Duilliath

Iirc, they did buff the base damage done by Maul/Mangle. They may just feel that's enough of a threat increase. Or, similar to the Warriors, added the +15% increase auto to Bear-'stance'. Warriors had their 15% threat talent tacked onto the stance as well.

I'm a bit in two minds about Primal Tenacity. In PvE, I'd rather resist a fear than have it last slightly shorter - same in PvP. I don't think it makes a huge difference if I'm running around like a headless chicken for 12seconds or for 10seconds. It does match their design of making 'random' stuff have less impact on the Arena game and is in line with other such talent changes. 15% less damage on a stun isn't half bad (though you never heard me complain about resisting a 5pt Kidney Shot...)

I've seen Improved Faerie Fire in the Balance tree earlier - might just be a minor muck up on the Patch notes. Wouldn't be the first time.

//edit: from the first post in this thread:

 

Emi

This one is fresh out of the Beta forums :
I'm getting the uneasy feeling that our DPS is getting far too powerful and very likely to get hit by a rather sizeable nerf bat

 

• sadris

Right now we are doing 1800dps while Enhncement Shaman and Warriors (both hybrids) are doing 2200dps. I think they are bringing us in line with the other classes.

 

Inaiwae

lvl 79 Ravage: Ravage the target, causing 385% damage plus 1771 to the target.
lvl 80 Ambush: Ambush the target, causing 275% weapon damage plus 335 to the target.

I have very bad feeling about this. How do they want to keep it balanced during gear progression?

edit: from WotLKWiki.com

My line of thoughs (numbers just wildly estimated):
Green druid / rogue ambushes for 4k.
Druid base damage: ((4000-1771) / 385) * 100 ~= 580
Rogue base damage: ((4000-335) / 285) * 100 ~= 1285

Purple version, lets say double base damage
Druid: 1160 * 2.85 + 1771 = 6237
Rogue: 2570 * 2.86 + 335 = 7659

 

• Daboran

Now, if that was a group AP buff, it would be very tasty indeed.

BASE damage <> WEAPON damage

 

Inaiwae

I dont see how this is relevant (apart from correcting wrong use of a term), i meant the damage (paw for druids, weapon for rogues) that is used as a base for the % coefficient. The static component is just too big ...

 

• Daboran

I see what you mean now, I misinterpreted your concerns. perhaps they intend that Rogue base damage will scale faster with gear/talents than Druid?

 

◊ Ulfgar

I suspect all this means is that, because you can spec for both improved faerie fire and feral faerie fire, you now apply the improved version when you cast it in feral forms.

I got pretty excited when I first saw this, but getting the improved version for an 11 point feral talent would be pretty overpowered, on reflection.

 

Valerian

The new talent trees on MMO champ have Improved mangle at reducing the cooldown of mangle (bear) by 0.5 sec each rank, making it significantly better than it was before.

That Savage Roar finishing move is simply amazing. Combined with the increase in the AP given by our weapons (in both Predatory Strikes and the rumored Dire Cat) this will provide a downright insane amount of AP. Hell even now it would give me a solid 1000-1500 AP depending on procs and group composition.

Speaking of Dire Cat, any information on this yet?

 

Duilliath

Haven't seen any yet (other than what was posted previously in this thread).

I'm wondering about the "1% health" increase on Berserk... I seriously hope that's a typo for 10%-15%.

 

Phorage

Can anyone think of a reason for not letting LotP (and Moonkin Form buff too I guess) be raidwide buffs, when WF, paladin auras and Blood Pact are going to?

 

Valerian

No real reason for LotP. The new improved Oomkin aura would be a fairly substantial buff though for all casting classes (healers included). I could see limiting it for that reason alone.

 

Duilliath

Seems like Trueshot Aura is another such aura that remains party-only.

 

tlbj6142

So, does SR stack? Seems like we could have 2-3 of these up at one time due to crits and/or OoC. Or will we need to alternate Rip and SR each cycle? Or perform a short SR cycle followed by a long Rip cycle?

 

Melthu

I assume it would be like SnD, and that trying to use a Savage Roar while one is already up will simply refresh it's timer. So now, instead of "Mangle/Shred to 4 combo points, then Rip" our rotation will look more like rogues': x point Savage Roar, 4 (or 5, if they fix the scaling on the 5th combo point) point Rip. Of course, this could be thrown off if they buff Ferocious Bite to the point that it would be worth having in our rotation. I can't see us being able to generate enough combo points to throw in FB while keeping both SR and Rip running, but we can't know for sure until we get some hard numbers.

 

Valerian

Trying to keep this up along with 5 point rips is going to be rough, especially once our crit rate gets dropped due to ratings/agi changes. I mean the Tiger's Fury energy buff along with Berserk will help but I don't know how consistently you'll be able to keep both up and running.

 

Scurn

I wonder if this is taking the place of Lockjaw since I doubt we will get two new feral skills at 75.

 

loos

I don't know where she got her information, but on the Resto4Life page it says that Lockjaw is being replaced by Savage Roar.

 

tlbj6142

It will make Kitty DPS more exciting than it is today. I sort of look forward to it. Though there will be a steep learning curve.

 

Duilliath

Pity. I liked the idea of Lockjaw.

 

Mu

Remember the last time this happened?

Anyways, I'm happy with the changes overall. I already do pretty decent damage while tanking and 15% more swipe damage on top of T6 will be amusing for tanking 5 mans as I level.

I wasn't REALLY expecting us to get offhand attacks in dire cat but the increased armor sounds likely, at least. To be honest the one thing I'm hoping for is that it has a humanoid model, I know someone at blizzard is itching to re-use those ZG werecat boss models and I'm sick of cat hitbox problems.

 

tlbj6142

I thought I read a recent blue post that said they are re-working the range system entirely (for whatever reason) and hope that that will fix this issue. Or will it introduce another?!?!

FWIW, do you have the range issue in PvE (instanced or solo)? I only see it in BGs (though I don't do Arenas). Unfortunately, it shows up all to often in BGs.

In general, it looks like we got some nice boosts. I really like that we now have some "generic" CC. So, I can be a tank with CC, DPS with CC, caster with CC, healer with CC. In fact, I can see pulling with roots. Shift to bear-->enrage (which now causes extra damage for 20s due to King of the Jungle).... With one in CC and 3 at our feet we can tank 4 mobs far easier than we can today.

 

Mu

You're a tauren, try meleeing something at max range in caster form and then going cat. It's pretty funny.

The problem in BGs has as much to do with it being impossible to get behind people without a snare or stun.

 

tlbj6142

Does that fix the problem? Once I get a mob that I can't hit, I just pick another one. As that has been the only way I have been able to "fix" the range issue.

 

david0925

With the change to Improved Mangle it becomes one of the best talents to pick up for single target threat improvement.

The spec I'll be going assuming that's what's on live (most likely not)
http://www.mmo-champion.com/talent/?...00000000000000

1 point left over to be put into either Savage Fury or Improved LoTP, neither of which is gamebreaking.

Maniq is my hero