suicuique

You can simply test your assumption by thunderclapping any boss with said debuffs on him.
TC has a *VERY* small damage range (almost constant) as hinted by the tooltip, and is mitigated by armor.

Unless we are talking squishy mobs like Solarian/Akama/Aran... most raid bosses have still a lot of armor after all the debuffs applied.

 

Loshiis

Any news on whether ranged attacks proc Executioner, and if the armor penetration applies to ranged attacks? Considering Mongoose doesn't, I'm pessimistic, but if it does proc, then Executioner would almost certainly be better than 35 agility or 2x 20 agility enchants.

 

Silvos

Ah so the bosses have less than 3k armor after all those are applied .
I thought they had 3k total armor

 

Eledorian

There's a nice thread about SSC/TK armor value's bosswise. [RAID] Boss armor values

Surprsingly Solarian doesn't have absurdly low armor.

I'm guessing Executioner won't proc from ranged attacks. Seeing as it's an enchant on a melee weapon I'm guess blizzard are going to follow the same mechanic for it as they did for Crusader and Mongoose.

Meaning it will most likely only proc off melee hits.

 

royaljester

I was under the impression that a bosses armor per mitigation wasn't a linear curve. Essentially, if he had 8k armor and XX%, having 4K armor wouldn't equal 1/2 XX%.

If this is true (I'm assuming), then wouldnt this enchant be more powerful when reducing armor = MORE mitigation, either high or low, depending on which way the curve goes.

 

• Vulajin

In general, most bosses have 7700. Sunders reduce it by 2600, FF reduces it by 610, and CoR is another 800. Total comes out to 3690.

(edit) To add some content to this post, I did a quick test similar to what Aldriana did. If you assume that Mongoose and Executioner have the exact same proc behavior, then you can assume that they have the exact same uptime. Doing this, I found Executioner to be slightly inferior to Mongoose. Interestingly, as I decreased the target's armor, Mongoose became more superior to Executioner.

(edit 2) Note this is all for a combat rogue.

 

PSGarak

Something to keep in mind is that, being an entirely separate stat, armor reduction's effect is multiplied by AP and vice-versa, and so on with hit and crit and stuff. Once we understand the proc's behavior a bit better, it would be worthwhile finding the point where executioner surpasses mongoose.

 

xumie

OH mongoose (1.5 speed) has a longer uptime than MH executioner (2.6 speed) (it's hard to tell from the WWS because mongoose refreshes itself a lot, so it looks like there's fewer procs). For PvE I still think that Mongoose will be the superior enchant, but Executioner will be king in PvP.

 

Urraca

Except end game rogues don't use evis 90% of the time.

 

Macblade

Yes the testing/theory crafting for rogues would be much more helpful if we focused on total, white damage or at least sinister strikes. Eviserate is not a finisher that people use except for poison/bleed immune bosses.

 

◊ Rob

You are wrong. See [RAID] Boss armor values

 

ArkamisImm

Yes, I am very aware. But this is a first order estimate, so I used the easiest ability I could think of.

I posted my results for Sin Strike a few posts down.

 

Northerner

The first thing that came to my mind about Executioner is that it will certainly be an interesting twink enchant. Reducing armor is one of the few (remaining) things that scales best on lower opposing stat values.

 

Xaoc

It requires a Lv60+ weapon. I'm not sure if its worth the effort twinking for 60 BGs (I know I wouldnt spend the time for a 60 twink).

 

Pazuit

If anyone needs a test subject (Rogue - Alliance - PvP/When PvE is up again I'll have a character there as well) for dual wielding, and has the mats/enchant available, I can facilitate a person.

Just drop me a PM or something here, keep up the good work guys!

 

soujeh

The question on my mind is how will the battle of the enchants work out for a 2H MS warrior in PvP Considering you're not hitting your target 100% of the time like in PvE, which could mess with the amount of extra damage you got from a proc. Would be awesome if anyone could log average "uptime" for Mongoose (and Executioner when that arrives) in arena, would need a lot of games though since it changes so much. Also changes with rating, so many factors :<
But for Mongoose to be better than Savagery you would need (from calculating with average PVP gear AP/crit which is pretty much the same for all PvP wars in the high rating-tier) something like 40-45% uptime on it from what I could figure. Sounds high for a PvP enviroment. Many cases where you might for instance hit -> proc -> get polyed, and whatnot.

 

xumie

'Uptime' in the arena is going to be extremely hard to calculate accurately, just because of the variety of things you can be doing in the arena given the makeup of your team and the opposing team.

 

Eylirria

No armor per mitigation follows a linear curve regarding % reduction. A druid in 30k armor doesnt have twice the mitigation as a warrior with 15k armor. The only linear metric regarding armor and mitigation is "time to live".

You're correct in saying that the more armor you reduce, the more damage you do. If a said raid boss had 30k armor after sunders+FF+CoR, Executioner would only add you a small % of increased damage.

However, going from 3000 to 2200 can be as high as 15%. God help a cloth wearer in an arena match if you happen to proc it.

 

Northerner

Ah, my error then. I just presumed a level 35 requirement.

 

Flr

I just spent an hour testing executioner enchant in blasted lands. I used stormstrike about every 11 seconds due to lag and had windfury on my weapon. Results below:

WWS Report

Combat Log

Uptime meter screenshots:

http://www.kolumbus.fi/flare/Flr_sig.jpg

 

• Vulajin

You'll have to pardon my ignorance, as I haven't used Uptime Meter before. Which bar indicates the uptime, the blue one?

 

koaschten

Blue - Uptime
Red - Downtime

 

◊ Rob

This gives the enchant something like a ~115 AEP for Shamans. What's your Mongoose uptime with a similar setup?

 

epsi

Hi,

I saw your uptime for executioner but the parse show only 87 procs over 60minutes. Is that a bug or it was refreshing itself all the time ???

tkx for testing!

 

• Fogbug

So it's essentially a warrior-friendly mongoose. How lovely!

that uptime looks pretty close to what I got with mongoose, but I haven't used mongoose in a while.