Bendyr

It must be that OP human racial...

But I think doca hits on a good point. As you stack spirit, you get diminishing returns if your int doesn't keep up. If you are at something disproportionate like 1000 spirit and 300 int, then the curve shifts strongly in favor of gemming for int. I don't think any of this clashes with the existing dogma.

 

◊ NateDawg1021

Just wanted to point out that the Belt and Boots from ZA we're the best in-slot items Pre-SP (T6). I'd hang on tho them if you prefer active regen over Illidari Council Belt and Trash Boots.

 

Bendyr

Boots sure, but belt?

Comparing the [Cord of Braided Troll Hair]
17 stam
34 int
red socket
blue socket
socket bonus: 1 mp5
73 +heal
6 mp5

to the [Belt of the Long Road]
13 stam
18 int
33 spirit
blue socket
yellow socket
socket bonus +7 healing
73 +heal

Assuming that you can stick to the socket bonuses (which I know i know i know is lame but i'm lazy), BOTLR gives you
-4 stam
-16 int
+33 spirit
-7 mp5
+7 healing

Given my current itemization, I prefer the Belt of the Long Road.

 

Turgid

Even if you are sticking to socket bonuses, wouldn't these numbers vary based on the red/yellow gem of choice, respectively? BotLR could probably catch up on the int a bit using a yellow, but the CoBTH would catch up quite a bit on +heal with a Teardrop Spinel. I think I'd still prefer the BotLR, but it's less clearcut.

 

Sinndir

As the lone CoH priest in our guild, I am almost always on the top of the meters. Does this matter? No, it just shows how powerful CoH is. Healing meters are not damage meters. If you pump out the most HPS/Health healed per night but your tank assignments or other assignments are constantly dying then you are not doing your job.

If you want a true test, in my opinion. Take Illidari Council, that is a fight that shows how well healers heal. Depending on their assignment it is generally a fight that allows minimal overheal (I'm talking back to the pre-TBC days of 20% or less). It is a long endurance fight with tons of random damage.

 

Helius

Anybody know if Blue Dragon's proc rate is off of hits or cast? Like a 5hit CoH would have 5 chance?

 

Belenos

I am curious why [Dazzling Talasite] is listed as a "horrible" gem in the OP. It's probably true that in general, [Luminous Noble Topaz] is better for yellow requirements (and [Royal Nightseye] is better for red/blue requirements), but I think [Dazzling Talasite] isn't that bad choice if you need yellow/blue for socket bonuses or a meta gem.

Since the change to regen, int is not a bad stat to have. And by my math, 4 int/2 mp5 is not far at all behind 8 spirit, when it comes to regen on gems. And it's better than 3 mp5 or 8 int too. Just some thoughts.

Author of CasterWeaponSwapper: suggestions welcome by forum PM or to wikwocket@gmail.com.

 

Bendyr

Eh, I'm still not a fan of Dazzling Talasite, however I agree that the gem info in the op is outdated.

For one thing, I think that 4 spirit is now always better than 2 mp5 for raiding priests. Also, you should offer another set of gems for heroic epic gems, for people who can't spend the billions of gold on BT gems, now that the heroic ones are non-unique.

[Seer's Chrysoprase] is my favorite for a yellow slot, and I like [Imperial Tanzanite] for any other.

 

Vlydia

Has anyone run the numbers on [Hazza'rah's Charm of Healing] for CoH spam?

 

Sinndir

400 spell haste would give you the following:

Have S = 400
c = 1/1570
B = 1.5

T = B/(1+cS)
T = 1.5/(1+400/1570)
T = 1.19

So that trinket would bring you to a 1.19 Global cooldown assuming you have no other haste rating.

 

Sinndir

You also have to remember that the 2 mp5 gems are (4int 2mp5, and 9 healing 2mp5) are overbudgeted as they should be 1.5 mp5 but you get a 1/2 more of an mp5 thanks to rounding.

Sure the 9 healing 4 spirit is nice, as is the 9 healing 2 mp5. Really just personal preference.

 

Jayde

However that 3 Mp5 will scale to become larger with better gear, HP really a non-issue on the majority of fights, and looks really don't matter when you're trying to gear up, conserve badges, and get the best possible gear setup in the shortest period of time.

Also, it is worth noting that the PMC bonus is considerably more powerful if you are a Human than a non-Human for obvious reasons. At the 500+ unbuffed Spirit level, a Human would get about 5-6 more Mp5 from it than a non-Human would.

Point being, there's no reason to particularly run from PMC just because it looks dumb. The stats are still very competitive.

[Priest] Holy Priest Healing/Gear Spreadsheet

 

heel

No.

. . . is much better handled by a shaman, who can spam Chain Heal on the tank and proc Ancestral Healing, while you spam Gheal on the tank.

Emphatic no. I have a lot to say about this but I'll hold off until Gurg lifts the restriction on talking about the fight.

Yes, CoH is good for this. However, Chain Heal still does the job - and Kalecgos and trash aren't real concerns.

CoH destroys healing meters because it's AE and instant, so you snipe other healers' heals. This is true almost regardless of the fight. This doesn't mean that it's good in all of those situations. A lot of what makes priests good is that we're so adaptable. Depending on the needs of the fight and the strengths of the other healers in the raid, you can adapt and fill whatever need there is to fill. Most of the time, melee healing - which is what CoH is best for - can be covered by the shamans, leaving the priest to do something else. I'm not saying that it's bad to spec CoH, but I'm certainly saying that I rarely use it in most of the first five fights in Sunwell.

 

constantius

I have to respectfully disagree with Heel. I think CoH is amazing, and that Sunwell was basically designed to showcase it. When damage is coming in on a regular basis to a full 5 targets in a party, it is the most effective, efficient heal in the game.

This is not to say it should be used to the exclusion of all else, but it's a more 'intelligent' heal when used properly than Chain Heal. We had several people die on a Brutallus attempt because CHeal went Tank -> person next to tank -> back the other direction ... 3x. As in three straight CHeals went bouncing away from this person, and they died to the next slash.

That never would have happened if we'd had a CoH priest backing them up. It just so happened that we didn't, because I was tank healing instead of Burn+Raid healing ... but we never lost a single person to slash in all of our attempts in the first Sunwell week. We lost several people this week. That's something in my book.

We run 3 resto shamans, and still find a need for CoH. Most guilds agree. Vodka is different, obviously; this just shows that there are many ways to skin a cat.

When, in the same amount of time, I can top up 15 people from a tick of Felmyst aura damage and a restoration shaman can top up the same amount of damage, but split amongst only 6 people ... that's an indication to me that CoH is useful. With our strat, people cannot be allowed to stay more than -2k HP, or they could possibly die to Encapsulate -- CoH ensures that.

 

Vuldoo

I have obviously progressed far less than you, but it still seems to me as if you are simply asking the wrong questions when trying to establish a counter-narrative to his healing style.

Your questions should be:
1) Has the raid healing performance declined due to his inclusion? Do you suffer more deaths? Does he satisfactorily perform his assignments? Why do you have such big healing windows for Flash heal in the first case?

2) Could his healing be performed in a more efficient or effective way by someone else?

 

Hegen

If he successfully fulfills his assigned duties and with some buffer for emergency, and he is able to switch between healing methods as needed, there's nothing to be said against that. Topping off lots of people as quickly as possible is safer than not doing so provided that you don't get distracted or run out of mana.

However, if I look at the WWS, this does not really seem to be the case: 2 PoMs for 1320 flash heals is a ratio that is stupid no matter whether you want to be useful or selfish. This is what I would use more even if I wanted to top meters on purpose. Binding heal also doesn't seem to be used with about 500K damage received. Not a good sign.

Fact is, with 2.4 priests have a lot more mana to spend, especially in encounters with some OO5S time. Using lots of flash heal is viable although not always best if you really have the mana to spend.

If I were you, I wouldn't try to focus on him using so much flash heal. That's not really the issue. The issue is what he could do better or what he is NOT doing. If he is getting damage, he should switch from flash heal to binding heal, for starters. He should also be using PoM a lot more. And - but that depends on assignments - he doesn't seem to dispell a lot. This is what I would look at and discuss first. Concentrating on overheal and flashing first may make you look envious, especially if the raid leaders like healing meters so much.

 

Havoc12

Oops double post

 

Havoc12

No he has not. The fights all last a very short time. With average boss kill times of about 5 minutes, it does not matter what you use. With pots and shadow priest I can spam GH7 or CoH for longer that. He is simply very quick at targeting people. Do you have click casting or are you using a select+click method. IF you use select+click you will never manage to compete even remotely with someone that has click casting. He is gaining 0.1-0.2 seconds on every cast on average.

If you wonder why he is beating you, its because you are trying to do similar things to him only he is faster. Look at who heals whom and you will see that in nearly all kills your healing overlap is very high and you have similar focus, meaning you pretty much try to heal the same targets. Your gheal usage is slightly higher than his but your flash heal usage is very high only your heals land too late. Look at your rage winterchill kill. Your flash heal has 59% overheal. His flash heal has 30% overheal. This means that you get 40% of the value of your flash heal as effective heal while he gets 70%. You both have very high flash heal usage. More importantly if you look at the anathereon kill he is using mostly gheal, while you are spamming your guts out with flash heal.

Also your shaman and druid are underperforming by a significant margin.

More importantly WWS stats are not such a great way to determine top healing, because they don't count prayer of mending. Get recount to determine the real numbers. It seems that newer versions of WWS do not even tell you who cast PoM, so they are useless for determining top healing. You also need to determine how many PWS you are casting as PWS is 2k a pop. Other things not included in WWS are lifebloom, earth shield and healing stream totem. In most fights given how much healing PoM has, you may actually be significantly higher than he is depending on your relative PoM usage.

I am not qualified to advise you how to improve since I have not been in these fights. What I can tell you is just facts based on the numbers reported: You are both using very similar healing tactics and targeting very similar damage type only erato does is better than you. It seems to me that he simply has faster reaction times and is quicker than you.

One thing that you may want to consider is increasing your CoH usage. The stats strongly suggest that you are only using CoH when 5 ppl benefit. My raid healing experience tells me that CoH/pom is twice as effective as flash heal in most 3+ group situations.

 

pindle

He was probably just trying to make himself a nice entrance and impress the new guildies by "stealing" other people's heals by spamming only flash and CoH. I would say not a problem if he's skilled and knows what he's doing - however it IS a problem when it's all he does. My guess is he will behave like a "real" priest soon enough when he's settled

 

Havoc12

All crittable priest heals proc inspiration, including PoH and CoH.

CoH can be used on nearly every situation where 3+ people in a group take damage. I do not know if this occurs in sunwell, but its true in 85% of boss fights I have been. As for sniping other people's heals, that is a question of co-operating well. 2xCoH priests heal 6k per person in 3 seconds. If you want to let shamans cover all the AoE healing they can and only use CoH when CH can't cut it, that is your raid's decision. Its neither the safest, nor the most effective option, but rather one which suits your raid better. Don't assume that your healing method is automatically better than the alternatives.

I do not anything about the brutalus fight: But I can immediately see how you can use CoH effectively, by spaming CoH on the tank group (assuming they are also soaking) then recovering the GCD by going PW:S/PoM => gheal. This reduces the amount of time required for chain heal to heal this group and your HP/sec output on the tank never drops below 1k HPS.

 

Hiba