Trohck

Presently spec'ced 46/12/3 and considering moving that over to 41/20. Since my raid buffed crit is ~30% and mortal shots adds 30% damage to that, that would increase my ranged DPS (discounting pet) by about 7%. Quick math to support this:

Damage w/o: 70(hits) + 30*2(crits) == 130
Damage with: 70(hits) + 30*2.3(crits) == 139

139/130 == 1 + .0692 or about a 7% increase

My hesitance is that I think getting away from Hawk Eye is bad for several T5/T6 bosses. To convince me, I made a list evaluating the advantage of mortal shots per-boss. I can only include the ones I have experience with (sorry), and of course there will be some assumptions about strategy that I feel can be generally agreed upon. For anything that Mortal shots is worse for, I've offered some comments on why it's worse.
Key:
[ = advantage Mortal Shots] [ = about even] [ = disadvantage Mortal Shots] [ = not sure]

SSC:
Hydross the Unstable - Slightly more difficult to avoid water tomb.
Lurker Below
Morogrim Tidewalker
Fathom-Lord Karathress
Leotheras the Blind - More likely to get hit by whirlwind, harder to misdirect Leo back to the tank.
Lady Vashj - Slower to pick up striders or kill elementals, slightly harder to kill bats.

TK:
A'lar, the Phoenix God - More time running around in both P1 and P2.
Void Reaver - Slightly more time running around
High Astromancer Solarian
Kael'thas - DPS'ing Thaladred harder, kiting Phoenixes harder.

Hyjal:
Rage Winterchill
Anetheron
Kaz'rogal - Gargoyles and Frost Wyrms harder, misdirecting aboms/Kaz harder, spreading out for mana explosion harder.
Az'galor - Gargoyles and Frost Wyrms harder, misdirecting aboms/Az harder.
Archimonde - Less room to spread out = more people in doomfire / getting air bursted.

Black Temple:
High Warlord Naj'entus
Supremus
Shade of Akama
Teron Gorefiend
Gurtogg Bloodboil
Reliquary of Souls
Mother Sharhaz
Illidari Council - distance helps you spread out depending on strat
Illidan Stormrage - distance helps spread out in P3/4, damage better for faster P2

Looking it over, I see more smiles than otherwise, so Mortal Shots looks good. The problem is, it seems to me like the harder fights of each instance are where Hawk Eye is more useful. I'm curious to hear from other hunters who have made the switch or thought about it. What do you think?

 

Ragnar

Leotheras is a

I've yet to get hit by his whirlwind.

 

• ikillyouheal

High Warlord Najentus
Supremus
Shade of Akama
Teron Gorefiend (edited)

Although I'm not a hunter, but I _think_ I'm quite accurate.

[04:04:29] <Malan> Kaubel just laid the smack down in the the blizzcon thread
[04:05:07] <Kaubel> fucking idiots. i need to go on a banning rampage and put things right once and for all.
[04:05:20] <Kaubel> our forums are infested with pussy.

 

Trohck

Can you provide some reasoning? I've done all of the bosses except for the ones marked and I don't see why this would be the case.

 

• ikillyouheal

Atleast when we do Supremus, we have no special pattern for kiting in p2, and he's just running around everywhere, figured it would be rather sweet having that extra range for that fight.

[04:04:29] <Malan> Kaubel just laid the smack down in the the blizzcon thread
[04:05:07] <Kaubel> fucking idiots. i need to go on a banning rampage and put things right once and for all.
[04:05:20] <Kaubel> our forums are infested with pussy.

 

Trohck

In my experience, the vast majority of damage to Supremus comes in phase 1, so I don't consider a minor nerf to phase 2 damage relevant. You're right that Hawk Eye is probably a little better in phase 2, but not enough for me to call it significant.

 

• Relwin

The only two things that make me want Hawk Eye on boss fights (note I said on boss fights, since the main reason I want it so much is I can safely pull trash and MD from a 'safer' distance) are the bats on Vashj, I get maybe three total shots in compared to a SV or MM's 5-6, and Supremus phase 2, where not dying is preferential to an extra couple seconds of DPS anyway.

While it'd be nice to have 41 yard range again, the only thing I'd really want it for is solo farming Shahraz trash. That can easily be covered with a weekly respec from the mountain of gold to be made therein. In conclusion, Mortal Shots is what you want, you learn to deal with not having Hawk Eye.


fake edit: shadow priests have it worse with mind flay anyways

 

Varnic

Depends on how your guild does certain fights.

I don't have Hawk Eye at the present moment, and sometimes I would really love to have it again, but in general I've gotten along fine without it all the way up to Kael'thas (41/20/0)

The way I see it is that Hawk Eye is a luxury that BM Hunter's cannot afford if they want to give it their all in terms of DPS.

Can't comment on Hyjal/BT yet, though.

 

Krypt

I dont really see how hawk eye will ever over take mortal shots, the DPS loss is just too much. However you can safely add Sharhaz, and Illidan in favour of Mortal shots. Illdari council is a even because that extra range could help you avoid aoe's but...

 

aznkaiser

while we are on the topic of BM raiding in hyjal/BT.

can any of you guys give me input on how to improve my dps on archimonde? i usually do really good dps on most bosses, even on some bosses where it isnt super pet friendly, but archimonde jus makes my eyes bleed. my pet on average gets griped about 2-3 times, i mainly use him for a 2nd anti fear trinket and stick him on archie whenever i dont see no fires around (which is pretty rare). i can barely stand still for 10 seconds before i have to move due to fires...most of the time im the only hunter in the raid and i feel that is so because the dps i do validates my spot.

any input will be helpful ^^


as far as mortal shots vs hawkeye, the only real fight that gimps us is vashj due to elementals and bats. hyjal/BT you shouldnt really have a problem with range at all.

 

Lumi

The only time I'd want hawkeye is MD pulling trash/bosses. Without hawkeye, pulling bloodboil is scary.

 

Infused

The way I see it, increased range is only there to make you feel more comfortable with your positioning.

Supremus (p2), Illidan (p3 demons), Winterchill (d&d), Azgalor (rof), Archimonde (firewalls) might look easier with 41 yard shooting range, but once you get the new distance feeling "by heart", there should be no problems at all to adjust.

Oh, I had a problem pulling vashj on time though!