Well, time to change Windfury modeling. WoW Forums -> 2.1 Windfury Is Still Bugged!

I'm aware of that
Let me try to rephrase... let's say i want to compare the Warp-Spring Coil with another Trinket, e.g. the Hourglass. Now my question is, does the Spreadsheet take into account that the Coil is less powerful with a specc that suggests a 1s/5r cycle than with a specc that suggest a cycle without rupture? Because obviously the first specc will benefit less from the armor penetration procc of the Coil since rupture entirely ignores armor.

that was worth a hotfix?

Just wanna thank you for the spreadsheet and work you've put into it. It's been very helpful.

Hmm, well when I change my sheet from allowing rupture to not allowing it, forcing either 1s/5rc or 1s/5ec and evaluating my armour penetration AEP value it increases from 0.13 to 0.14 with WSC equipped. I think that implies the sheet does take into account choice of finisher when calculating the effectiveness of armour penetration.

It also estimates an AEP increase in both my crit and sword skill, which affect Eviscerate but not Rupture but not my hit which affects each equally.

I was under the impression that they've tried to "fix" this for at least three times already...

The "napkin math" we've seen so far suggest that this is an overall dps nerf of 3% on raid-buffed dps for sword rogues. For dagger rogues it is gonna be a little less.

The WF buff was giving sword rogues about a 10% increase in dps. With this nerf, it will still be a 7% buff. That is still gonna be better than GoA.

How the overall effect will be on groups, that is harder to say.

well, I've butchered around in the dps spreadsheed (mainly wep_enchants, cell r32, I've removed the hits from -all- instants) and the wf dps on my sheet goes down from 132.2 to 70.4 ... which roughly results in a nerf by half...


... and btw, as I haven't said so before, thx a lot for making the spreadsheet

Thank you, I actually forgot that there was something like an "allow rupture" button ^^

In itself it's stil be better than Agi totem then..
But Agi + instant poison mainhand would be better, yes?

This better be reverted. Seems like a knee-jerk PvP reaction with zero clue about how it would span to PvE. Someone screwed up. If they were going to do this, it should be on the PTR for a while.

Raid dps as a whole just went down a lot.

Warrior threat just went down.

You don't change the DPS of an entire raid with a hotfix.

On a side note to the windfury-debate:

Has anyone found some time to extrapolate how the new Zul Aman enchant Executioner will hold up against Mongoose (15 sec. duration and same procrate than mongoose assumed)?

Easier to just estimate it as warp spring. Drake Fang Talisman -> Warp Spring is 20 DPS with my current gear. That accounts for ~ the AP from mongoose, at a similar hit percentage. Haste and crit will increase mongoose a little bit more. Granted, it depends on how the proc-rates are, what the duration is, etc... but I don't expect it to be a gamebreaking difference compared with mongoose.

Still, I'd expect it to be 5-10 second duration, with a pretty fair proc-rate. If it's a PvP enchant, it's all about burst, and beating on someone for 45 seconds before getting the proc wouldn't really work well in the burst arena.

Yes, it has only ever meant SnD, not Rupture. It has nothing to do with the Mangle debuff.

I tried your suggestion out. Correct me if this is wrong, but did you change cell r32 in "Wep_ Enchants" to this?

With that change this is what I noticed...

I only lost 5 buffed dps with my 41/20/0 spec. With a 19/42/0 combat sword spec w/ merc glad slicer and latro's swapped in I only lost 9 dps.

The combat sword spec still gets around +100 dps from windfury, its still much better than GoA+Instant Poison mainhand.

I'm pretty sure that's impossible.

Do the math normally.

2800 effective windfury AP, 30% crit, and merc glad's slicer.

Your average windfury hit will, between hit and crit, be 1006.2

You'll lose 3ish procs per minute from your 15 sinister strikes (best case scenario, no combat potency procs for more specials).

that comes out to 3018 damage across the course of a minute, or 50.3 DPS.

I'm not that great with complicated Excel spreadsheets, but as a preliminary guess: Did you add windfury AP to all attacks, and not just the extra attack itself? That would probably parse out as more DPS than was lost, though.

It's more complicated than it appears to change the Windfury formula.

I changed the "Windfury proc per second" calculation to only include auto-attacks, and my DPS from Windfury on that sheet dropped by about ~80, from about ~165. However on the Gear_Stats sheet my DPS only dropped by ~15.

I poked around and there are some Nextstat fields that I don't know how to modify that mess with these calculations. Someone with more time to look at it will have to make the change :/

Losing ~80 DPS like that sucks.

I seem to recall having read about this error somewhere, but I wasn't able to find the post in question when browsing. In other words, sorry about making you answer this again if you already have

When I load up the latest version of the spreadsheet (I was using a different one but got convinced by a friend that this one was better) I get a error message saying "This workbook has lost its VBA project, ActiveX controls and any other programmability-related features."

Running the 2007 version of MS Excel on WinXP. Anyone know how I can make the error go away so the sheet functions fully?

I'm wondering: does the spreadsheet stack the +CP generation if you have 4 pieces of netherblade and Ruthlessness? Because when I put in the pieces of netherblade in stead of my current gear, my dps goes down instead of up (which I thought was the case).

Hello folks,

although I am concerned with the upcoming change on the windfury proc and how it will affect my effective dps in raids as a rogue I would like to throw in a question to which I couldn't find an answer yet regarding + weapon skill. Now I know there is an extra thread about the mechanics of how + skill is calculated and from what I have gathered by now is that you need 324 hit rating (~ 24,56% hit) to reach the hit cap without any +skill .

At lvl 70 an increase of +1 weapon skill was about +.1% hit and a + 0.04% crit, which means an increase of +10 weapon skill by talents thus an increase of 1% hit, which equals ~15-16 hit rating would reduce the hit rating requirement to reach the hit cap to 308. That's the information I gathered so far from the other posts and threads in this forums (please correct me, if I made some mistakes). Now, with my current gear and the way I socketed it, I reached with weapon expertise and 307 the hit cap. Any further increase in pure hit rating had zero increase in dmg, which is indicated correctly in the spreadsheet.

Since my raid downed Lady Vashj a while ago now I am in the position of having the chance to obtain the Belt of One-Hundred Deaths having +25 weapon skill on it and being the belt slot with the most dmg stats on it according to ShadowPanther.net I was planing to get the belt and replace it with my current Belt of Deep Shadows. Since weapon skill didn't only increase hit but also crit I thought it would be more than a good trade. I calculated - assuming that 10+ skill equals 16 hit rating - that with the Vashj Belt I would basically have + 40 Hit Rating from +25 weapon skill. That way I could reduce the 308 hit rating cap needed to 268.

So I replaced my current belt in the spreadsheet with the new one (my old belt having 18 hit rating + 2 glinting noble topaz in it = - 26 hit rating). My overall buffed dps went indeed up by about 8 dps still having theoretically 14 hit rating too much (+40 hit -26hit). So I started replacing other Gem slots assuming the dps increase was still upgradable. I replaced 8 Hit rating or 4 agi/4hit in my shoulders or Skulkers Greaves Pants with 8 crit rating or 16 ap gems but to my surprise no matter what other gems I used, the dps from there went down.

Of course you would assume that maybe I lost too much other stats maximizing hit without regard to other stats as ap or crit. But as long as I get new items with more overall dmg stats such as agi, ap, crit, hit, weapon skill (I use the MAEP comparison on shadowpanther.net for that) and still have the ability to change gem slots the way I want this should not be the case.

My overall stats right now are 1605 ap, 307 hit rating and 31.49% crit unbuffed with the 19/42 combat spec (fist). So at least I don't think there is something out of the line. Again I replaced pure hit rating slots (8 hit) with either 8 crit or 16ap/8 agi gems. Everytime I get a dps decrease. My question is, can it be that the spreadsheet doesn't calculate any +weapon skill that goes beyond the +10 through talents and assumes that the hit cap ist still 308 hit rating no matter how much +weapon skill you get from there or is there an elemental mistake I don't get so far?

I'm using the version 2.2.0.7 of the spreadsheet right now and you can check my Armory link by searching for "Elis" in the Europe Realms (Female Nightelf Rogue on the Server Dun Morogh) if it helps in any way to the "problem". (Didn't provide a direct armory link since they are almost always broken - at least for me)

I hope someone can help me with this and thanks for reading.

PS: Yes, my main hand is fist and offhand sword because I want to respec to sword but haven't got the chance to get a decent main hand yet (gladiator main inc. - I know). But since the Belt provides + fist as well as + sword skill - this can't be the problem.

PPS: I'm sorry if my write-up sounds too broken, I'm not a native speaker


Edit: Holy crap I am one big f***ing idiot - sorry for everybody who even had to read this. It's + 25 skill RATING on the belt which is only a 6.3 + skill increase on lvl 70 not 25....ok that makes a lot more sense...sorry again..

Weapon skill is most likely - if at all - not modeled correctly in any spreadsheet at the moment.

The only constant is that you need 308 hit rating and 10 weapon skill to never miss a boss level mob (+3 level). Everything beyond or before that will not be correctly accounted for.

For more details on the current theories of weapon skill, see the corresponding thread.
We haven't even started to take a closer look at the effect of weapon skill to dodge and crit yet.