[Warrior] Endgame PvE 2-Hand - Page 11

boysailor · 10/14/07, 7:47 PM

Originally Posted by Garre

Just a bit curious, but where would you guys rank [Jin'rohk, The Great Apocalypse] in the upper weapon tier ([Cataclysm's Edge], [Torch of the Damned], [Twinblade of the Phoenix] etc.) for 2h raid dps? 45 Haste Rating seems a bit of a wash, but 570 top end and 120 AP will make it hit rather hard (roughly 137 dps?). It seems like a fairly viable choice for an interim raid weapon.

Thoughts?

My apologies for making a post at this state. (Unfortunately, I'm drunk at the moment, yet addicted to WoW.)

Anyhow, I would pick Cataclysm's Edge over Jin'rohk. Simply because Cataclysm's Edge gives 150 AP (which scales with Blessing of Kings!). Armor ignore is, in my opinion valued over haste. Which again makes me favour Cataclysm's Edge. The top end damage is also higher on the Edge. All in all, I think of Cataclysm's Edge as the "best two-hander ingame at the moment".

amethyst · 10/15/07, 6:51 AM

Yeah, the stats and the iLevel kinda give the game away.

Still, if you can't get hold of Cataclysm / Soul Cleaver / Twinblade / Torch, then this will be a very respectable weapon, available to 10-man raids.

Still wondering if CE will get a buff though, due to S3 weapons.

boysailor · 10/15/07, 7:53 AM

Originally Posted by amethyst

...

Still wondering if CE will get a buff though, due to S3 weapons.

I am wondering about the same thing to be honest. As things have been (so far) I haven't had the need to get hold of arena weapons for PvE. But looking at the new season 3 weapons (and comparing them to the current Black Temple / Hyjal Summit weapons), it seems I might have to get hold of some new weapons.

Then again, Arena ruined the PvP aspect of this game for me. I'm a sucker for world PvP (in your "sick PvE gear"). But that's another topic. Sorry..

Garre · 10/15/07, 1:53 PM

Of course if I had the choice I would take CE over any other two-handed weapon available in the game, as it would be the most effective for 2h raid DPS. Although it's clearly not in the same ballpark, I still believe Jin'rokh would definitely be a good weapon for raid dps, especially considering there are no decent interim swords in between tier 3 Lionheart and Twinblade. Season 2 arena weapons are decent, but for those who don't PvP there really isn't anything viable.

I would be very surprised if all BT weapons didn't receive a buff in the latter stages of the 2.3 test patch. Blizzard has stated several times that they want PvP gear to be in line with PvE gear, not surpass it. I would say they buff 1h weapons to ~105 DPS at least.

amethyst · 10/18/07, 11:20 AM

That would also fit with their strategy of gradually making content easier, so that it becomes open to more people. Buffing the weapons assists raid dps making some fights easier.

soujeh · 10/20/07, 6:33 AM

The question I believe is on everyone's minds but doesn't seem to be answered anywhere: just HOW big is the mace spec proc nerf in 2.3 ? If anyone has any tests, please post them along with the speed of the weapon you were testing with.

Emeraude · 10/20/07, 6:39 AM

Originally Posted by soujeh

The question I believe is on everyone's minds but doesn't seem to be answered anywhere: just HOW big is the mace spec proc nerf in 2.3 ? If anyone has any tests, please post them along with the speed of the weapon you were testing with.

I warn you, it's from the Warrior boards

WoW Forums -> 2.3 Mace Spec proc rate % over 11000+ attacks

Oriyn - WWS

http://img98.imageshack.us/img98/397...7192509or4.jpg

Caesar · 10/29/07, 12:15 PM

Anyone tried less than 2.5 attackspeed? (ie 3.5 speed weapon with 180+ hasterating & Flurry)

I tried it some on the unkillabe mobs with a slightly faster weapon and it seems to work great. Although rage generation is an issue. In a lot of fights there is some serious splashdamage going on though. My lag/reactiontime was less than 0.1 seconds with this setup riding the gcd timing... With proper ragegen it will probably work very well.

Anyone tried it already?

magey · 11/13/07, 1:55 PM

Bumping this for discussion on 2H raid dps specs for 2.3 now that the patch is here. I'm spec'd 33/28 with Blood Frenzy for raids and right now I'm basically debating between Imp. Execute and the new Weapon Mastery, leaning towards Imp. Execute. I switch to two fast 1H weapons for execute range and combined with Imp. Execute it's a huge damage boost over just executing with a two-hander or continuing the Slam rotation. But on the other hand -2% dodge when using a slow two hander is pretty sweet for rage generation and sustained damage for the other 80% of the fight.

Jiggs · 11/13/07, 5:40 PM

The 2/2 weapon mastery will give you a greater dps increase than 2/2 imp execute. The increase is bigger with a 2h spec because having your MS/Slams dodged with a 2her is painfully annoying.

Throw it into the dps spreadsheet and see what it gives. I can't do it because im at work

Anduryondon · 11/13/07, 6:31 PM

Why does it make a difference when you are 2h specced, when you do the same overall damage with dual wield? The Damage-loss is the same, isnt it?

Jiggs · 11/13/07, 7:17 PM

Don't know for sure. I was just thinking about it logically. Having a white hit dodged while dwing is far less detrimental than a white hit dodged with a 2her. Dodging that white hit from a 2her kills any rage gen for that cycle and you may not be able to keep up the slam/ms slam/ww rotation. While dwing if you get a dodge you still have more white swings (2 ~2.6 speed weapons vs 1 ~3.5 speed weapon) in a shorter amount of time to get that rage up and keep your cycle going.

Anduryondon · 11/13/07, 7:39 PM

Rage Starvation is a good point, but i think even then it depends very on the rage at the moment of the dodge, even a dodge with dw added with some misses can be very hard for your dps. But for the Damage only part, you get more dodges too, when ur dual wielding, so that shouldnt make a difference.

magey · 11/14/07, 1:55 PM

Originally Posted by Jiggs

Having a white hit dodged while dwing is far less detrimental than a white hit dodged with a 2her. Dodging that white hit from a 2her kills any rage gen for that cycle and you may not be able to keep up the slam/ms slam/ww rotation. While dwing if you get a dodge you still have more white swings (2 ~2.6 speed weapons vs 1 ~3.5 speed weapon) in a shorter amount of time to get that rage up and keep your cycle going.

This. Getting a white hit dodged with a slow two-hander kills your rage generation and rotation (that's why it's also so important to be hit capped with a two hander in pve), and that's why I'm undecided about it. I'm gonna try Weapon Mastery next time I respec for PvE and see how it goes. Oh and hai jigglypuff. :P

LuLu · 11/16/07, 4:56 AM

I'm new in the 2H PVE Raid.
So i would like to know who's a perfect Rotation looks like.
Can anyone tell me ?

amethyst · 11/17/07, 7:09 AM

Originally Posted by LuLu

I'm new in the 2H PVE Raid.
So i would like to know who's a perfect Rotation looks like.
Can anyone tell me ?

Read back a few pages, but the basics are that you slam instantly after each autoattack swing (use quartz castbar swing timer) and then use an instant attack between swings, alternating MS, WW, MS, <gap>. You use that <gap> to renew BS, trinkets, pots, demo shout etc etc

Maskirovka · 11/20/07, 1:47 AM

Why do you have to choose between imp execute and weapon mastery as 33/28? Did I miss something?

amethyst · 11/20/07, 7:36 AM

Originally Posted by Maskirovka

Why do you have to choose between imp execute and weapon mastery as 33/28? Did I miss something?

I guess so!

With 33 points in arms, this leaves you 28 points for fury. It's just about shifting the points around really.

The primary reason for the points in fury is to get 3/5 flurry (or 5/5 flurry if another warrior is keeping blood frenzy up). To get there, you need 5/5 enrage. To get there, you need 15 points in T1-3 talents. You need to take 2/2 imp slam, so this leaves you with .... 3 points to spend between imp execute, weapon mastery and sweeping strikes.

Maskirovka · 11/20/07, 9:08 AM

Oh right, I don't see any need for slam, so I get both. I guess I'll try it out at some point, but I think 1200-1600 dps depending on the fight without it is enough, especially when you consider blood frenzy.

Also, lately I've been trying to max out my Armor Penentration. It's difficult to stay hit capped so far, and I'm using the new hit food for now, but it seems good. I haven't done an extensive WWS analysis but I see bigger numbers for sure. However, my dps hasn't gone up by a seriously noticable amount...except on cloth in pvp...lol

On a strange note (and this may be way off topic) I have Furious shackles with a 10crit gem, and Bracers of eradication with a 4str/6sta. Can anyone explain why my crit on my char screen goes DOWN by .24 when I put the furious shackles on? They should have 29 crit rating vs. 24

Amorpheus · 11/20/07, 4:01 PM

Meta gem requirements not met.

Maskirovka · 11/20/07, 5:12 PM

Ah you're right, thank you. I had the haste meta for a long time and only recently changed...forgot about the agil. It'd be cool if the str/crit epic pattern would drop =\

amethyst · 11/20/07, 7:06 PM

Originally Posted by Maskirovka

Oh right, I don't see any need for slam, so I get both. I guess I'll try it out at some point, but I think 1200-1600 dps depending on the fight without it is enough, especially when you consider blood frenzy.

Trust me, if you're using a 2-handed build to dps, you'd see a noticable increase in dps using improved slam, as long as you can time them well.

Ercassiel · 11/27/07, 8:59 PM

I am a touch in math hell and probably a bit too deep to see straight.

I have managed to collect every 2h weapon at my disposal and I am in a big dilemma

I currently have

[Glaive of the Pit]
[Ethereum Nexus-Reaver]
[Despair]
[Gorehowl]
[Axe of the Gronn Lords]

Among the poleaxe group, the Nexus Reaver comes out on top. However, no matter how I turn the sheet around, it appears that Despair, despite its low damage and DPS, when talented comes out as the best option. Especially when you take into consideration the extra attacks generating rage, I can’t help but feeling that the best weapon I own is collecting dust in the bank.

Has anyone done any analysis on those? Is it possible that for a human warrior, Despair is really the best option?

Art thou Despair indeed so deceiving?

If anyone can shed some light on this, I would much appreciate it.

Skeez · 11/28/07, 9:16 AM

I'm at work so cannot run any tests here. Yet I would assume the increase is due to the human racial with swords giving you 5 Expertise. The added -1.25% chance for dodges to occur is a reasonably nice bonus once you're hit capped and although not a huge boost will be contributing along with sword spec to the difference you see here.

Krennick · 11/28/07, 12:28 PM

Three factors:
1) Expertise makes you do a little more dmg (human racial)
2) Sword spec is still powerful
3) There has been a bug on the warrior dps spreadsheet where expertise appears to be a lot more powerful than it actually is. Read a handful of the most recent pages in the warrior dps spreadsheet thread to track down the details on how to fix it.