Enhance Shaman: The Collected Works of Theorycraft, Vol I - Page 121

Rob · 09/26/07, 2:43 PM

Yeah, this seems like it will be an advantage in small-format PvP (1v1, 2v2, 3v3). Any 5v5 team should have some type of offensive dispeller and you'll probably be CCing a healer, not the purgebot. However, I could see popping this allowing me to survive a large burst before the opposing team is able to get a purge off. (Or possibly forcing them to purge this + say, Mana Shield, before they purge BoP, or BoP & Mana Shield before this.)

I'm excited to try it out.

Sashiel · 09/26/07, 3:56 PM

Originally Posted by Delita

rocketboots + FS? :p I am a little concerned that the proposed talent increases to enhancement will get a nerf eventually, the mana effecieny introduced in the 11 point talent shamanistic focus (?) will effectively reduce my mana consumption by ~30%, as I will almost always have this buff up. (30%ish crit unbuffed) Add raid buffs and my suicide spec and I could potentially be around 50+% crit with all the procs running. (I know it's redundant, but it makes the rogues cry).

Maybe they'll take out/rework/reduce the mana effeciency further up the tree?

My guess is the increased mana effeciency is intended to make it easier for us to go full out dps, then stop in the middle of a battle and have enough mana to throw some heals around (heals improved by the mental quickness buff.)

Pitbuller · 09/26/07, 5:28 PM

"Spirit Weapons will also reduce melee threat by a total of 30% rather than 15%."

Then we are same line with dps warriors when talking treath issues. This is just what i have ever wished for.

slant · 09/26/07, 6:01 PM

Warriors have only 20% reduction, but it applies to all of their damage, not just melee. But given that shocks are ~10% of our overall damage and likely more once we get the AP->SP in 2.3, I agree. It'll put us on par with warriors.

Ilmatar · 09/26/07, 6:02 PM

I didn't see this posted, so I'll quote it:

We're adding new relics to support all talent trees in patch 2.3 for Shaman, Paladins and Druids. In addition, (not that this will sweep you off your feet), most of the arena-system relics have been renamed so there is a more consistent naming convention.

I remember some rumors about the Trials of the Naaru questline yielding something, but it looks like you are going to get a title from that (forgot exactly where I saw that blue post) and Eyonix was pointing to ZA for filling in some of our gear gaps.

drats · 09/26/07, 6:05 PM

Originally Posted by Ilmatar

I didn't see this posted, so I'll quote it:

I remember some rumors about the Trials of the Naaru questline yielding something, but it looks like you are going to get a title from that (forgot exactly where I saw that blue post) and Eyonix was pointing to ZA for filling in some of our gear gaps.

If people are looking for specifics, here's the blue tracker link:

WoW BlueTracker: Enhancement shaman - Low blow

Ilmatar · 09/26/07, 6:16 PM

Err, doh, meant to post the link, thanks.

Malan · 09/26/07, 6:19 PM

WoW Forums -> Enhancement shaman - Low blow
You heard it here first, Eyonix confirms slow weapons are best with Windfury!

Nite_Moogle · 09/26/07, 6:25 PM

Originally Posted by Malan

You heard it here first, Eyonix confirms slow weapons are best with Windfury!

This can only mean one thing: they are planning on changing the mechanics of Windfury to make it better with faster weapons in a future patch.

slant · 09/26/07, 6:28 PM

Don't bet on it. She truly doesn't understand what that implies, despite everybody rolling over themselves trying to explain it.

Malan · 09/26/07, 6:42 PM

No, Eyonix went on to say that true min/maxers will continue to use slow weapons, and that its totally ok if AverageJoe uses a dagger but doesn't know better.

Nite_Moogle · 09/26/07, 6:43 PM

Cross posting this from the Elemental thread:

The second change impacts water shield. This spell will no longer cost any mana to cast (which also means the five-minute rule will not be affected) and the mana granted per globe has been substantially increased. Additionally, the spells duration has been shortened to one minute and at the end of its duration it now grants mana for any remaining globes.

WoW Forums -> Upcoming Elemental Shaman Changes
Outstanding change that all but ensures you'll have an elemental shield up at all times. More mana to use is never a bad thing.

Also, I was being completely sarcastic slant :P Once clueless people start understanding things, it's time to change it!

rava · 09/26/07, 6:50 PM

Lets not change the focus of this thread, but to clarify, though I've already made a follow-up explaining that I wasn't stating those were by any means "good" enhancement stats, but rather discussing with a player that in my personal opinion and in my experience those stats are better than spirit and spell crit.
Also, you may not fully understand statification and item budgeting. Those values would convert to an extreme minimal amount of enhancement preferred stats.

All I can really do is laugh about that. Yeah, taking 11/5 off of an item would give you minimal values elsewhere when mp/5 is one of the most overbudget stats.

Stander · 09/26/07, 7:29 PM

Nemaa · 09/26/07, 7:50 PM

Reading that bluetracker post I found this (regarding the new mental quickness talent):
"Okay, right. Sorry guys. I've had quite a bit to keep track of as of late. That change is going into patch 2.3. But instead it will convert from spirit rather than attack power."
WoW Forums -> Enhancement shaman - Low blow

I tought it gets a nerf. 30% AP to spellup is way more that we should get.

Malan · 09/26/07, 7:52 PM

Originally Posted by Stander

Dont know if this applies but does anyone use Wicked Edge of the Planar and notice the fiery trail is gone? That trail was sweet, anyone know if this was a mistake or intended?

I think you were looking for this thread - 2.2 Undocumented 'Features'

Nemma - wrong. Re-read the post. He was joking. It will be 30% of AP.

Ilmatar · 09/26/07, 7:54 PM

Malan got it.

Grogzor · 09/26/07, 7:56 PM

Edit - Beaten to the Punch

Nemaa · 09/26/07, 8:03 PM

Ah sorry about the confusion, that post scared me. So it's going to be 30% of attack power, thank god

Yo: today I acquired quite lot of good loots and I was curious how the AEP values changed using your sim again. The results were surprising:
Crit Rating=2.02
Agility=1.96
Hit Rating=2.06
Haste Rating=1.9
Armor Penetration=0.29

Is this supposed to be true? Hit rating is better than crit rating? Is this some kind of bug in the sim or it's again theory < simulation? My base stats are:
AP: 1678
Crit: 33.02%
Hit Rating: 140 (+9% talents)
Haste: 2.35%
Armor Penetration: 175

Malan · 09/26/07, 8:09 PM

What were your values prior to that so we have a comparison?

Oh and also, its been said that when you hit high values of AP that your Hit rating becomes a lot more important, so maybe you're just seeing that dynamic.

Nemaa · 09/26/07, 8:16 PM

Originally Posted by Malan

What were your values prior to that so we have a comparison?

Oh and also, its been said that when you hit high values of AP that your Hit rating becomes a lot more important, so maybe you're just seeing that dynamic.

As far as I know hit improves only white damage what means ~50% of my total damage. Also crit rating gets worse as you gain more, this was discussed when we talked about feral 5% crit or 3% all damage (hunter buff). Maybe I'm at the point where 50% of my damage improved by 1 point of hit is better than 90% of my damage improved by 1 point of crit?

The old values were:
Crit Rating=2.16
Agility=2.1
Hit Rating=1.91
HasteRating=1.62
Armor Penetration=0.28
This was calculated with an older version of the sim what did not include trinkets but had mongoose and buffs working. I was in a 16.36% passive haste gear that time, maybe that's the difference? Today I dropped my passive haste to 2.35% to improve my AP and Crit.

Illundai · 09/26/07, 8:41 PM

Originally Posted by Shabadu

With unholy frenzy I was often waiting 4-5 seconds after the wf cooldown was up to proc. Bad luck, but I sincerly doubt it was queueing.

I saw a pretty harsh drop off in DPS on Anetheron, I lost about 200dps compared to last week with the same gear. I didn't get a good check on my other benchmark fight, Teron, since I got the second shadow of death. We'll see how it is on Council and Reliquary later.

Hm, I didn't notice anything of that sort. My gear isn't as great as some of you here, but I did a nice 1436 DPS on Anetheron, which is more than last week (which is no surprise, considering the amount of upgrades I get whilst farming tier 6 content) but still, it's a number close to what you would expect from my gear (-shoulders and chest, which I got today).

Wow Web Stats

Aknazer · 09/26/07, 9:10 PM

About FS coming off of DR. Currently it's the ONLY snare on DR. Hamstring, frost bolt, Cone of Cold, Blast Wave, that warrior yell (forget the name), Wing Clip, Earth Bind, Curse of Exhaustion, Slow, and any other ability that slows you down isn't on DR. Now actual CC is, but not snares.

Also I hope they make SR a non magic ability, but I don't think they will sadly. At least not until there is a lot of crying about it not doing hardly anything in PvP (which really is what it's meant for) due to getting removed by one of the the various removal abilities.

Oh and just to confirm what the other people have been saying, WF is still on the 3 second CD. I have time stamps and Shaman's Friend and Shaman's Friend never reported a WF within 3 seconds of another WF last night in TK.

Yo! · 09/26/07, 9:19 PM

+ Changed armor functionality slightly (uses Mitigation = 10557.5/(Math.max(Armor,0)+10557.5 now)
+ Changed SS chance to miss to MH yellow attack chance to miss (0 effect in 99% cases)
+ Added Outland zone pvp buff to Buffs tab (input increased elemental damage manually)
+ Changed procs' ppms of Dragonspine Trophy and Madness of the Betrayer to be unaffected by speed. This is still experimental - if it will prove to be game-like - several other procs will be changed as well
+ Added 20 s hidden cooldown to Dragonspine Trophy (huge nerf)

Originally Posted by Nemaa

As far as I know hit improves only white damage what means ~50% of my total damage. Also crit rating gets worse as you gain more, this was discussed when we talked about feral 5% crit or 3% all damage (hunter buff). Maybe I'm at the point where 50% of my damage improved by 1 point of hit is better than 90% of my damage improved by 1 point of crit?

The old values were:
Crit Rating=2.16
Agility=2.1
Hit Rating=1.91
HasteRating=1.62
Armor Penetration=0.28
This was calculated with an older version of the sim what did not include trinkets but had mongoose and buffs working. I was in a 16.36% passive haste gear that time, maybe that's the difference? Today I dropped my passive haste to 2.35% to improve my AP and Crit.

Yes - theoretically it is possible that there is a point when Hit (applying to only 50% of your damage but increasing on-hit procs uptime such as most trinkets and windfury) is better over Crit (applying to 90+% of your damage but not increasing UR -already 100% and increasing flurry only slightly). This highly depends on trinkets and other on-hit procs and is achievable with the end-game gear with extreme crit levels.

rava · 09/27/07, 1:33 AM

Well, all of our mages are arcane now, bye coe/scorch

. I don't really feel right earthshocking simply due to larger benefits from other classes, so gimp flameshock rules on.

RED nerf getting undone also!