Lucke

Recently Team Rogue in our raids have been asked to not use deadly poison as it is apparently "bumping debuffs/dots" off of the raid bosses. Now I freely admit my ignorance on the issue; I had been deployed for quite a while and am only relatively recently back so still learning some of the higher-level mechanics. For some reason however, this does not seem optimal to have rogues NOT use DP; rather than go with gut feelings however, I am looking toward the community here and seeing if this has become a topic before. I did search before posting, my appologies if I missed any pertinent topics.

 

Cyn

A stack of 5dp on a mob will do 75 dps if I recall correctly, switching to IP, you will probably lose around 40-45dps depending on your hit/haste gear, so unless there are no dots already up that are doing less than 45dps, then DP is the next candidate to go if all the debuff slots are being consistently filled

 

Spades

Deadly Poison is 75 DPS without any Vile Poisons, most comabt builds have 3/5 bringing it up to 84. It's much much much more important for a Mutilate rogue.

Instant Poison scales as your haste increases, but for most combat builds I believe it evens out to around 35 DPS.

"Existence has no pattern save what we imagine after staring at it for too long."
-Rorschach, Watchmen

 

Facktotum

Most combat builds? I have yet to see a combat build being daggers/swords to have 3/5 talents in vile poisons.

Maybe I am missing the point of your reply

As for the OP question yes DP should be on the OH as much as windfury should always be on the MH.
I do not know if you have a shaman in your group on bosses but its pretty trivial nowadays to have one.
Out of curiosity who asked 'Team Rogue' to stop using deadly? Do he/she have any data to backup the theory that DP is "bumping debuffs/dots" off of the raid bosses.

Myself I have been using DP on OH same with the other rogues in my guild and we never had such issues.

 

Spades

Well no combat dagger build will have any points in Vile Poisons obviously. And I meant 4/5 Vile Poisons. >_> I was in TK when I wrote that.

The point of the post is that moving from a debuff poison to a non-debuff poison is in the neighborhood of a ~40 DPS loss. More for a Mutilate rogue.

"Existence has no pattern save what we imagine after staring at it for too long."
-Rorschach, Watchmen

 

Pazuit

Greetings!

As others have noted, Deadly Poison is touted to be the best poison to go with on your offhand weapon, coupled with Windfury Totem applying to your Main Hand.

As for the total number of debuffs slots, Debuff slots has a good discussion on it. What it really comes down to is how many of each class you're bringing to the raid. If you're stacking 'locks and SPriests, you'll run into some issues.

I'd personally address those before telling the rogues to drop DP.

 

Lucke

Morning Gentlemen, and thank you for the feedback. We actually do have a small army of Spriests and three Locks at any given raid. Shamans are of course in short supply, we usually have one with the rogues however.

Pazuit, that is an amazing link; quite appreciated.

 

Waramaur

Just to make sure i'm straight on this...

DP on OH and WF on MH is better for overall DPS than DP on both hands?

I only ask because i'm trying to help my friend with DPS and i play a tank, plus i just want to understand more of the game mechanics in general.

 

Siddown

Never use DP on both hands, you will always keep a stack of 5 DP up with one hand, the second hand is just a waste as you don't get two stacks for two hands. So putting Deadly on your OH and going poison free for WFT on your Mainhand is definitely the way to go.

 

Waramaur

Cool! thx for the reply

Is there any links that could posted or something else that you can point me to? It seems clear cut to me, but i just like the math behind it as i'm pretty analytical.

thanks again.