Looked for a discussion on enchants but couldn't find one so thought I'd get a dialog going.
As a enchanter I'm curious to know what different classes prefer enchant-wise for both PVP and PVE depending on spec.
As a Healer, of course, the three differnt viable weapon options are Spellsurge, +81 Healing, +20 Spirit.
Spellsurge typically for raiding, +81 for PVP (or raiding), +20 spirit for weapon swapping when innervated using spirit based trinkets like BeB.
What about other enchants, do other healers typically prefer +stam enchants over +healing enchants for PvP? What about resist enchants? What about Regen enchants vs. pure stat enchants? There are a ton of options for different classes depending on the content (pve or pvp), and I'm curious to see what others think.
EDIT: Also curious on opinions for rep reward enchants.
This sounds like a subset of, "What stats does my class prefer, given current itemization costing?" I think this is covered in part by the Working Theories of Theorycrafting, but here's a quick summary:
Tanks: Defense until cap, then Stamina. Get avoidance if you can't get stamina.
Casters: Spell hit until capped, then spell damage. Get crit if you can't get damage.
Healers: Enough stamina to survive, then mix of mana regen (m/5 or spirit, class dependant) and healing.
Melee: I'm not enough of an expert on this.
I can't speak for Bears as I don't know if the +armor enchantment gets the bear form +400% modifier, but as a Warrior, I would much prefer the dodge rating, if not for higher practicality, then for the meager amount of threat generated.
Edit: If someone wouldn't mind, would someone do a numbers crunch that I might compare to? This would be in relation to Battlemaster vs. Mongoose for tanks. For where my guild and I are at right now, I don't need the avoidance or armor offered by Mongoose, so this is a question based entirely off of threat generated. Which one does more? Seems to me Battlemaster would do 450-750 threat each proc (given that all the party members are in the 30 yard range). Also, does the healing apply raid-wide or just the party you're in? And does it apply to pets? Any information regarding this would be highly appreciated.
If you don't already have a source of increased run speed there's a very strong argument to be made for Boar's speed (or Cat's) for most classes. Extra run speed's extremely valuable in both PVP and many of the more mobile PVE encounters of TBC, potentially offering quite a bit more beneft than a few points of stats.
Oh and for Bears it's +12 agi to cloak all the way. The AC enchant does not multiply (no enchants do).
Speaking for Enhancement Shamans, the enchants to maximise DPS are
Head: CE Revered Enchant +36 AP +16 Hit Rating
Shoulders: Scryers Exalted +20 AP +15 Crit Rating OR Aldor Exalted +30 AP +10 Crit Rating
Back: +12 AGI (Major Agility)
Chest: +6 To all Stats
Wrist: +12 STR (Brawn)
Hands: +15 STR (Major Strength)
Legs: CobraHide/Nethercobra leg armor +40/50 AP +10/12 Crit Rating
Feet: Cats Swiftness, +9 AGI, +8% Run Speed
Weapons: Mongoose
Rings: +4 Stats
Are you sure that +4 Stats on Ring is better than Weapon Damage on Ring?
I don't have any calculations to back it up but I would've thought the pure Damage enchant beats the allround enchant in terms of DPS?
Fury Warrior Max DPS is pretty much the same as Shaman, maybe adding 10 Haste Rating on Hands as an option for very well geared Warriors.
Head: KoT Revered +16 Defense +17 Dodge
Shoulders: Scryer Exalted +15 Defense +10 Dodge OR Aldor Exalted +10 Defense +15 Dodge
Back: +12 Agility
Chest: +6 to all stats (technically superior, some prefer 150 hp, or 15 resilience if they need crit reduction)
Wrist: +12 Stamina OR +12 Defense for crit reduction
Hands: +15 Agility
Legs: Clefthide/Nethercleft leg armor +30/40 Stamina +10/12 Agility
Feet: Boar's Speed +9 Stamina +8% Run Speed OR +12 Agility OR Cat's Swiftness
Weapons: 35 Agility
Rings: +4 Stats
Notes: At the pre-T4 / T4 level, it seems like a good idea to go Aldor because crit reduction is plentiful so higher dodge on shoulders is better, but as you start to upgrade out of the common items into more T4, the Scryer shoulder enchant becomes attractive with that little bit extra defense.
for Cats in general:
Head: CE Revered +36 AP +16 Hit
Shoulders: Aldor Exalted +30 AP +10 Crit OR Scryer Exalted +20 AP +15 Crit
Back: +12 Agility
Chest: +6 to all stats
Wrist: +12 Strength
Hands: +15 Agility
Legs: Cobrahide/Nethercobra leg armor +40/50 AP +10/12 Crit
Feet: +12 Agility OR Cat's Swiftness, +6 Agility +8% Run Speed
Weapons: 35 Agility
Rings: +2 Weapon damage
Notes: I've seen some incidence of Savagery, which is a mistake.
Disclaimer: these are my perceived notions of what's "best" =p
Head: CE +ap/+hit
Back: +12agility
Chest: +6stats
bracers: +24ap
Hands: +15 agility
Legs: Cobrahide/Nethercobra
Feet: +12agility
Rings: +4stats
Scope: +28crit rating
Weapon 2handed: +35agility
Weapon 1 handed: +20agilty
Weapon 1 handed as MM hunter: +30 Int (swap to +20enchanted weapons when the mana is used, swap back with AotV)
Expressed in the same format as other classes for easier parsing:
I'm going to say this applies to just combat rogues to be safe, but there's little I can see that would change if one were mutilate or combat hemo.
Head: CE Revered +36 AP/+16 Hit Rating
Shoulders: Aldor Exalted +30 AP/+10 Crit Rating OR Scryers Exalted +20 AP/+15 Crit Rating
Back: Major Agility +12 Agi
Chest: Exceptional Stats +6 all stats
Wrist: Assault +24 AP
Hands: Superior Agility +15 Agi
Legs: Nethercobra leg armor +50 AP/+12 Crit Rating
Feet: Cat's Swiftness +6 Agi/+8% run speed; Dexterity with another source of run speed
Main hand: Mongoose
Off hand: Mongoose
Rings: Stats +4 all stats
Casters are pretty easy as well (only including profession-based enchantments rather than purchased ones):
Cloak: Subtlety (Penetration is worthless)
Chest: +150 HP (Maaaaybe regen or stats, but it all comes out meh.)
Bracers: +15 dmg
Gloves: +20 Dmg
Legs: Mystic Spellthread (+35 Dmg/+20 STA)
Boots: Boar's Swiftness if you can swing it, +12 STA or Run Speed otherwise
Weapon: +40 Dmg, Soulfrost or Sunfire (they're stupid expensive for the marginal benefit)
I never really got thru looking at every little thing (disclaimer: the below is not a "complete" listing), but here's a list I put together for my guild for what enchants I'd expect to see on alot of stuff. Some of it is a little out of scope for me, so go ahead and provide feedback/corrections.
Enhance and Fury warriors should really consider subtelty on a cloak. There are quite a few fights where we have to significantly hold back and 2% extra safe dps would be a better enchant than agi. However, you might also want a cloak with agi as well, since there are many fights when aggro is a nonissue.
Concerning Zeld's comment on Hunters prefering +6 Stats to chest, I certainly agree that it is the obvious choice, yet the MP5 enchant has been tempting on my hunter. When I get chances to rain on my hunter, I find myself out DPSing better geared hunters and I have a large suspicion that a good chunk of that is based on my larger MP5 (and more voracious use of Fel mana potions).
Cloudgatherer, have you taken into consideration the use of the +9stam/Minor Speed enchant for healers boots? I distinctly remember a while back there being a post on here about the positive effect of Minor Speed on boots for DPS and potentially healers, considering there was a lack of good enchants other than stamina at the time.
I'm not exactly sure how many healers are running around in mid fight, but if you are already stacking a lot of mana regen, is the 4mp/5 from the enchant better than 9 stamina and a speed increase?
As far as shields go, paladins can get the +12 intellect if they need it, shamans as well i assume.
00:59 -!- ChanServ changed the topic of #elitistjerks to: Elitist Jerks | HAPPY BIRTHDAY PROMDATES!!! qtpie | Rules: http://elitistjerks.com/chat.php
[2] [Ardente]: I get to put on a donkey show in dalaran every day now!
Cloudgatherer, have you taken into consideration the use of the +9stam/Minor Speed enchant for healers boots?
You make some good points regarding run speed for healers. No, I didn't really put that enchant down under healers for a couple reasons. First, healers usually focus on mp5 type deals, or just plain +Stam. Second, the fact is uses nethers means that if the enchant needed to be prioritized, then melee would likely get it first. I also wanted to keep each "list" relatively small =).
By no means is the above listing I have definitive. I put it together as more of a "these types of enchants I've seen alot on these types of characters" as well as answering slot/enchant/mats type questions.
You make some good points regarding run speed for healers. No, I didn't really put that enchant down under healers for a couple reasons. First, healers usually focus on mp5 type deals, or just plain +Stam. Second, the fact is uses nethers means that if the enchant needed to be prioritized, then melee would likely get it first. I also wanted to keep each "list" relatively small =).
By no means is the above listing I have definitive. I put it together as more of a "these types of enchants I've seen alot on these types of characters" as well as answering slot/enchant/mats type questions.
True, we usually do focus on the mp5 enchants or +Stam, in the event there isn't any +Heal. As far as using nethers, only the Surefooted enchant uses nethers on the feet. Both Boar's Speed and Cat's Swiftness uses 10 large prismatics and either 10 primal earth or primal air.
And I only brought that enchant up, because it seems a lot of people tend to miss that one. I'm amazed at how many people say "How do you run faster than me? Do you have some sort of run speed thing?", just showing they don't know about speed enchants.
00:59 -!- ChanServ changed the topic of #elitistjerks to: Elitist Jerks | HAPPY BIRTHDAY PROMDATES!!! qtpie | Rules: http://elitistjerks.com/chat.php
[2] [Ardente]: I get to put on a donkey show in dalaran every day now!
Are you sure that +4 Stats on Ring is better than Weapon Damage on Ring?
I don't have any calculations to back it up but I would've thought the pure Damage enchant beats the allround enchant in terms of DPS?
I Cant speak for fury warriors but its definately the case for an Enhancement shaman.
Enh Shamans often use 2.6 - 2.8 weapon speeds. +2 Weapon damage therefore is 2 / 2.6 (most common speed) = 0.77 additional DPS, equivalent to 10.7 AP. As weapons speed goes up this enchants value goes down.
+4 Stats effectively only grants 4 STR and 4 AGI. Enh shamans have AP equivalent values of 2 for STR and 1.8 for AGI giving the enchant an equivalent value of 15.2 AP (+10% for kings) and you also get 4 STAM and INT for survivability.