That'll teach me to actually work when I'm in the office.
Even still, losing the 3% to hit from Resto seems too big to lose to me in comparison. I'm also a horrible twister.
You'll get used to it with some practice. On my very first Kara run with my alt-Shaman it just happened to be the day of (or close to?) the hot-fix nerf to WF totem. I was a little distraught by that so I decided to totem twist and I felt it turned out pretty well. I wish I would have had a Kara run prior to the nerf just to see number wise where everything fell.
From what I could see graphically, it appeared to proc a good number of times for the Rogue and Prot-warrior in my group. And the stats showed 283 procs for the Rogue and 381 for the Prot-warrior over the course about 3 hours and 15 minutes. So roughly about 1.5 procs per minute for the Rogue and 2.05 per minute for the Warrior. OK ... It doesn't look so good that way, but again, I wish I had before-nerf stats to compare the results. From everything I've read though, it's a drop, which is a shame as WF totem doesn't benefit me at all.
And if you can ignore my low DPS numbers (I wasn't shocking near as much as I should have) and my sub-par gear, I thought I did alright. What was really impressive to me was the speed we took out some of the bosses. Aran was dead in just over 2 minutes ... and that's something I haven't even done with my main.
All I know is my melee group loved having WF and GoA. And towards the end I was even tossing in WoA for the hunters scorpid pet at the beginning and then going into totem twisting.
It's probably just a matter of time before they 'fix' totem twisting. But you know, I had a lot of fun doing it.
It's probably just a matter of time before they 'fix' totem twisting. But you know, I had a lot of fun doing it.
That's the word I was looking for. Totem twisting makes raiding as enhancement fun again. The normal auto-attack + shock + SS rotation was boring as hell for me. But that's a bit off-topic, so I'm done talking about it.
I am new to this forum, this is my second post only, please do not consider it as a personal assault in any form because it may state something that you used to think different about.
I am really impressed by the knowlege collected here and would like to contribute.
Let’s take a look of what is a typical answer that one will receive upon asking questions “what is my expected dps given the following gear?” or which is the same, “what is the best upgrade?” That person will be forwarded to the first page for the following algorithm:
Extensive modeling, simulation, and empirical testing by Disquette (post), Pater (post), and Tornhoof (post) have produced a generally agreed-upon set of numbers for determining the items which produce the highest DPS in a raid environment. The average of the most reliable closed-form model and iterative simulations have produced the following set of attack power equivalency valuations (AEP), for use in manual calculations or programs such as Lootzor or Pawn: Strength = 2 (2.2 w/Kings) Crit Rating = 2 Agility = 1.8 (2 w/Kings) Hit Rating = 1.4 Attack Power = 1
Here goes my key statement that I will defend bellow: AEP system’s use is so limited that it can not be used in answering the question which piece of armor will boost dps more.
I will provide simple examples with numbers later but let’s start with the following absurd statement “Extensive modeling, simulation, and empirical testing by Dr.Lee, Dr. Ivanov and Dr. Jones show that an average clicnic-wide temperature is 35,6 C (while normal is 36,6 C) and blood pressure = 110 systolic (normal being 120). These tests have produced a generally agreed-upon set of numbers for determining the pills which produce the highest positive effect. The average of the most reliable closed-form model and iterative simulations have produced the following set of temperature equivalency valuations (TEP), for use in pills selection: 1 TEP =1 C = 10 pulses. Every patient in the clinic will be given any mix of pills that increases their TEP by 2, including those with boiling blood and those at morgue.”
Here are chosen data values from empirical testing by Disquette (post).
Example 1.
2400 AP, 190 HR, 18% crit produce 776,62 dps
100 AP increase results in 789,75 dps, that is 0,1313 increase per point of AP
50 hit rating increase results in 812,54 dps, that is 0,7184 increas per point of HR
This provides HR = 5,4714 AP instead of suggested “for everybody” HR = 1,4 AP
Example 2.
800 AP, 340 HR, 31,5% crit = 531,4 dps
100 AP increase results in 556,7 dps, that is 0,253 increase per point of AP
50 hit rating increase results in 539,52 dps, that is 0,1624 increas per point of HR
This provides HR = 0,6419 AP instead of suggested “for everybody” HR = 1,4 AP
From the function analysis pov AEP is “gradient” and it should be different at every point. Replacing non-linear cross-dependent arguments with their linear combination with static weights is not allowed – that is exactly what AEP is doing. Simply put the function dps = function (AEP) can not exist.
So, instead of believing that Strength = 2 (2.2 w/Kings) Crit Rating = 2 Agility = 1.8 (2 w/Kings) Hit Rating = 1.4 Attack Power = 1 for everyone, it is in fact true for only one combination of Str, CR, Agi, Haste, etc. and in a very close vicinity around that combination. Furthermore, even in that vicinity any combination of the above attributes having the same total AEP may provide better or worse DPS than just one attribute value worth of the same AEP.
You can safely replace CR with Agi and AP with Str because they are dependent linearly, but replacing any of Str, Agi, HR, Haste with each other is not possible with static ratio.
Here is an example of non-linear cross interaction.
Think about assigning static AEP value to the item with chance-on-hit. It is obvious that haste will result in item working more, even with possible hidden cooldown that complicates haste-proc dependence. Up to 6 times faster given all available haste buffs. So, depending on haste, stat increase provided by item that is supposed to be measured by AEP can be rather different while the static item always provides same stat benefit . Same goes to haste – increasing haste by set amount will produce different results depending on how many “chance on hit” items you carry in complex non-linear way. As a side note, several items similar to dragonspine trophy can provide something similar to a “time horizon effect” of “black holes” increasing chance on hitting again while the proc lasts to almost 100% effectively making procs last forever.
So, what is the correct answer to the question “what is the best upgrade?” ?
There are several possible solutions.
1) the very best one is analytical – finding the exact formula dps =function(ap, crit, hit,…).
You simply put your ap, crit, hit, etc. values and get the probability distribution of expected dps.
Finding analytical solution is very impressive achievement and a holy grail of theorycrafting.
So far it was not found.
2) simulation – creating sim that behaves exactly like in game is considerable achievement.
So far several sims were created, none of them covering all game mechanics such as ppm trinkets, etc. and some of them are not corresponding with the in-game tests by a big margin.
3) matrix-method – uses data, mined during in-game tests directly. It looks up your values in the spreadsheet and returns corresponding recorded dps.
So, my answer would be:
1) try searching available collected raw data for your values, find corresponding dps, search for the new values with planned upgrade and compare the new dps
2) if you can not find your combo recorded – try entering your values into simulating programs that possibly can fill the gap
3) use Lootzor and AEP weights from first page as “poor man’s” last hope, do not use it at all if you are experimenting with alternative gear such as with a lot of +haste and chance-on-hit procs.
I am new to this forum, this is my second post only, please do not consider it as a personal assault in any form because it may state something that you used to think different about.
I am really impressed by the knowlege collected here and would like to contribute.
Let’s take a look of what is a typical answer that one will receive upon asking questions “what is my expected dps given the following gear?” or which is the same, “what is the best upgrade?” That person will be forwarded to the first page for the following algorithm:
Here goes my key statement that I will defend bellow: AEP system’s use is so limited that it can not be used in answering the question which piece of armor will boost dps more.
I will provide simple examples with numbers later but let’s start with the following absurd statement “Extensive modeling, simulation, and empirical testing by Dr.Lee, Dr. Ivanov and Dr. Jones show that an average clicnic-wide temperature is 35,6 C (while normal is 36,6 C) and blood pressure = 110 systolic (normal being 120). These tests have produced a generally agreed-upon set of numbers for determining the pills which produce the highest positive effect. The average of the most reliable closed-form model and iterative simulations have produced the following set of temperature equivalency valuations (TEP), for use in pills selection: 1 TEP =1 C = 10 pulses. Every patient in the clinic will be given any mix of pills that increases their TEP by 2, including those with boiling blood and those at morgue.”
Here are chosen data values from empirical testing by Disquette (post).
Example 1.
2400 AP, 190 HR, 18% crit produce 776,62 dps
100 AP increase results in 789,75 dps, that is 0,1313 increase per point of AP
50 hit rating increase results in 812,54 dps, that is 0,7184 increas per point of HR
This provides HR = 5,4714 AP instead of suggested “for everybody” HR = 1,4 AP
Example 2.
800 AP, 340 HR, 31,5% crit = 531,4 dps
100 AP increase results in 556,7 dps, that is 0,253 increase per point of AP
50 hit rating increase results in 539,52 dps, that is 0,1624 increas per point of HR
This provides HR = 0,6419 AP instead of suggested “for everybody” HR = 1,4 AP
From the function analysis pov AEP is “gradient” and it should be different at every point. Replacing non-linear cross-dependent arguments with their linear combination with static weights is not allowed – that is exactly what AEP is doing. Simply put the function dps = function (AEP) can not exist.
So, instead of believing that Strength = 2 (2.2 w/Kings) Crit Rating = 2 Agility = 1.8 (2 w/Kings) Hit Rating = 1.4 Attack Power = 1 for everyone, it is in fact true for only one combination of Str, CR, Agi, Haste, etc. and in a very close vicinity around that combination. Furthermore, even in that vicinity any combination of the above attributes having the same total AEP may provide better or worse DPS than just one attribute value worth of the same AEP.
You can safely replace CR with Agi and AP with Str because they are dependent linearly, but replacing any of Str, Agi, HR, Haste with each other is not possible with static ratio.
Here is an example of non-linear cross interaction.
Think about assigning static AEP value to the item with chance-on-hit. It is obvious that haste will result in item working more, even with possible hidden cooldown that complicates haste-proc dependence. Up to 6 times faster given all available haste buffs. So, depending on haste, stat increase provided by item that is supposed to be measured by AEP can be rather different while the static item always provides same stat benefit . Same goes to haste – increasing haste by set amount will produce different results depending on how many “chance on hit” items you carry in complex non-linear way. As a side note, several items similar to dragonspine trophy can provide something similar to a “time horizon effect” of “black holes” increasing chance on hitting again while the proc lasts to almost 100% effectively making procs last forever.
So, what is the correct answer to the question “what is the best upgrade?” ?
There are several possible solutions.
1) the very best one is analytical – finding the exact formula dps =function(ap, crit, hit,…).
You simply put your ap, crit, hit, etc. values and get the probability distribution of expected dps.
Finding analytical solution is very impressive achievement and a holy grail of theorycrafting.
So far it was not found.
2) simulation – creating sim that behaves exactly like in game is considerable achievement.
So far several sims were created, none of them covering all game mechanics such as ppm trinkets, etc. and some of them are not corresponding with the in-game tests by a big margin.
3) matrix-method – uses data, mined during in-game tests directly. It looks up your values in the spreadsheet and returns corresponding recorded dps.
So, my answer would be:
1) try searching available collected raw data for your values, find corresponding dps, search for the new values with planned upgrade and compare the new dps
2) if you can not find your combo recorded – try entering your values into simulating programs that possibly can fill the gap
3) use Lootzor and AEP weights from first page as “poor man’s” last hope, do not use it at all if you are experimenting with alternative gear such as with a lot of +haste and chance-on-hit procs.
Yo, this community seems to be working within the solution space that you have indicated. We have not found the holy grail and it may be even more difficult than you indicate considering the ever changing nature of mechanics, talents, and itemization due to patches. Please understand that some of us comprehend the nonlinear nature of the stat interactions and take the tools, data collection, and theories at face value. There are simply no better tools offered at this time. The fact that this is a sane discussion of enhancement shaman theorycraft after 57 pages is an accomplishment itself. I'm willing to accept some non "doctoral" theory and tool development since it is freely provided. If you would like to offer your services as a statistician or data specialist, I'm sure one of the "tool" developers would be happy to use your services.
I'm fairly certain everyone here understands that the values listed in the first post are only to be used as a general guide if your stats are similar to the ones used to determine the values.
Originally Posted by Yo!
1) the very best one is analytical – finding the exact formula dps =function(ap, crit, hit,…).
You simply put your ap, crit, hit, etc. values and get the probability distribution of expected dps.
Finding analytical solution is very impressive achievement and a holy grail of theorycrafting.
So far it was not found.
2) simulation – creating sim that behaves exactly like in game is considerable achievement.
So far several sims were created, none of them covering all game mechanics such as ppm trinkets, etc. and some of them are not corresponding with the in-game tests by a big margin.
3) matrix-method – uses data, mined during in-game tests directly. It looks up your values in the spreadsheet and returns corresponding recorded dps.
1) Doesn't exist, not worth worrying about.
2) Best source of info we have right now probably why it's used so widely.
3) Such a matrix doesn't exist to my knowledge and the number of variables that would need to be accounted for in producing one is staggering to imagine.
So, my answer would be:
1) try searching available collected raw data for your values, find corresponding dps, search for the new values with planned upgrade and compare the new dps
2) if you can not find your combo recorded – try entering your values into simulating programs that possibly can fill the gap
3) use Lootzor and AEP weights from first page as “poor man’s” last hope, do not use it at all if you are experimenting with alternative gear such as with a lot of +haste and chance-on-hit procs.
1) Search where exactly?
2) Certainly, however doing so is a challenge to less technically inclined users.
3) For those unable/unwilling to simulate for themselves it's certainly better than just guessing at what values are useful.
I am new to this forum, this is my second post only, please do not consider it as a personal assault in any form
but then follow it up with this:
let’s start with the following absurd statement
which makes a satire of the work that several people on this board have accomplished. When you do that, you leave little room for it to be taken as anything other than a personal assault.
That said, your argument is somewhat baffling to me since the quotation you listed states that the AEP are values "generally agreed upon" by the community. Nowhere are claims made that these are perfect and infallible values. While the front post does contain references to the 3 posts that you took some info from, those are there to provide credit to those 3 simulation authors, not to be used as authoritative sources for everything else in the post. Much of the information as we know at has changed quite a bit from the 3 links you're disputing. Further, your solutions fly in the face of the very problem you said you would set out to disprove. You begin by saying that the AEP values are wrong, and then conclude by telling everyone to just use the simulations which are exactly where the AEP values were derived from!
Yo! seems a bunch of people are jumping on you for your post, I will only a little...
Let’s take a look of what is a typical answer that one will receive upon asking questions “what is my expected dps given the following gear?” or which is the same, “what is the best upgrade?” That person will be forwarded to the first page for the following algorithm:
Despite the variances those formulas will generally give that person the correct answer. If it does happen to be off it will only be so by a very small margin. When people ask this they want to generally know what item is better for my guy Item A or Item B. They are not asking "Which item will result in 12.5676 dps increase where the exact hard numbers would completely matter. Most people know that it is not going to be the definitive end all answer 100% of the time, but are looking for a little help deciding.
An extreme example I know but if +hit is valued at 1.4 do you think people are really going to wonder why they just added +50 hit and their dps didn't go up if they are already at 500 +hit? No of course not.
People that come and post here are expected to have some base knowledge about their class. These are not the WoW general forums where complete idiocy runs so rampant. It appears you put a lot of work into your numbers, most people here apprecieate hard work so long as you present it with the right attitude, in short welcome to the community.
That's referring specifically to interrupt abilities though. Another post by Quigon also states that mobs such as Vaelstraz would turn to cast and would proc strings of parries on rogues.
Mobs can parry while casting but they definitely cannot dodge while casting. Otherwise encounters like Illidari Council and Reliquary of Souls would be pretty ridiculous.
I am a long time reader of the EJ forums and have always loved the ability to find intelligent and mature discussion about relevant topics here. This thread has been a especially good source of information for me in the last while. Thank you Malan for starting this thread and constantly updating that first post as discussion brings out important findings. I have read most of this thread, but I have to admit I have probably missed some as occasionally it gains pages so fast. I have never posted before, but wanted to see if I could direct some discussion towards some things I have been thinking about.
When BC came out this character was a alt and his professions weren't a big deal to me. He currently has Alchemy (Transmute) and Jewelcrafting, with very few patterns. Since then I have switched guilds and he has become my main. I am thinking about switching professions and am wondering if there is a opinion on how much it is worth starting from scratch on some of them or how good they are overall.
Blacksmithing. I am currently running Decapitator MH and Merc Gladiator OH. My guild is in the middle of SSC in content. Is it worth leveling Blacksmithing to get the Dragonstrike or should I just wait until we get to BT to get a Rising Tide and or Syphon? I have been planning on trying to get a second Arena weapon, but no one seems to want a Enhancement Shaman on their Arena Team. I haven't been willing to respec for Arena cause my healing or elemental gear isn't that good either. Just wondering some opinions.
Leatherworking. Is it worth leveling this up fresh? Some of the craftable gear seems really good, the leather more so then the mail. It would also provide another person in our melee group with Drums of Battle.
Enchanting. The ring enchants are very unique and something I leveled on my paladin at the start of BC cause I felt they were a great personal buff from my profession. Is the +4 stats per ring worth it?
Just wondering if anyone has any overall opinions on what professions are the best for a Enhancement Shaman. Please feel free to make any other comments on my gear. I am always looking to improve in any way I can.
I am a long time reader of the EJ forums and have always loved the ability to find intelligent and mature discussion about relevant topics here. This thread has been a especially good source of information for me in the last while. Thank you Malan for starting this thread and constantly updating that first post as discussion brings out important findings. I have read most of this thread, but I have to admit I have probably missed some as occasionally it gains pages so fast. I have never posted before, but wanted to see if I could direct some discussion towards some things I have been thinking about.
When BC came out this character was a alt and his professions weren't a big deal to me. He currently has Alchemy (Transmute) and Jewelcrafting, with very few patterns. Since then I have switched guilds and he has become my main. I am thinking about switching professions and am wondering if there is a opinion on how much it is worth starting from scratch on some of them or how good they are overall.
Blacksmithing. I am currently running Decapitator MH and Merc Gladiator OH. My guild is in the middle of SSC in content. Is it worth leveling Blacksmithing to get the Dragonstrike or should I just wait until we get to BT to get a Rising Tide and or Syphon? I have been planning on trying to get a second Arena weapon, but no one seems to want a Enhancement Shaman on their Arena Team. I haven't been willing to respec for Arena cause my healing or elemental gear isn't that good either. Just wondering some opinions.
Leatherworking. Is it worth leveling this up fresh? Some of the craftable gear seems really good, the leather more so then the mail. It would also provide another person in our melee group with Drums of Battle.
Enchanting. The ring enchants are very unique and something I leveled on my paladin at the start of BC cause I felt they were a great personal buff from my profession. Is the +4 stats per ring worth it?
Just wondering if anyone has any overall opinions on what professions are the best for a Enhancement Shaman. Please feel free to make any other comments on my gear. I am always looking to improve in any way I can.
Smithing is definitely worth it. Dragonstrike is an amazing weapon that I am unable to replace in the current raid zones. I leveled up leather working for the sole purpose of Drums of Battle, but I haven't paid much attention to the craftable gear. I wouldn't worry about enchanting; +4 stats is revered scales of the sand, something that I think a half dozen guilds that have been killing Archimonde for a while have accomplished.
If I weren't shackled to Alchemy for the rest of my life I'd do Leatherworking and Blacksmithing for sure. Get out while you still can!
I'm already a leatherworker, but I'm scared that leveling blacksmithing will be extremely expensive to do without mining. I get the impression that it costs about 5000G or more to get blacksmithing from 0-375 these days, anyone got any information about that?
Further, your solutions fly in the face of the very problem you said you would set out to disprove. You begin by saying that the AEP values are wrong, and then conclude by telling everyone to just use the simulations which are exactly where the AEP values were derived from!
Nothing wrong here. These sims helped to find AEP values as average over huge range of possible stat combos. What I am saying is that using these average values for the whole spectrum of these combos is wrong. Sims can be used to find real AEP at any given point (which is what gradient is) that can be used at lootzor for first-hand comparison with careful understanding that the further you get from starting point (the more items you are going to change) the more different results will be from what AEP score suggests leading to a possible mistake in choosing items. It is much more accurate to use sim for one set of items, get expected DPS 1, use sim for another set, get expected DPS 2, compare, continue if needed.
Ardonomus, see if some of your guild members will help you out. The three other shamans in my guild contributed a lot of the ore needed to level blacksmithing from 300-375. Pre-300 is actually fairly inexpensive if your server has a decent economy. I spent roughly 700g to get to 300, after that I spent another 1000g or so on my own materials. Added to that the large chunk I had given to me it would probably total 2500g or so. Its definitely not cheap, and I had to put off getting my epic mount to power level Leatherworking as well as Blacksmithing.
But with all that said, Dragonstrike is very much worth it. Its unlikely that I will replace it any time soon. Even once my guild is into Black Temple I'll probably run with it along side Syphon.
Yo! seems a bunch of people are jumping on you for your post, I will only a little...
Despite the variances those formulas will generally give that person the correct answer. If it does happen to be off it will only be so by a very small margin. When people ask this they want to generally know what item is better for my guy Item A or Item B. ...
It all comes down to the question how much "a very small margin" is
My examples with data that is not way different from what can happen in a game show that AEP values are several times off of what they should be at the given situation. If put into Lootzor it will provide the list of possible upgrades in the wrong order, some of the items will actually lead to decrese in DPS.
Originally Posted by Bufford
It appears you put a lot of work into your numbers, most people here apprecieate hard work so long as you present it with the right attitude, in short welcome to the community.
Nothing wrong here. These sims helped to find AEP values as average over huge range of possible stat combos. What I am saying is that using these average values for the whole spectrum of these combos is wrong. Sims can be used to find real AEP at any given point (which is what gradient is) that can be used at lootzor for first-hand comparison with careful understanding that the further you get from starting point (the more items you are going to change) the more different results will be from what AEP score suggests leading to a possible mistake in choosing items. It is much more accurate to use sim for one set of items, get expected DPS 1, use sim for another set, get expected DPS 2, compare, continue if needed.
This is what I was worried about. There is definitely some of the gradient effect (to use a coarse term), but when I went through the output of the sim after running the one called "big test", the gradient effect wasn't nearly as pronounced as I thought it would be.
Yeah, as your crit% went up, so did the effect of each AP increase. However, when looking at it in dps% increases per increases in hit/crit/AP, it was much closer to linear than I thought it would be.
That's on a relatively old version of the sim - I really need to get my laptop back from the shop so I can do more sim v. real-life tests to tune it right.
That's my biggest concern right now. I want to be able to look at a recap/wws of a fight, find out what my crit%, hit%, dodge%, parry% was, put them into the sim along with my base AP, and come within 1% of the observed dps for a variety of gear. (assuming I know the mob armor). I don't really care who's sim does this - joe's, pater's, tornhoof's closed form. It'd just be nice to have any one of them mirror game mechanics close enough so that we can say "here it is, that is all".
I'm fairly certain everyone here understands that the values listed in the first post are only to be used as a general guide if your stats are similar to the ones used to determine the values.
This hits the nail! This is exactly what has to be written before introducing AEP numbers.
However they are only to be used as a general guide if your stats are similar to the only one "perfect" combo - not all the ones used to determine the values. Sims cover very different combos and than simply round up all the results producing average AEP values that are several times different from the AEP values for some of combos covered.
Originally Posted by Morelis
1) Doesn't exist, not worth worrying about.
2) Best source of info we have right now probably why it's used so widely.
3) Such a matrix doesn't exist to my knowledge and the number of variables that would need to be accounted for in producing one is staggering to imagine.
1) Search where exactly?
2) Certainly, however doing so is a challenge to less technically inclined users.
3) For those unable/unwilling to simulate for themselves it's certainly better than just guessing at what values are useful.
1.1 Let's hope Blizzard has one
1.2 Agreed
1.3 It is of course far from perfect - provides data through set intervals (discrete), runs through combos of only few stats, may be collected from too short samples, some unaccounted events could affect data while being recorded, etc. But they are still better for the large spectrum of possible combos than AEP that is perfect for only one and good in the small vicinity. So, that being said, if you happen to find your stats being recorded - use it, if not use sim.
2.1 Data sets mentioned on first page can be used better than AEP system for the values they cover.
2.2. Certainly.
2.3 Using AEP+lootzor will definitely provide wrong order of possible upgrades for some stat combos that players may have with some items leading to decrese in DPS. Is it better than just guessing at what values are useful?
2.3 Using AEP+lootzor will definitely provide wrong order of possible upgrades for some stat combos that players may have with some items leading to decrese in DPS. Is it better than just guessing at what values are useful?
Yes, it is much better than just guessing. I suspect you're overestimating the difference in values. I know that for myself my stats have gone from very close to the numbers the original scales are based on to very different. I've gained lots of ap, some crit, tons of haste and lost lots of hit, but when I make a scale today using the same sim the original one was created with the values have only changed by 0.2-0.3. This means that putting them into lootzor results in a nearly identical order for item rankings, the best items are still the best. It's not exactly the same but it's so close as not to matter.
2.3 Using AEP+lootzor will definitely provide wrong order of possible upgrades for some stat combos that players may have with some items leading to decrese in DPS. Is it better than just guessing at what values are useful?
Show us which items are wrong then, because it sure as heck seems accurate to me, once you consider that Lootzor doesn't have haste rating enabled.
I'm following this thread for quiet some time already and i love it. This is my first post here.
I'm using two 2.6 speed blue weapons at the moment ([Demonblood Eviscerator] and [Boggspine Knuckles]). We only just started to do kara every now and then and yesterday [Big Bad Wolf's Paw] dropped and i got it. Now i know that slower weapons are better and that it's also good to have the same speed main and offhand. But you think i could better use the wolf paw then the eviscerator? At least my offhand is slower then...
I'm following this thread for quiet some time already and i love it. This is my first post here.
I'm using two 2.6 speed blue weapons at the moment ([Demonblood Eviscerator] and [Boggspine Knuckles]). We only just started to do kara every now and then and yesterday [Big Bad Wolf's Paw] dropped and i got it. Now i know that slower weapons are better and that it's also good to have the same speed main and offhand. But you think i could better use the wolf paw then the eviscerator? At least my offhand is slower then...
The extra 16dps on the weapon will more than compensate for the 0.1 difference.
@Yo, I wrote a program to specifically tackle the "problem" you wrote about in your long post. See page one under models/simulators etc. While the actual result dps migh be too high (ideal encounter and stuff) the change in dps based on equipment changes should scale linearly too.
On the other hand while the calculated AEP values are only valid for one exact build, the deviation for other builds/equip values is not that great, without considering the extreme values, it is around 0.1 for each value. So simply spoken, if you have no crit to keep UR/flurry up to a certain extent, +crit is more valuable for you by a small amount.
If you have no +hit to even get 9% +hit, +hit is more valuable etc.
But for a common raidbuffed enh shaman the calculated aep values are as valid as they can get without considering each equipment individually, which my program does, the results are fairly identical, though.
I'm following this thread for quiet some time already and i love it. This is my first post here.
I'm using two 2.6 speed blue weapons at the moment ([Demonblood Eviscerator] and [Boggspine Knuckles]). We only just started to do kara every now and then and yesterday [Big Bad Wolf's Paw] dropped and i got it. Now i know that slower weapons are better and that it's also good to have the same speed main and offhand. But you think i could better use the wolf paw then the eviscerator? At least my offhand is slower then...
I currently use [Big Bad Wolf's Paw] in my main hand.
Throw Crusader or Mongoose on that badboy and you'll be in good shape.
08/14/07, 4:17 PM
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