• Khlysti

It had been fixed to 30% (1000+ mana per proc) by the time M'uru was testable.

 

Seidule

Hello!

I am currently using a twisting macro consisting of a castsequence:

I would like to improve this macro by having it use Drums of Battle and Haste Potions when they are up. Any people good with the macro interface able to assist?

Thanks,
Andu

 

◊ Malan

Why don't you try the UI/Macro forum since that question doesn't have anything to do with Enhancement mechanics.

Vyktianity already has over 75 billion followers. The first verse in his book "Gift of the Wild" is "In the beginning Vyk cast lifebloom and then maul."

 

Seidule

Apologies, Malan. I figured a macro like that would be useful to everyone who religiously reads the thread (like me!)

 

• Toots Hepcat

Remember -- in WoW, there's a special meaning of the term "normalization." Normalization is when a "special attack" does the same damage within a wide range of weapon speeds -- say, one value from 1.3 to 1.9, another from 2.0-2.8 and another with speeds slower than 3s.

The normalization you're talking about -- when the additional damage of an attack is offset by some other factor, such as proc rate -- might better be called "scaling with faster weapons" just to separate the two concepts.

SS is unnormalized and it doesn't scale because it does weapon damage from each weapon and it has a cooldown -- even if SS didn't proc WF, there would be a slight benefit to slower weapons. (MaxDPS.com, whose equations don't account for the WF cooldown or its ability to proc from SS, still shows a slight benefit to slower weapons because of SS).

As an aside, I'd really like to find some way to state the average lag between windfuries as a function.

 

Illundai

If you maximize DPS, you're chugging a Haste Potion every cooldown.

I forgot to add this was after the 30% fix, maybe it was me being unlucky or maybe not but I did not get full mana every time. In my opinion it's worth testing it a bit further before shrugging it off as bad luck.

 

Visionnaire

Takes up a Haste Potion opportunity, though.

Edit: Sorry, somebody got to it before me.

 

Xoya

So based on some of the testing people have done recently (within the past 6 pages), has it been concluded that using a haste potion or bloodlusting during shamanistic rage actually reduces our mana gained?

 

Rhaegal

I'd lean towards unlucky, as I haven't had any issues, but I'm still not terribly surprised. With a constant proc rate (assuming, of course, they have kept the same PPM), doubling the amount returned on each hit, and halving the duration, it's more likely to give abnormal total amounts of mana over the duration of the effect. It should still average out to be the same over all uses, but I'm expecting it to see both extremes occur more frequently (i.e., returning an inadequate amount of mana vs. filling it up way before the end of the effect--expect the same average return, but a higher standard deviation). Yay statistics.

Unfortunately I don't have time to confirm this week after work, though. If no one's addressed it by Saturday, I'll spend a few hours on live and test and compare logs.

Stand back! I'm going to try SCIENCE!

 

Joy

My experiences on Brutallus (the only Sunwell fight I got to do as Enhance cause of attendance >_> ) was that I always had full mana with a few seconds to go on the buff. Mind you I wear full leather (ie a small mana pool) apart from my new peices of t6.

That being said, I certainly had more mana troubles than I do on live because you end up with 105 seconds to spend your mana rather than 90.

More annoyingly though is that I regularly tank the first killed mob on trash pulls if a tank is having afk on BT trash and this nerf will see me on the floor a fair bit more than currently.

 

slant

That's not exactly correct as the weapon's damage remains unchanged and weapons with a higher damage range (which are usually also slower) are still beneficial. Only the contribution from attack power is normalized. Thus weapon speed's effects on normalized instant attacks is minimized but not eliminated entirely.

Windfury doesn't need to be normalized as it's (supposedly) a set percentage of attacks. Stormstrike should be; they just missed it.

 

Myul

That's was really hurting us with the change. Before, you was full of mana at point X and twisted/shocked while SR was still up until point y when it was running out. If you have enough ap to regen to full in 15s before, it was fine. But the additional regen is needed to substain your full shock/twisting cycle on eg. Teron. I can not substain that full cycle nowadays on teron without a mana pot (no judgement normally) or only while wearing int heavy mail items (~ 6.5k manapool raidbuffed regulary). I'm running out of mana ~ 20s to early and with the hit of 2.4 it will be 35s every 2 minutes?

Additionally it helped also a lot to survive eg. RoS and Illidan phase 2 (as mentioned some pages before).

 

syrixx

I’m not good with math at all. This is purely theorycraft not tested in-game. Sure there are other rotations. Yes I am aware of lag and response time to the server. Yes I see that mistake there now that you have pointed it out, thank you. Please don’t hurt me.

Ability rotations:
*ability – wait seconds*
(A) Holding off on shocks to get SS every chance possible
Ss – 1.5 – Fs – 6 – Es – 2.5 – Ss – 3.5 – Fs – 6.5 – Ss – 1.5 – Es 6 – Fs – 2.5 – Ss – 3.5 – Es – 6.5
time – 40 seconds
Ss’s – 4
Fs’s – 3
Es’s – 3

(B) Pressing whatever is not on cooldown in SS/FS/ES order
Ss – 1.5 – Fs – 6 – Es – 2.5 – Ss – 3.5 – Fs – 6 – Es – 1.5 – SS – 4.5 – FS – 5.5 – SS – 1.5 - Es – 6 – Fs – 2.5 – SS – 5.5 – Es – 4.5
time – 51 seconds
Ss’s – 5
Fs’s – 4
Es’s – 4

COMPARE:
(A) in 2040 seconds (40*51)
Ss’s – 204
Fs’s – 153
Es’s – 153

(B) in 2040 seconds(51*40)
Ss’s – 200
Fs’s – 160
Es’s – 160

!RESULT:
(1) How much damage is 4 Ss’s?
(2) How much damage is 7 Fs’s + 7 Es’s?

The difference of 1 and 2 is how little difference the rotations make over a 34min period of time.

What’s the point Syrix?
Because I’ve heard enhance shaman arguing before over this exact nitpicky rotation difference.

G15 Keyboard Owners:
Put one of those rotations into a macro that repeats on toggle on/off. Now you can go afk to do a quest for your spouse…

afk 1min, a spider “as big as the cat!” has my wife cornered in the bathroom standing on the sink screaming obscenities…

 

panny

Petition for SR to have a 1 min cooldown instead?

 

Ardonomus

"OMG Enhanc shammy OP IN PVP!!!11oneone"

I can just imagine that's the replies that will fly in our faces. Though it's a fair idea PVE wise.

 

Atren

Normalization is equalising all. There are several distinctive ways to do it:

1. Skills with cooldowns and ppm. Since it is obvious slower weapons would gain huge bonus over it, equalising here is done by giving the skills set speed for AP. Weapons damage still bring favor to slower ones, but difference is not that bad. Mortal Strike and SoC for example.

2. Flat rate procs. In this the proc rate itself normalizes the damage done. Faster weapons proc more often while slower ones proc for more damage. WF is perfect example of this.

3. Damage added per attack. In this case weapon speed affects amount of additional damage given. Because if it would not fast weapons would be clearly favored. Flametongue is perfect example of that.

Yes, in wow only first is mentioned because it had to be fixed in patch (and causing a lot of turmoil) as well as being most obvious.

Now concerning WF, as i said SS is what causes the emphasis to slower weapons even if 3 second cooldown did not exist. Same would apply to anything that can proc WF. So even if 3 sec cooldown would not exist slower weapons are better, but difference would be far less brutal than what it is at the moment.

 

• Toots Hepcat

What you're talking about is cycle prioritization, and there's a third option, which is to shock as often as possible and only use stormstrike when WF is off cooldown.

This rotation is harder to predict, but very simple to perform. First, get a copy of a windfury timer -- Enhancer has a good one. When your shocks and your stormstrike come off cooldown at the same time (which is the only time we really care about prioritizing them), if Windfury is off cooldown, you stormstrike. If windfury IS on cooldown, you shock...and don't strike until the cooldown is up.

You decrease your stormstrike damage, but it may be offset by also decreasing the lag between windfuries.

 

callidas

Seal of Righteousness is normalised (sorry: prevented from scaling) in the 3rd way, faster weapons hitting for less holy damage.

 

Atren

Umm, that is exactly what third one says. It is just question if you choose base of fastest weapon or slowest weapon :P If fastest weapon it deals more damage and if slowest then it will deal less damage as goes faster. I guess this is one of those glass half full/empty things

Good point about that 15 second increase, and i think we can add Gurtrogg Fel Rage to those encounters where SR is very useful :P

 

Storming

Yes but I'm distrustful of some of this, a bit. Its too easy for 'conventional wisdom' to become enfranchised especially here in this game where doing anything outside of the norm gets you lampooned. Cookie cutter specs or gtfo etcetc.

Concerning wf naturally meshing with weapons that have speeds complementary to an integer value of 3.0 (such as a 1.5speed axe) for pvp purposes, all of the stuff mentioned thus far is mostly a moot point at best.

I'm not even spec'd into flurry, for which I catch shit endlessly.. because your pvp target conveniently stands there til you get a crit, THEN stands around some more so that you can get a few hasted hits just so you get your money's worth from those talent points, right?

..right?

Haste is great and I'll get my piece of that pie as appropriate but its real value is surely pve, in environments where you can just stand behind a raid boss for 8min and drill away.

So assuming no haste and the usual stick-and-move pvp environment, would it be feasible to redress the age-old thing about weapon speed to see if its possible to make a different weapon 'fit' better? I got my offhand s1 axe also.. at the last second I came very close to getting the 1.5speed version just to see how things would go. But alas, I punked out and now DW the 2.6's with crusader on both. Once dual s3's are in hand, then itll be time for mongoose and all that good stuff.

 

Prost

Having participated in arenas myself as enhance, I'd disagree with most of what you just posted. I've only really done 5s, and I'm usually not alive very long once they figure out I'm enhance. Basically, you want to inflict as much damage as possible before dying, so large, slow weapons would be the best to burst immediately with SS. Usually you'll crit and gain flurry, so follow the SS with a frost shock and stay within range as long as you can to inflict the most damage.

My understanding of PvP DPS is "burst is king", so if that theory holds correct, wouldn't you want to do as much damage in a short amount of time as possible?

 

Daler

[Shaman] PvP + Enhancement = ?

Might want to head over there for discussions about enh PvP.

 

Skyhoof

Can someone clarify the amount of expertise rating needed to become capped? Is it 90 or 103? And can we add the answer to 3.1.5 Expertise Rating? Prior to seeing the new gear in Patch 2.4, I never worried about being expertise capped before. Thanks.