Suesse

I tried out the most recent version of the spreadsheet with a prot spec. I first fixed the devastate crit multiplier bug.

I find the SEP calculation hard to believe:
6.4 str - 6.1 hit - 5.4 crit

I would expect crit to be better than hit (since I'm over the hit cap @ 12%). The spreadsheet says that my main hand + off hand constitute 50% of my overall damage. So, neglecting heroic strike, I would expect 0.0625% hit per hit rating to give around 0.03125% overall damage (because it only affects half my damage). I would expect 0.045% crit per crit rating to give around 0.045% overall damage. These are really rough figures, I know. I think this assumes 0% crit among other things.

I tried to look for a bug for a little while, but I had no luck. Does this sound counter-intuitive to anyone else?

 

Halle

The Twin Glaives proc is still on the to do list of the latest version.

Would be really nice if someone could model it and get it added so we can see what a difference it makes.

I used to be a hardcore raider, now i'm a hardcore father.

 

Liar

Yeah, I pretty much noticed the same. I was only above 9% hit myself so I thought the value for hit would atleast go down at 11% (which I think is the hit cap for white MH hits and not 12% - correct me if I am wrong though) but it didn't.

My SEP at 11.22% hit is:

5.7 str - 6.1 hit - 4.6 crit


What is that devastate crit multiplier bug btw?

 

Suesse

Go over the devastate line carefully. First, make sure that in the min, avg, and max crit lines it applies the crit multiplier to the whole attack (not just the 1/2 weapon damage, but also the 35*5).

I believe devastate does not proc windfury and does not glance. (Confirmation appreciated) So the adjusted column of devastate it should be
E92*K43+B92*K44+N92 /* good */

not

B92*K31*K10 /* glance */
+E92*K32+B92*K33
+0.2*H91+N87 /* windfury */

This changes SEP to:
6.10 str - 5.00 crit - 3.9 hit
which seems a lot more right.

 

Gruntle

Yeah, WF is not procced by Devastate (no instants proc WF) and Devastate do not glance (yellow attacks do not glance).

Still can't figure out why these changes would solve the hit SEP problem though.

 

Hodgepodge

Has this been tested with specific reference to racial specializations? Unless I missed something, the Working Theories thread only refers to talent-based specializations:

Which I would assume has been there for a rather long time. With humans displaying 10 expertise with the proper weapons equipped, I'm uncomfortable with the assumption that the new racial specializations work in the same manner that the talented ones do.

 

Liar

Thanks for the pointers. I tried to get them to work but I guess I was much more of an Excel noob than I thought.

Just to make sure, I have to edit the Devastate line in the Warrior_DPS.xls Buffed DPS subsheet, don't I?
Because all I found there (cells A71 to L71) in the Average Crit, Minimum Crit, Maximum Crit cells is "=B71*CritFactorSkill", "=C71*CritFactorSkill", "=D71*CritFactorSkill" respectively which indicates that the whole Devastate damage gets the crit bonus.

In the Adjusted Damage cell (H71) I only find something like "=IF(Talents_Buffs!K44;(E71*H38+B71*H39)+N66;0)" which looks completely different than your
B92*K31*K10 /* glance */
+E92*K32+B92*K33
+0.2*H91+N87 /* windfury */

so I am not sure what to edit there.

Did I look at the wrong place? :/

PS: I am using the newest spreadsheet from 01/04/08

 

Suesse

I was looking at H92 in Warrior_Sim.xls. I think we are using the same spreadsheet version, just looking at a different workbook.

The reason is that windfury is using *main hand* hit, crit, and glance percentages, so when dual wielding, windfury gains value from +hit. To simplify things greatly, devastate looked like this "50% weapon damage + 20% weapon damage" (where 20% (windfury's proc chance) was modified by +hit).

 

Gruntle

Hmm, but Devastate should use (at least it does in my version of the sheet, OO version) the percentages for yellow hits, ie. 9% base miss and no glances. This means that adding hit over 9% with devastate should never increase the average damage (neither normal nor WF damage (which it should of course never get)).

edit: bah understood what you meant now. The WF damage from devastate procs went up with hit. Still don't understand how that could be such large effect, you should double check the base miss for Devastate I think (should be 9% not 28)

 

Suesse

Yes, this checks out. I set rage left after whirlwind (J121 of Warrior_sim.xls) to zero, then increased my hit rating by 200. All I see now for a change in the cycle is a very slight (1 damage) increase in both main hand and offhand whirlwind and devastate. This comes from a slightly increased crit chance from mongoose. In fact, turning off mongoose eliminates this.

For some reason, my devastate info was still wrong, I thought I had fixed it. Make sure that E-G92 of Warrior_sim.xls read:
B92*N48*N58
C92*N48*N58
D92*N48*N58
These just say "to get the average, minimum, and maximum crit multiply the average, minimum, and maximum non-crit by the critical strike bonus damage factor (and the resilience factor)."

 

turtleneckboxers

So I've been playing with the latest spreadsheet and was wondering, is Dragonspine Trophy really still that good? With the nerf to haste a while back I would expect this not to be the case anymore.

 

Apate

There's actually a whole thread on the DST, and if you look at the warrior DPS thread around the time of the change (or search them - unfortunately "DST" is a 3 letter word) there is some analysis. Moreso "haste nerf" might provide some search results.

See you, auntie.

 

Grim13

There does look to be some sort of bug with SEP. Please keep in mind that the versions I post are basically just me re-writing the "old" sheet's front end and "integrating" it with the new sheet's core. I've seen a few times where SEP numbers look totally jacked up, then change something, hit SEP again, then change back, hit SEP again, and it looks correct. That may or may not be what is happening to you. I have dug around in the guts of Warrior_Sim.xls a fair bit, but I don't know it as well as if I had written it myself.

As to writing things myself, I am working on my own spreadsheet written completely from scratch. The front end will look very familiar, but I am going to try a slightly different approach to the core. I am going to try and make things as modular as possible. Also, I am going to put everything into one workbook and not use any macros. This will mean it will lose a few nice features, but should help compatibility, namely with Open Office.

The sheet is going to include both DPS and iDPS (incoming DPS). Instead of making some rating system for tank gear, I am going to model it just like DPS. I haven't seen anyone else do this as of yet, so hopefully it will be of benefit to the community. I am also going to put in threat generation. The idea is to have the same sheet usable for both DPS and tanking. We'll see if I can pull it off...

I also want to thank dr_AllCOM3 in advance. Without his awesome work I would never have learned Excel, let alone had the motivation to take on a project such as this.

 

Amyannirving

I got somewhat of a nagging question on my mind. I'm currently using Dragonstrike mainhand and a Swiftsteel Bludgeon on offhand. Now according to an earlier version of EJ's post-2.3 spreadsheet, Swiftsteel beats out things like Talon of Az, Rising Tide, and even Blade of Infamy on the offhand. I notice though that expertise isn't used as a factor in considering weapon selections. Do you guys think having a sword on the offhand to give me 10 expertise instead of 5 (as a human) would change the relative quality of Swiftsteel and something like Blade of Infamy?

 

dr_AllCOM3

Update in first post:

- Str counted correctly
- Devastate
- Some minor changes

I don't see something wrong with Expertise racials.

 

Feuerschnauz

I^ve played around a lot with the spreadsheet. Unfortunately i get wierd numbers all the time. Like getting the same dps with a 10/44 build and a 17/44 build. In trying to find out why i get these Numbers i stumbled upon some Problems. I hope you guys can help.. I need some Formulas on:

How do i calculate the Damage from Deepwounds and how do you calculate flurry correctly. It sounded easy at first, but i really get in to some trouble trying to do this.

 

Noemi

Very first-time poster here.

I started poking around this thread in order to see how I can maximize my dps, which has been rather meh. Everyone's posts have been very helpful in making me understand my class better. Kudos to the guy that posted the BT/WW ability rotation macro. It has been an awesome help.

Posting a question: I've been using an earlier version of the spreadsheet (Jan. 4th one, with the item drop-down menus) and then fooled around with the 2.6 one. The dps totals are different for the very same item sets and stats. The earlier one depicts a higher number in total dps while the new version shows a lower number. Is it because the updates and changes or something else?

 

Gaiwer

Can you please link it again because i cant find that post :S thanks

 

Gruntle

The macro works in perfect circumstances (i.e. you press the macro every time an ability is up) and with 1 point in imp ww:

/castsequence reset=combat Bloodthirst, Whirlwind, Bloodthirst, Whirlwind, Bloodthirst

Currently (as of patch 2.3.2) castsequence macros are slightly broken (they will hang if target is out of range), so i'd suggest waiting to try it until they fix this (scheduled for next patch).

You should know, however that the macro is a compromise, it makes things a bit easier (i.e. no decisions between BT or WW to make, and only one button to press), but you will most probably be able to do more damage if you can stay really focused on keeping a priority system up (i.e. at every GCD you make a check to see which abilitiesare up and then prioritize BT over WW if both are up). Heroic strike does not need a gcd, make a HS if your rage is over 50 (to play safe, maybe lower if you use fast weapons and/or high hit rating). The sequence can be a bit thrown off if you miss a gcd by a sec or two and if you have some lag.

 

Trax

Quick question.

In the stats section there is a slot for attackpower. Is this the +attackpower I have or the total attackpower as veiwed in characterscreen?

 

Liar

It's the AP from your gear that is specifically stated as such (i.e. [Bloodlust Brooch]).

 

Trax

The thing is when I look at the custom profile in this "new" version it states that it has 1888 ap.
In the last one it stated somewhere around 700. Has there not been a change?

 

Acilles

I would imagine this has been said somewhere, but how do you change the DPS cycle in the spreadsheet?

 

Liar

I might be wrong, but I always assumed that the DPS cycle the spreadsheet provides is actually the cycle you do the most DPS with, in contrast of just measuring the DPS of a static DPS cycle you input.

 

Acilles

Yes, it does appear to work that way. Thank you.