caelus

In the Raid boss armor thread on this forum, we came to the general conclusion that almost every raid bosses from Karazhan to Sunwell have either ~6200 or ~7700 armor (With only a handful of exceptions, such as VoidReaver). A few people have posted as an example the damage increase from several ArP value.

Since the formulas to calculate % increase weren't explicitly presented I have decided to put everything into a simple spreadsheet for those of you that want to see the damage increase for a specific ArP value with different raid debuffs applied. (Also that the thread is pages and pages long, and the only useful info is the actual boss armor. Compliments to all of those that have spent time finding out the actual armor value each boss has!)

The spreadsheet will show you the damage increase of your phsyical attacks in increments of 25 ArP. So far, you can also select to show results with any combinations of SunderArmor, FaerieFire and Curse of Recklessness.

Caelus' Simple Armor Pen Spreadsheet

 

• landsoul

I thought it was 6200, not 6600

Also, ArP comes in stacks of 7, not a divisor of 25.

you can get anywhere from 49 to 350 ArP on a given item.

 

Tilted

ArP isn't exclusively found in multiples of 7. [Eternium Rage-shackles] is an example.

Also, the spreadsheet shows values of 7685 and 6200. The 6200 I've seen before, but where does 7685 come from?

You might want to spell "damage" right in B3, and I69 is only moderately amusing.

 

• Aldriana

7685 comes from the fact that many bosses have been tested as "about 7700" armor, and there was a screenshot circulating back in the day of a hunter using Beast Lore on The Lurker Below, which showed him as having 7685 armor. So it's been assumed that all the "about 7700s" are really all the same value, and based on that screenshot, that that value is 7685.

 

Joshbott

I'm glad I saw this thread today, I was just fidgeting around with my arpen and ex/mongoose.


Raidguru.Net (http://raidguru.net/PHPbb3/viewtopic.php?f=64&t=103&sid=1b03988a590f74109818b265116bc018)


That's a link to a great armor penetration thread over at raidguru. They've got a good spreadsheet plus listings of armour values for many bosses.



I'm raiding as a ret paladin and most of the arpen theory I've seen today is based on rogues dual wielding. Currently I'm raiding thru SSC and am running a base arpen of 780 (1618ap, 32.7crit, 6.5% hit (yes, i know its low)). Yes, I wear leather, all gear is useful if you're not stupid or you're desparate. :-)


I've been playing with the arpen stacking it up gradually mostly for snicks but now I've actually started raiding I want to work to tweak this set better for bosses. My gut tells me that replacing Executioner with Mongoose was the right decision at this point...but the math y'all pointed out above is making me rethink....specifically considering the raid armour penetration buffs like sunder, etc.

If there's a better thread for this question, please let me know.

 

Joshbott

Just dl'd your spreadsheet, this is very nice, thank you.

 

Tilted

Each class is going to have a different breakdown for how valuable ArP is. Warriors get a massive boost from ArP since virtually all of their damage is mitigated by armor. Rogues get slightly less due to bleed and poison damage, but still quite a bit. Then you have classes like shamans and paladins that have a fair amount of magic damage mixed in, so it's going to vary based on spell selection. And dual wielders have the option of putting executioner on one weapon then mongoose on another, so that complicates things a bit.

For ret pallies, I believe the consensus is to use mongoose until you have quite a bit of passive ArP, at which point executioner starts to outperform it. Check out http://elitistjerks.com/f31/t17193-p...s_theorycraft/ for more info. Again, spell selection is a factor in this decision, so keep in mind how much of your damage comes from SoC, Consecration, Exorcism, etc.

It's worth noting that talented Expose Armor from a rogue is the single largest boost to physical DPS in the game, followed by a 5-stack of Sunder and then non-talented Expose Armor. If you're running with a non-warrior tank in your raids, one of these debuffs really should be up to keep DPS kickin.

 

caelus

My apologies on 6600 there on the post, it was a typo on my post, on the actual spreadsheet it is correctly set to 6200.

As to multiples of 7, it is certainly true that the majority of the items are indeed in multiples of 7, with several exceptions such as [Cataclysm's Edge] or [Hard Khorium Choker]. The reason I chose 25 increments is because it roughly gives a 0.2% increase per increment (atleast for 6200 bosses) hence a good number to work with. Any smaller increments will only give a negligible difference, afterall, the calculations itself are just estimation anyway.


Advice taken. I have now made the correct changes and I have also now extended the table up to 4000ArP from 1500, for those that have stacked ArP past 1500.