I haven't tested this morning. Will have to wait till later I guess.

But...slam isn't instant.

The post was later edited to clarify. It's all specials that aren't on-next-attack. Seems like the version copy and pasted over to EU boards was pre-edit.

Do parried attacks proc windfury?

Also, I'm looking through the logs from last night's Gruul kill, and see things like this:

812 Melynt's Heroic Strike hits Gruul the Dragonkiller for 328
02:14'54.093 Melynt gains 1 extra attack through Windfury Attack
406 Melynt gains Windfury Attack
421 Melynt gains Lifebloom
437 Melynt's Heroic Strike hits Gruul the Dragonkiller for 329
437 Melynt's Melee hits Gruul the Dragonkiller for 183 (glancing)

Where did the attack I gained at 02:14'54.093 go? Is it the melee attack at 437? I had always thought WF procs happen as soon as I hit?

The combat log is not infallible. You probably lost some data due to lag or bandwidth issues.

Random thought brought about fro reading another thread wherein it was stated(correctly!) that any spec shaman is best off dropping WF for a melee group. That made me wonder if this was not perhaps some effort at attempting to balance the totem agaisnt the other options available to different shaman specs, so that an Elemental Shaman would create greater raid benefit in a caster group, and a Resto Shaman might be best off in a healer group(Mana Tide I guess, although that is equally accomplished with group-switching).

As to whether it does that effectively, or why that action would need a hotfix instead of a PTR-tested patched fix is beyond me. I would imagine that WF/SoE will still be better Raid DPS than WoA/ToW in the appropriate groups, but that may be from conditioning to that end.

Maybe it was to combat Furi's 2,500 dps >_>

I do agree that it's odd that they hotfixed it rather than just tossed it onto the PTR (which is active so it's even weirder).

Someone's arena team just got smashed by a double warrior shaman WF/heroism gimmick?

But seriously.. I was thinking about it last night and I can't help but wonder if it is, in fact, a PvP-motivated nerf. I know a restoration Shaman dropping WF + heroism was very helpful in letting my poorly skilled self burst enemies down in arenas.

My best guess would be it's a reaction to Warrior/Shaman combos in Arenas. I also suspect it's another case of "fix arena", oops on PvE.

Yes i'm aware the PvP game plays a larger part in the overall WoW market but soo tired of PvE suffering because they decide to amend something based purely on PvP.

Didn't we just pass a weekend with a huge Arena tournament at Blizzcon (and the attendant parsing and review of logs and such from those matches that any smart developer would undertake?) This definitely seems like a, "Stormherald/Warriors with Windfury were way better than we intended in the tournament, NERFBAT." The hotfix nature of it lends even more to that kind of explanation.

My guess: Blizzard watching arena games at Blizzcon. If not that, something at Blizzcon stirred the pot.

It's pretty obvious that it was a nerf aimed at PvP warriors with zero thought of the PvE implications. Sadly, It's going to hurt shaman viability and raid presence greatly instead. You'd think they'd learn their lesson from the first time.

Is it me or did they pull the august hotfix thread from the general boards that detailed this nerf? I also saw a ton of angry, many page threads last night about this on the general and warrior forums and now I dont see any.

When I read the change I thought it was a knee jerk reaction based on Arena.

I dunno - there have been other sudden, untested nerfs of this nature which no-one was able to understand, the mage "damage tax" nerf being the main one I'm thinking of. Still wondering as to why that one happened...

But it is almost certainly a result of the analysis of the pvp at Blizzcon. It's a shame it ineracts with PvE though, and hopefully they will be monitoring that situation closely over the next few weeks. I think in Blizzard's opinion, chgnages that need to go through for pvp have to be hotifxed due to the nature of the arena system and the tournaments, whereas PvE can take a more measured approach as there's no such competition around it.

Edit: nevermind WoW Forums -> Windfury nerf pulled?

To be honest I really don't see this as a bad thing. As a rogue who always prefered daggers I always hated the idea of swords getting so much more benefit from WF than a dagger user gets. Sure, it will hurt our damage, and hopefully they will change something else in order to balance the melee dps up. Just my two cents.

It probably has something to do with the item above. Rogue dps was getting very high in BT gear when they started stacking haste rating on top of instant attacks.

It may also mean that they're making some changes to warrior's tier sets. Maybe they aim to put an end to forum threads about T6 and agility... :P

I doubt this has much to do with arenas. Shamans only wear mail and are a very easy target to tear down in 2v2 and 3v3. The classic (and successful) team set-ups are not warrior/shaman, it's usually warrior/paladin. It may be to combat some 5v5 teams, but I wouldn't think they'd be that heavy-handed without thinking about the impacts on PVE.

What have you seen that leads you to believe this?

Looking for a shred of hope here =\

The thread can be found here: WoW Forums -> Hotfixes for August- 08/09/07

I can't find it searching through the thread list though. Not sure if that's on purpose of Blizzard's forums just not working.

It is interesting that the original post said: Now it has been edited to says: So it's possible that slam should not be affected by this change (right now people says it is, but it could be switched).

I don't have any data to back this up, but I at least feel that if slam could still proc WF then 2H warriors should be fine.

Well with that one they came right out and said "Mages were doing too much damage" and "it's clearly a straight nerf to the main spells". Agree with it or not, it's at least clear why they did it.

This one they just said "Here how a new nerf works" and left us all wondering what the motive is.



Legendi, the change to the post is just to reflect that slam isn't an instant attack, but is still affected by the change.

It is also possible that Blizzard is doing this, in part, for Rogues to bring the balance of Combat Swords down a bit relative to Combat Daggers. Since Combat Swords benefits more from extra attacks from specials (the extra attacks do more damage) than a Combat Dagger rogue. It nerfs Combat Daggers too, but not as much as Combat swords.

As to why a hot fix, beats me. It would seem that it would be better to include it in the PTR Windfury nerf package where one could see what effect it has in conjunction with the rest of the nerf and adjust accordingly.

Edit: I guess not.

WoW Forums -> Windfury nerf pulled?

This is the most likely cause yes.
It's quite a shame though, it'll hurt PvE by a lot more than it'll affect PvP.
For the same reason they could nerf PoM mages doing 2x fireblast at the same time on the same target, that's ranged though.