Anyways, little correction to Managing your threat part -- as Retribution paladins now have talent for 30% thread reduction to all (opposed to our physical only) i doubt the part referring to them in there anymore is true.
You can post corrections directly to the wiki article.
I'm checking to see whats desired, but we might end up closing this thread (archiving it) and then any discussion on "what weapon is best" etc etc would need to start a new thread.
Not to be daft but is there a directory or perhaps a listing of some sample Yo! simulator runs for people of appropriate t6 gear levels? We are working on Brutallus and as such I am trying to make sure that my personal contribution is up to snuff, and I want to compare it to some of you who have been in on kills. I realize I can go look at WWS for the "actual" versus the "theoretical" but I am trying to make sure that the gear is there before I worry about the group-stack and method.
I have calculated these values from Yo's sim using 15shock/2minute.
I used 2*2.6 weapons.
Mh wDPS ep: 7.4
Oh wDPS ep: 3.6
These numbers slighly scale with gear -+ 1%.
Wiki version say:
Weapon DPS EP Values
Pitbuller and Rob have shown that it is possible to convert weapon DPS into EP values. This is useful to compute the total EP of a weapon in order to compare two weapons, as seen in this post (link to where you or someone compared Netherbane to MG Cleaver). The following values are only valid for a 2.6 speed weapon. EP would need to be recalculated for any other speeds. These are presented here because 2.6 is the most common speed for weapons.
1 MH DPS = 9.03 EP
1 OH DPS = 3.70 EP
Wich numbers you wanna use there? Or do someone retest this math with sim?
On section 3.1.1 Using EP - Examples for the [Valestalker Girdle] you are using (T5) EP Values would it not be more appropiate to use the High Raid (T6) EP Values since the item drops in T6 instance.
Question:
I understand that [Claw of Molten Fury] is a set and we might as shamans find it quite insulting since the OH is of 1.50 speed which no ehn. shaman will use and probaly will never whish to obtain until everyone that wishes the item has it. According to my calculation its a 982.8 AEP doesn't this make the item desireable if all luck to get a [Rising Tide] or [Syphon of the Nathrezim] has been lost?
On section 3.1.1 Using EP - Examples for the [Valestalker Girdle] you are using (T5) EP Values would it not be more appropiate to use the High Raid (T6) EP Values since the item drops in T6 instance.
Question:
I understand that [Claw of Molten Fury] is a set and we might as shamans find it quite insulting since the OH is of 1.50 which no ehn. shaman will use and probaly will never whish to obtain until everyone that wishes the item has it. According to my calculation its a 982.8 AEP doesn't this make the item desireable if all luck to get a [Rising Tide] or [Syphon of the Nathrezim] has been lost?
In Yo!'s sim, [Claw of Molten Fury] with [Syphon of the Nathrezim] came out to better dps for me than the Tide/Syphon combo. I believe the claw is on the list of "Second only to season 3", but it just didn't make the OP as it was undiscovered trash loot until right before 2.4.
Having just done Brutallus for the first time yesterday it must be said that this fight is amazingly fun for melee.
I respeced an elemental subspec for the first time and had moderate results Wow Web Stats .
I was consistently able to sustain just under 2100 dps while twisting, on the kill I forgot to repot after my elixir of demonslaying wore off so lost a bit of DPS there. I had never been ele before so wasn't sure about whether to keep a 1;1 rotation so ended up doing 1;2 letting Flameshock get it's last tick. I also ran oom for about 10s because JoW was knocked off and not reapplied.
There were a few times my rotation fell apart because I was leading the raid and had to move groups or type something out. 3 drummers in the group and about every buff imaginable bar world buffs.
With a Mounting Vengeance and a SoC I think I could comfortably get around 2120 dps.
Anyway as I said I loved this fight and will look forward to it every week.
Edit -sorry linked a wws that didn't include pets. Wow Web Stats should be correct.
Joy thanks for the post, that is great information for shaman working on Brut. I just wished you would have logged out in your enhancement gear instead of healing =). 2100 dps is very impressive.
I am currently working on Brutallus myself, and am pushing for that 2k barrier.
I have always noticed when simulating how the more of a stat you have the less EP it usually gives. Ofc there are obvious exceptions, but you see where i'm going here. It's usually the stats you have less of that offer the biggest EP gain. That said, on Brutallus when you have every buff available, and are having drums of battle chained on you all the time, i was wondering whether anyone has found Insane Strength Pots to offer up more dps boost than a haste pot?
Or whether the haste would still offer the biggest dps gain, even with Bloodlust, and drums etc.
Was pushing 1900 dps last time without a ret pally or arms warrior. Going in with them next time so really hoping to see that 2k mark reached.
On section 3.1.1 Using EP - Examples for the [Valestalker Girdle] you are using (T5) EP Values would it not be more appropiate to use the High Raid (T6) EP Values since the item drops in T6 instance.
This is precisely the type of comment that should have been a reply to the wiki, not here.
I currently have Gladiator's Cleaver in main hand and Boggspine Knuckles in offhand (Wich is kinda sucks).
So my question is, should i buy the fist weps or should i spend them on armor gear like chest and legs. And i've heard from friends that buying the fist weps will decrease my dps since the haste screws up the WF mechanics. But wouldn't the white swings make up for my Wf procs?
Yeah, overall the weps are an upgrade. Just alittle confused about the haste.
I am currently working on Brutallus myself, and am pushing for that 2k barrier.
I have always noticed when simulating how the more of a stat you have the less EP it usually gives. Ofc there are obvious exceptions, but you see where i'm going here. It's usually the stats you have less of that offer the biggest EP gain. That said, on Brutallus when you have every buff available, and are having drums of battle chained on you all the time, i was wondering whether anyone has found Insane Strength Pots to offer up more dps boost than a haste pot?
Or whether the haste would still offer the biggest dps gain, even with Bloodlust, and drums etc.
Was pushing 1900 dps last time without a ret pally or arms warrior. Going in with them next time so really hoping to see that 2k mark reached.
Do you have a WWS parse showing around 1900 and what is your group setup? How many BL and drums do you have? Our gear is not a lot different and I have been trying everything I know (3 drums, 3 haste pots, 2 bloodlusts) and I can't seem to get over 1700.
Haste pots seemed to be better for me. I use bloodlust for my group off the start, then 45seconds later I hit haste pot/berserking then just use everything as the cooldown comes up.
I currently have Gladiator's Cleaver in main hand and Boggspine Knuckles in offhand (Wich is kinda sucks).
So my question is, should i buy the fist weps or should i spend them on armor gear like chest and legs. And i've heard from friends that buying the fist weps will decrease my dps since the haste screws up the WF mechanics. But wouldn't the white swings make up for my Wf procs?
Yeah, overall the weps are an upgrade. Just alittle confused about the haste.
/broken record
Use the simulator linked in the OP. Run 3 sims.
Current Gear
Gear with 2.4 badge fists
Gear with 2.4 armor pieces
Compare results and figure out what will give the biggest bang for the buck immediately.
Do you have a WWS parse showing around 1900 and what is your group setup? How many BL and drums do you have? Our gear is not a lot different and I have been trying everything I know (3 drums, 3 haste pots, 2 bloodlusts) and I can't seem to get over 1700.
Haste pots seemed to be better for me. I use bloodlust for my group off the start, then 45seconds later I hit haste pot/berserking then just use everything as the cooldown comes up.
Your spec confuses me, no Call of Flame, one of the main reason to spec elemental. Elemental Focus...? That's even worse than Elemental Devastation. Elemental Warding also helps tons with burns for Brutallis, with SR and Elemental Warding I think the final ticks were doing about 1k per tick instead of 1.5k.
Anybody know if Enhancer is broken at the moment? I can't get any of the menu commands to work and anytime I drop a totem I get a massive error. Fresh install of the latest build.
Your spec confuses me, no Call of Flame, one of the main reason to spec elemental. Elemental Focus...? That's even worse than Elemental Devastation. Elemental Warding also helps tons with burns for Brutallis, with SR and Elemental Warding I think the final ticks were doing about 1k per tick instead of 1.5k.
I was trying to sava mana last night because our ret paladin was not on but I still wanted to be able to do 2 shocks per twist. In the end it didn't help much anyways to have 5/5 convection. Usually I have concussion/warding/CoF/reverb.
I'd be curious as to the differences in EP values between Aldor and Scryer, assuming basic tier 6 (BT/MH aka sub-expertise cap) gear levels.
Maybe I'm missing something, but why would it matter if you're at the expertise cap for this item? Because the Aldor proc is AP, its EP value won't change depending on the rest of your gear. The Scryer proc is direct elemental damage, and I'm not sure yet whether it can be dodged (more likely it's subject to resists), and if so, whether its dodge chance can be modified by your expertise.
After this post there was a bit of discussion about theridge in the graph for equal-speed weapons. They appear inferior, but then someone asked if the sim took into account the benefit match-speed weapons had from both being haste for the final (third) hit in flurry. Yo said that the sim did not account for that. I did not see any further discussion about this on the following few pages.
Did further work show that the third-flurry-hit benefit outweighs the loss shown in the sim, for DWing identical-speed weapons?
This is something I have been wondering myself, and I havent been able to find any other posts that adress the issue with a solid answer. Is the extra attack under flurry (and subsequently the extra flurry uptime) enough to remove the dps lost to the extra offhand WF procs? Or is the one extra attack trivial and the loss from WF too substantial?
It hasn't worked since 2.4 came out. There are a few other mods that will show the WF cooldown though. Actually, Enhancer is broken completely it seems atm. Time to find another one!
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Can someone help me understand why the slowest possible MH weap is the best? If we are trying to get as many MH WF procs as possible, wouldn't a "fastest" MH and "slowest" OH be the best dps combo? I just don't get why you want the slowest of both... thx for any input
I was running some simulations today with Yo's! simulator and I was getting some weird EP values for haste rating. Based off of my current gear it was averaging out at 0.44 EP, which seems really low. The last time I ran the simulator haste was coming in at an EP value of 2.0, and the only thing that has changed for me since then is I picked up a Shard of Contempt and T6 bracers.
Was this already mentioned? I searched the thread but didn't see anything.
04/03/08, 8:48 AM
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