Is this the one you were referring to in #3?

http://www.worldofraids.com/2008/ptr...ringsliver.jpg

I'm not sure how I feel about the "channeled" element to that trinket, but the passive 119healing to it is pretty substantial. Either way, the new Achemist's Stone is definitely a solid regen trinket. I don't consider the one I linked a good regen trinket because I can't remember the last time I've really had a consistent opportunity to channel for 7 seconds (i.e., using Dreamless Sleep Potions). However, for straight +healing, I'd probably go #2 and #3 (being the one I linked).
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My guild is raiding Vashj (22% / 17% / 13% last 3 attempts) with Kael next. I am still in Primal MC gear (4 months of VR with only 2 Drood / Priest / Warrior drops), but the [Belt of the Long Road] pattern finally dropped and I am next with the vortex's.

I've been wondering... should I drop Tailoring in v2.4? I have enough badges for [Gown of Spiritual Wonder] and I should get [Mantle of the Avatar].

[Schematic: Powerheal 9000 Lens] looks very tempting, especially with the potential to purchase Primal Nethers from others in v2.4...

Is keeping Tailoring in T6+ worth it?

http://static.mmo-champion.com/mmoc/...allight_v2.jpg

This makes me lean towards keeping Tailoring.

I know I'm probably in the minority--mostly due to not being easily bored--but I still cannot see much reason to drop PMC for the majority of fights until one gets nearly full T6. The fact is, the PMC set is really, really good. After next patch it gets even better. The only detriment is the lack of Stamina, and frankly losing Stamina on 3 pieces is not worth even being bothered about for most fights. (It's not as if Belt of the Long Road's 13 Stamina is terribly impressive either!)

I've compared to the stats back and forth and basically only do not use PMC on a small handful of fights where max HP is sensitive. (Naj'entus, Illidari Council, possibly Rage Winterchill) Either way, for a lot of the time having PMC available is a huge boon and more than likely a large increase in healing stats. After next patch, the set bonus becomes even more valuable than ever before. (It's well over 30 Mp5 raid-buffed next patch for me.)

Honestly, if you have tailoring and don't have lots of T6, there are plenty of reasons to keep PMC around--even if you don't use it on every fight.

I lose healing wearing PMC, but gain regen.

If you need the regen, then by all means, PMC is awesome for you. I personally don't feel I need the regen. So I stick with higher +healing.

That said, I really don't think PMC would work well in BT/Hyjal, as the AoE damage there is quite intense, from what I've read/been told.

Healing vs. Regen has to come from somewhere, meaning that one trades off various items to reach a final total of some amount. Obviously, the items with the most stats on them generally win as the combination of all said items results in the highest net stats. PMC is a good example of this simply due to to fairly decent healing stats (Shoulders are so-so, chest is fairly good, belt is very good) combined with absolutely amazing regen--a 3-piece setbonus worth upwards of 30-40 Mp5 that doesn't conflict with the best T5 bonus pieces is pretty solid, regardless of how you look at it--makes for very solid items from a healing stats perspective.

Perhaps on the very few fights where maximum HP is of the utmost importance they are non-optimal, but honestly this is not the majority of fights. I've worn PMC is more or less every fight save Illidari Council and Naj'entus in BT and every fight in Hyjal to no ill effect, and have no survivability problems at all. (Ironically enough, our one non-tailor Priest who typically has survivability problems. Priest survivability typically depends more on quick reaction, good movement, and proper usage of PoM/Binding Heal rather than a bit more Stamina on gear.)

As I've pointed out in the past, I think most practical people carry multiple sets of gear. Until you get full T6, "one gear fits all" isn't a reality. It's always good to swap gear as needed for various situations--be it trinkets, stamina, resists, etc. 690 HP might be a big deal on certain fights, while on others it's almost entirely meaningless. It doesn't usually pay off to stick to a singular gearset. (Other than, as I mentioned, T6.. which is all-around amazing once you can get the set.)

Personally I find PMC to be an exceptionally good tool to have, but feel that way too many people give up on it just because the new car smell wore out somewhere in the middle of running Karazhan.

Well, I feel that the general mentality that Stamina is horribly required in T6 content (or will be what saves you from something going wrong) is perhaps a bit overstated.

You do not need abnormally high stamina for: Any content in T5, almost any trash pull, Anetheron, Kaz'rogal, Azgalor, Archimonde, Supremus, Akama, Teron, Bloodboil, or Reliquary of Souls. (Mother Sharahz you are using SR gear, so it's a bit of an abnormal fight.)

This is not to say that Stamina is "bad"--after all, I think all my gear pretty much has Stamina on it -other- than the PMC pieces, especially since Jade Ring of the Everliving is getting swapped out next patch for certain--but in those cases a margin of 500-600 HP is generally not going to be an issue one way or another. The fact that T6 gear has Stamina -and- great healing stats is obviously a nice upgrade.

Either way, Stamina gear is only one click away with ItemRack, so I don't see any reason to "stop" using a certain item. This is very much akin to certain classes in arenas that often swap out of their PvP gear into PvE gear with certain team and bracket setups--there are just some situations where having better healing stats is better than having survivability you will generally never have an opportunity to use.

To me it's not either-or, it's "use both when best suited." There is zero reason whatsoever to even bother with high stamina gear on a fight like Kaz'rogal where you will most likey not even take a single point of damage.

You can't argue that there aren't other options that have more +healing, tho. And those options might be far more desirable if you don't have problems with mana. It's all personal preference, really. While you prefer PMC (and more power to you for being able to stand looking like a recolored MC reject in BT ) some of us don't. And that's fine.

Your opinion is from the position of someone more experienced than I, and I respect that. I just don't agree.

Don't get me wrong, I think this is an area where personal opinion matters a lot... so everyone is entitled to their preferences based on the way their raids work. My only real point is that instead of looking at throwing things away, to keep items in your backpack and swap out gear whenever it suits. I see many Priests (or tanks, for that matter) that really only have 1 gearset when it would be beneficial to carry multiple.

I think I carry around about 30-35 pieces of gear in my backpacks and simply just swap based on fight and circumstance. I feel it helps a lot to be flexible.

(BTW, I would say another tip in regard to PMC is that you can always make another set of gear and socket for stamina or stamina/healing. I used a double-stamina socketed Belt for quite some time as it's dirt cheap to make another one and you still get really solid healing stats while maintaining the bonus and gaining more Stamina than Belt of the Long Road.)

Personally, I left PMC For [Mantle of the Avatar], [Robes of Heavenly Purpose] and [Cord of Braided Troll Hair]. Yes most of my gear is ZA heavy, but with these three pieces socketed with hybrid gems made me never look back at PMC again.

Also I tend to always be on raid healing, therefore I tend to use CoH and Flash heal a lot (yes I know how terribly inneficient FH is). That said my gear always leans on having as much mp5 as possible. Earlier in the thread I read [Eye of Gruul] was great when using CoH, what would be a good 2nd trinket? Currently Im using [Fel Reaver's Piston] and [Bangle of Endless Blessings].

Unless you really really need a regen trinket, I would guess [Essence of the Martyr] for the healing, or at least [Tome of Diabolic Remedy] over the piston which, because of the short internal cooldown, does not get the kind of returns you would want with CoH spam, while the click healing is probably more useful anyway.

I did some rough theorycrafting on a couple of regen trinkets a few posts back.

Additionally, seeing you are a JC with access to BT gems, you should be able to craft the new Seaspray Albatross trinket. It averages out to 43 Mp5. Slight downside would be that it doesn't scale at all with gear, which the Bangle and Darkmoon card do. Quite good and reliable, but I believe I got higher theorycrafted values for Blue Dragon; the massive buff to Spirit is obviously an equivalent buff to its strength. Due to the 2% chance, it may not be quite as reliable and on demand as the JC trinket, but especially given high Spirit gear, the potential regen gains are quite clear.

Aside from that, I'd suggest keeping the Eye of Gruul anyways for those CoH fights. I did some rough calculations, and depending on how often you cast, you can compute the mana return; 1 CoH per 5 seconds means 38.9 Mp5, 2 casts already means 77.8 Mp5, etc. Levels other trinkets can't reach.

Other alternatives would obviously be to pray for a Memento of Tyrande or get the new Alchemist Stone, but that requires a profession switch obviously.

Sorry to divert this conversation from trinkets however I was wondering with the changes in 2.4 if it is worth farming [Imperial Tanzanite] or to continue gemming most of my gear with [Royal Shadowsong Amethyst]

From what I have seen on the PTR 9h5s adds more mp5 overall (and healing if specced) then the 9h2mp5 blue gems

If anyone can point me into the right direction please let me know I have been farming Heroic Bot for a week or 2 collecting 9h5spirt gems.

Personally, I think I'll be converting mostly over to +10 Spirit gems in most slots, other than a couple socket bonuses such as T5 helm, or R/B -> +7 healing type stuff. 5 Spirit/9 healing gems are pretty nice, though, the problem being they lose some edge due to not having a 5 Spirit/11 healing version.

That said, I'd rate 5 Spirit/9 healing gems as slightly better or extremely close for a red socket when compared to +22 healing. 11 healing/5 spirit gems would probably be a clear winner if they existed. (Not sure why Blizzard has yet to properly itemize Spirit gems.)

There's the kicker. It would, at first glance, seem better due to scaling with spirit plus I will be in the furture switching over to 10 spirit gems. I had looked briefly at the seaspray albatross and wasn't very impressed (I had used the talasite owl until I snagged the only earring that dropped).

I had a discussion a few days ago with another priest player who was looking at the Bangle vs. the Memento and was wondering if the Bangle would actually fair better as a trinket than the Memento; hence my question for tons of raw data. I had seen your post a bit ago (from the link) but I was hoping for something a bit more, well, detailed.

Lets see if I can't revisit the Bangle

[Bangle of Endless Blessings] the Click effect is about 40% of what you'd get from Earring of Soulful meditation or 14-ish mp/5 max, and the proc effect is ~48/mp5 @ 459 spr ( on the low end) or assuming 1 ppm 12mp/5. If your raid buffed spirit is higher obviously the benefit is also slightly increased at a rate of about 1 mp5 per 50-55spirit ( inexact math sorry). Total benefit if used properly of about 28-30 Mp/5

thats what I wrote before. I always hated how I assumed maximum benefit of the + spirit effect. thats just dumb imo, but then again so is assuming the full + 40 mp5 from alchemist stone so ... c'est la vie.

so lets see if you take what I wrote in posts 809 and 813 as a reasonable estimate of the earrings + spirit effect. we can average the bangle out to 3 figures. 8 mp/5 min for clicking every cd and between 12.5-15.5 mp5 for clicking it with reasonable amounts of oofsr time

As for the 15% "meditation" effect, currently I run 658 int and 550 spr fully raid buffed on the PTR. Which translates into 653 mp5 from spirit or 98 mp5 gain from the click effect during its duration. Assuming 1 ppm thats close to 25 mp5. Meaning the trinket on the low end is worth 33 mp5 and could be worth around 40 mp5 under fairly reasonable circumstances, and obviously significantly more if we looked at the "ideal"

These numbers are pretty "guesstimate" but they are definitely close enough to compare to other trinkets imo, and the regen total is obviously quite competitive with the seaspray albatross and probably better than the earing and certainly beating memento, but of course the stuff it beats have significant amounts of + healing as a secondary effect, and the new alchemist stone ( or even the old ones)are comparable in regen and confer additional benefits.

there is also some merit in for example using the click effects during the proc effect to eke out a good chunk of regen without actually need oofsr time and such but I don't feel like modeling that since it would change my assumptions about oofsr time =P

Also it worth noting that if your stats are significantly different than mine ( i.e. you're in all blues) the gains are obviously and significantly diminished, but even in that case this trinket is an extremely potent regen tool even at the "blue" gear level, but some of the epic options like the earing or albatross probably win out until your base spr/int get to a minimum level, and it should be noted my spirit is not particularly high ( i.e. like most t6 priests currently I lost spirit from the t5 level and I don't gem anything with + spr) as well and it by far has the greater effect on the results compared to say int.

If you're unable to notice auras changing on you in the middle of a fight, you should probably be removing addons, not adding more.

Are you guys really going to use spirit gems after getting even more regen in 2.4? Is Sunwell that bad?

I don't think it's an issue of "bad" so much as it is a beautiful synergy. We get a TON of benefits from spirit, all of them incredibly useful and ingrained into our class design. Finally, a straightforward "stat to stack" for priests.

Why would you honestly ignore that? More +heal, more OFSR regen, more IFSR regen, affected by kings, riddled throughout our talent tree... it's all good news from my perspective.

I understand that spirit will be everyone's preferred stat for regen with the patch, but surely you can't be lacking any of it after the Meditation buff. I'd say it's reason to use pure +healing gems if anything, unless Sunwell is so healing-intensive that you really need the crazy amount of extra regen spirit-focused Priests get.

Spirit is naturally more valueable to us due to the multiplication of effects. For humans, 10 points of Spirit is worth 12.7 points of Spirit, making it innately more valuable when looking at raw item budget factors. The trickle-down to healing -and- regen makes it extremely versatile.

More "valuable" gems makes for more flexibility in other forms of equipment and a generally higher level of stats on one's character. To put it into "gear perspective", for instance, most regen trinkets have 15-18 Mp5 on them whereas most +healing trinkets have 80-90ish at similar ilevels.

4 Teardrop gems would equal 88 +healing, whereas 4 Sparkling gems would be 50.82 +Spirit -> ~18 +healing, ~22 Mp5 (non-OO5SR, ~50% higher with average 30% OO5SR), and ~42 regen. So, you can see the implications when compared to how items are normally built. You are comparing 70 +healing to around 33 Mp5.

More regen is never really "bad", so long as you are scaling your general +healing in a resonable way--mostly through gear upgrades. More regen means easier use of higher ranks, which is the other method of increasing one's throughput per cast. So, in general, one should always strive just to optimize the amount of stat point budget on their character as much as possible, since it will usually lead to the highest throughput in the end.

What is this in response to? The addon provides auras that wouldn't have been there, the only way to notice otherwise would be from the Clearcasting sound that every other priest and mage has or gaining a new buff.

If you are referring to the buff then the point is you might not see it immediately, which is important if you want to maximise time spent outside the 5 second rule. ThankGod makes your screen flash and gives a distinct audible alert, I can't imagine a faster way of letting you know that something procced.

I'd have to agree with constie, if you don't notice when you gain/lose buffs your ui is flawed. But whatever works for you I suppose.