Staff of Lashing drops? WoWHead says Heroic Botanica but according to them Heroic Warp Splinter has been looted 79 times (although with only 38 Epics dropping, so I assume some of those 'kills' are from people in the same party) without this staff ever dropping?

Is it really that rare a drop?

 

Zadnak

I can confirm that it does b/c thats where I got mine.

It took me two runs to get.

 

• Exewut

/envy

Yes that's where it drops, just keep at it, it seems to have a rather low droprate.

 

Melthar

The ultimate red beam tank?

 

Korik

I have been trying to figure out for a while what would be better for me and my healers at this point in the game. We are starting to do serious attempts on Magtheridon and will probably be going into SSC within the next couple weeks.

I am sitting at 23k armor / 29% dodge / 420 defense atm in my tank gear, with 12.7k HP (this is when I am buffed with imp motw, btw). I have been debating with myself between getting Heavy Clefthoof Vest and socketing x3 12 stamina gems on it or sticking with Chestguard of the Talon... If I were to go with HCV I would lose 34 agility, which is a significant amount of dodge and some AC, plus a good chunk of armor (378 vs 290), but in turn I would gain 67 stamina and be able to swap my Adamantine Figurine for either Timelapse Shard (25 more stamina!), Alchemist's Stone or Mark of Tyranny and still remain above the 415 defense cap.

So, I guess my question is, what is better for endgame tanking? (By that I mean Mag onward).. I have done every heroic in the game and the gear I have has got me through them without issues for the most part, but should I now be focusing more on my HP (aka Heavy Clefthoof Vest) or on my AC / dodge?

 

dukes

I think the general consensus is: Dodge is good for healer mana, stamina is good for staying alive through burst damage. Going to something like Magtheridon you aren't likely to be maintank - you probably want to focus more on items that will allow you to do things other than tanking. The chestguard of the talon is probably a better item in that regard - the heavy clefthoof is more pure-tank stuff than offtank really.

I always value items as Armour > HP > Dodge. Armour is the main priority, but not when there's a large chunk of hp or dodge concerned. Armour gives you pure-mitigation, HP lets you survive longer, and Dodge reduces total damage so saves healer mana without technically saving you from burst damage (however much dodge you get, the luck factor is always there that you'll get 4+ hits in a row, all crushing).

 

dogy

After doing tons of research I still have not come to a conclusive decision on the best gear to tank High King with. I am looking for suggestions for gear to change. Do I need more agi? should I switch sockets in gear? I am picking up +12 sta gems tonight to give me that little boost. I also currently have enough arena points to pick up any single piece that would be the biggest upgrade. I can't find a good comparison spreadsheet for gladiator items.

Thanks,
Dogy

 

Ochiba

You ask for help without linking or typing your gear. Basically you want to be uncrittable, then get your armor, stamina, and avoidance to the max levels possible.

As far as gear selections are concerned, here's another resource to help you compare items.
http://www.gurgleblaster.net/emmeral...tion/Head.html

Another thing you might want to do is to look at the armory profile of well-geared bear tanks in other guilds, note their stats in those areas, and just try to do better.

 

swills

I'm another one who prioritises Armor/Stamina/Dodge in that order pretty much. There are always going to be those "oh shit!" moments, and while having a higher dodge greatly reduces the number of them, it also reduces your chance of surviving through them when that dodge is obtained at the expense of other stats. Taking things to the extreme, if I could sit at 30k Armor (or whatever the 75% cap is now), 20k Health unbuffed, and 0% Dodge then I would. Yes I would be taking more overall damage, but it's predictable damage and easy to heal.

The Arena gear also is under-rated for tanking in my opinion. It isn't perfect and it may have some wasted stat allocation, but most items have exceptionally high armor and stamina while still providing some avoidance and threat generation. The side benefit of Resilience means you can throw away some of the Clefthoof junk that you wear only for the Defence basically, and actually boost your armor, avoidance, or even threat in those slots instead. I'm also a big fan of gear that allows to put out some decent threat.

 

Boevis

Assume Maulgar hits for 20k max before armor, you need to be able to survive a crush and an instant attack in order to think about trying this fight.

At 22250 armor (65% dr vs boss) you'd need over 17.5k health to survive a crush+instant
At 24900 armor (67.5% dr vs boss) you'd need over 16750 health
At 28000 armor (70% dr vs boss) you'd need over 15k health

Keep those numbers in mind, once you have the armor/hp fully buffed to survive, start adding agility.

Thanks,
Dogy

 

Husyor

Can you repost your excel sheet or is the link only not working for me? I have a copy from a while ago, but I didnt know if you updated it anytime and I messed with it, without saving an original. But I did have a question that's a bit off topic, from what I can tell, the Clefthoof Hide Leggings, the ones with the feral skill, or any time +feral skill is on an item, its huge for the items dps contribution according to your sheet as well as http://www.gurgleblaster.net/emmerald/ yet I see few/no one using the legs. Is something wrong with the calculations or am I missing something ?

 

• Daboran

The main problem with Emmerald's list I've found is that there is quite a heavy weighting applied to +hit and feral combat skill.
I've compiled another version for my use that removes the +hit/skill weighting and compares on normal stats alone. This way if you are aiming for pure mitigation/stamina you get a better comparison. Of course for threat/dps alone hit/skill (and consequently the Clefthoof Hide Leg) really IS that good, as long as you can't get it elsewhere to get you above the %hit you need.

If you track down Emmerald's guild forums you can download his spreadsheet and make adjustments to suit your requirements.

 

Boevis

Ummm ... Feral Weapon Skill is amazing for DPS, there's nothing wrong with the calculations. At this point in the game, any druid that isn't using CHLs for catform is doing something seriously wrong (or got their t4/5 pants). It was very difficult for me to get rid of my Fleshling Simulation Staff, however I won't even consider wearing the worthless Shapeshifter's Signet.

Actually, I'm not sure Emmerald took the 2-roll system of special attacks into account when making his spreadsheets that would actually make +hit worth more than he has it, regardless I know he undervalues +skill since he doesn't take the .1% crit you get per point versus higher level mobs.

 

Kazanir

He didn't. To be more specific, you can't put in one miss rate for white attacks and one for yellow attacks, so it's impossible to be entirely accurate by differentiating the 5.6%/8.6% miss rates.

[13:07] <Kazanir> Vontre was responsible for Black Mesa
[13:08] <Vontre> Is Black Mesa some Half-Life thing?

 

Quasar

Or got Shattrath Leggings with Cobrahide on them first and has been too lazy to farm more =P

The amusing thing about inspecting other Druids' armory profiles is I'll first hear about their stats, get googly eyed... then check their armory and realize they're wearing almost the exact same thing with the exact same enchants as I am. Occasionally I'll see a Compass or Pocketwatch, Ash-tempered or Clefthide, but it's always the same stuff. I guess I keep hoping someone discovers a new drop from bosses that I can add to my list. I contemplated Tier 4 shoulders for the armor and large sta until I realized I'd lose my Sun-Gilded's +hit.

So since this is all vaguely related to +hit, has anybody tried Warpscale or Midnight in place of the usual Ash-Tempered or Clefthide? I stared at them all for a while (I can honestly say I have almost every single pair of blue and purple leather pants in the game excluding tier 4/5; it's like a monstrous collection that leaves me wondering why they way overitemized this one slot) trying to think about what I'd lose for that +hit, but I'm starting to feel like a man dying of thirst.

JUICE! Aww I'm sorry. Did... did anyone want some juice?

 

• Crowbite

IMO Drop those shoulders. I assume you are sporting an Earthwarden. I tell my dps to wait for either 2 lacerates or the mangle debuff then they can go to town. I have no +hit and I have yet to have anyone pull a boss off me. Threat is not an issue, Mitigation is

 

Boevis

I'm honestly really close to slapping a Nethercleft patch my my CHLs for more Hit.

The sacrifices I've had to make, and the dozens of gems I've re-socketed after gear shifts is rediculous. Drop armor here to gain agi/sta and blue socket for my metagem, drop armor there for agi/resilience, raise armor a different place to keep Maulgar from 2 shotting me. Swap everything around to maximize my AP while staying crit immune with over 15k hp in bear for OT adds on Hydross ... Trying to be a competitive tank is getting frustrating.

 

Quasar

I didn't win the Shoulders last night anyway, though I will most likely look to pick them up (so much sta!) next time. But still, I'm very conscious about strings of Parry/Miss from a boss and always think "maybe if I had more +hit, I wouldn't be so worried." I don't really have aggro issues but it keeps me very nervous.

JUICE! Aww I'm sorry. Did... did anyone want some juice?

 

Korik

I personally love the Wastewalker Leggings, from Nexus Prince in Mana Tombs heroic. Sure, they are lacking in the strength/AP area, but the 4-piece set bonus from Wastewalker procs so often, and its got 3 sockets (x3 16 atk pwr, 8 str, 8 agi or 8 crit) that IMO they are the best dps legs you can get from any 5-man.

Then again, obviously I don't use these legs when I am tanking, and this thread is titled 'Bear Tank Item Comparisons'

 

oldmandennis

We'll be heading to Hydross in the fairly near future (2nd Kara group has had a couple of really close attempts on the Prince. I've been searching the AH nonstop for "protection" items, but are you saying that if you are crit immune, threat > resistance for off tanking?

 

Husyor

I should just start a dps thread, but this is more or less a feral thread it seems so Im going to post it here again. I wont post here again if you tell me not to. So is there a limit where feral skill loses its value, and whats wrong with the shapeshifters signet? It is a little better than Adal's command which I see a lot of people using or people using different rings entirely?

 

swills

Following the above tangent on Cat DPS gear, I haven't yet heard anyone mention the crafted Braided Eternium Chain.

I haven't made one to test it yet, but assuming the following:

1) The +5 Weapon Damage applies to cat form just like Might of Cenarius did.
2) The +Hit is relevant to you.
3) You are only wearing it while you can activate the +Crit.

is this not the best cat DPS neck in the game by a considerable margin? That's before you even consider the additional DPS that might be gained by any other group members.

 

Boevis

A'dal's is 82 AP in cat, 1.02% Dodge, .6% crit. Shapeshifters is 23 AP, 1.56% dodge, .92% crit + benefits of 5 weapon skill rating.

Now, weapon skill is currently under a bit of scrutiny I believe. A CM posted:
Which is contrary to the "opposite of defense, and +.1% crit per point" everyone believed it to be, and honestly makes +skill more valuable than +hit and +crit combined. However, assuming Crezax is right, Shapeshifters adds 1% lower miss .5% lower dodge 3.0% lower parry and 1% crit.

If this is correct, Shapeshifters is amazing for tanking, and with +10 skill you can completely eliminate boss Parry, which is currently a rather big deal.

 

levk

I didn't see Heavy Clefthoof crafted stuff, how does that compare and what would you socket it with? Linky http://www.wowhead.com/?itemset=574