PsyBomb

There is not yet a higher rank of Water Shield, and the official calculator says the bonus from the Shields talent is 10% no matter how many ranks in it you have. If it is, then the bubble value is only 220 (260 if it becomes 10% per rank). We'd have to get a new top rank with a 310 (minimum) per-bubble base to see the gems break even (365 if it stays at a strict 10% flat rate). IMHO, not likely to happen.

To teach and to learn, to laugh and make others laugh. This is my purpose, and any day in which I don't wasn't worth the time it took to get through.

 

Shakes

Blessing of wisdom went from 41 mp5 to 91 mp5. At the same rate of increase, that would put water shield at 111 passive mp5, and 444 per orb used. I don't see 310 per bubble as not likely, in fact I'd be very surprised if it wasn't significantly higher than that.

 

PsyBomb

Water Shield has no cost but a GCD used, though, and is strictly self-only. Eh, I guess anything is possible, just need to wait and see.

To teach and to learn, to laugh and make others laugh. This is my purpose, and any day in which I don't wasn't worth the time it took to get through.

 

Orlgin

I find myself deeply surprised that no one here has suggested an alternative way to spec Resto. Since only one Resto shaman needs to take Spirit Link, a different Resto shaman could focus on pure powerful Chain Heals like the way many resto shamans do right now.

It seems to me that Resto Shamans could get a power boost using Mental Quickness. From my time reading the Elemental shaman thread, it's quite evident that you can get a lot of spellpower from it. You can still pick up virtually all the useful chain heal and Earth Shield talents if you skip Tidal Waves, Spirit Link, and Blessing of the Eternals.

This is. of course, assuming that it isn't nerfed or moved further down the enhancement tree.

 

Shakes

I'm assuming the intention is that you don't typically have more than one of any spec in an ideal 25 man raid, and hence there is no "different resto shaman". It is an interesting idea if you still need to stack healers, but I think they want stacking healers to change in line with this comment from Ghostcrawler:

 

Kilted Raven

I've been jotting down a few notes, trying to get some idea of how Tidal Focus could shake out depending how it interacts with Chain Heal and our other crit-related talents.

Seems that it could work one of three ways :

a) The Tidal Focus +crit works on every jump of your chain heal, then ranks down to the next bonus after the cast.
Seems unlikely, and massively powerful to boot. I've got to discount this one. The only reason I'd consider it would be if the engine is incapable of adjusting crit bonuses on the fly between different chain heal jumps landing.

b) Each Chain Heal jump counts as a separate heal for the TF bonus.
Seems the most likely candidate assuming the mechanics can support that. Our other effects work on separate bounces (like AF), once again, can the crit value change mid-jump or is it fixed at the point of casting? The only downside might be burning TF charges on non-essential people/pets who caught a Chain Heal jump in passing.

c) You can only proc one TF charge per Chain Heal
I don't see how this one can work easily as it would have to drop off the crit increase after whichever jump managed to crit, and then reapply the bonus after the spell was finished. Seems fiddly.

Assuming b), Tidal Force could be used up extremely fast with Chain Heal. If you have a 30% crit chance already, which seems reasonable with the new talents and poential emphasis on crit gear then I make it that you've got a 31.5% chance of burning all 3 charges on a single CH cast (0.9 * 0.7 * 0.5), and you're better than 60% for using 2 charges.

As we've discussed, the ability to pull crits on demand with the associated procs is going to be very powerful. It's not just the crit itself, it's knowing you're getting those big heals in along with Ancestral Healing at the point where they're going to matter most. To be honest, even the ability to virtually guarantee an Ancestral Healing proc at the right time is going to be situationally worthwhile with the recent changes to potion chugging.

The other big synergy might be with Ancestral Awakening. Do we know yet if we can get multiple AA procs on multiple CH crit jumps, or if there's an internal cooldown? The thought of popping a Chain Heal with Tidal Focus after a big burst of raid damage like a late Hex Lord Barrage and getting 3x Crit Chain Heals backed up with 3x Ancestral Awakening procs gives me the warm healer fuzzies.

 

Negg

You do know that AA will only proc from HW/LHW not ? They really want CH out as our spam heal, so no synergy for CH.

But a completely other subject, I was doing some math on Int the other day, and for a 0/28/43 build Int could become the next big thing. Depending on if mana tide and hunting party become raid wide, if so, then it is without a doubt the most efficient stat for a Ch-shaman.

Based on a 10min fight an Int Gem (20 Int) will give you 11,62 spellpower (Mental + Nature's Blessing), 12,58 crit rating (45 rating/1%), 3,03 mp5 (mana gain/mp5 ticks), 1,51 mp5 per Mana Tide and 4,54 mp5 per Hunting Party.

The base value of a 20 Int gem is 23,04 StatMod points, then going up to 30,6 counting the mp5 on a 10min fight and an additional 3,87 per Mana tide and 11,34 per Hunting party. if you would get one of both and the fight last 10 minute then a 20 int gem is worth 44,47 StatMod points. almost 2,5 times as much as a standard 23 spellpower gem or 8 mp5 gem.

Only drawback here is of course that not all stats are as important for you, crit is decent for single target healing (with AA and IWS) but as CH-shaman you don't really need it and you do not gain any haste from this, where as haste is the best resto shaman stat atm.

 

Daidalos

I coudn't remember if I had answered this question or not. I didn't see where I had but my brain is been rather fried lately. In my VERY anectdotal testing from watching the blizzard sct and looking at buffs while running 5 mans it seems that each jump of CH has a chance to proc living weapon. I am not 100% sure of this however since other factors are involved like the illidan mace etc. I don't remember seeing a single chain heal cast proc multiple living weapons procs, however I did notice living weapon being applied to the second and third jump targets (Its also possible it did proc on 2 or more and I just missed it while being busy). It however did seem disproprtial the amount the first target got living weapon when the others didn't. This may indicate it was the illidan mace heal that was proccing it. This is rather difficult to test without getting 2-3 other people to stand around not leveling to extended periods of time.

Anyone else notice the mechanics on this? I'll try to test more carefully (switching my healing weapon) the next time I run an instance.

Elemental Shaman calculations: http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?k...IWuwb3e2IkuZKw

Restoration Shaman calculations:http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?k...IWv3sPmcYnEJUg

 

Sprout

While stacking resto shaman in LK may not be standard, there will always be a few guilds (esp horde side) that are shaman heavy. That being the case, if 2 resto shaman ARE in a raid it might be worth while to look at a pure CH spec.

 

Negg

Latest changes.

Enhancement

* Improved Shields - The amount of mana gained from your Water Shield orbs is now 10% for all 3 ranks.
* Mental Quickness description changed - Reduces the mana cost of your instant cast spells by 2/4/6% and increases your spell damage and healing (was spell power) by an amount equal to 10/20/30% of your attack power.
* Shamanistic Rage - Chance to regenerate mana lowered from 30% to 15%. New: Reduces all damage taken by 30% and gives your successful melee attacks a chance to regenerate mana equal to 15% of your attack power. Lasts 15 sec.
* Feral Spirit - The 2 Summoned Spirit Wolves now last 30 seconds (instead of 45 seconds).

Restoration

* Improved Earth Shield - Increases the amount of charges for your Earth Shield by 1 (old version: 1/2), and increasing the healing done by your Earth Shield by 5/10%.
* Tidal Waves - Cast time component increased from 30% to 50%. New: You have a 20/40/60/80/100% chance after you cast Chain to lower the cast time of your next two Lesser Healing Wave or Healing Wave spells by 30/30/50/50/50% (old version: 30% for all ranks), and your Healing Wave and Lesser Healing Wave spells gain an additional 5/10/15/20/25% of your bonus healing effects.

I really think the Improved shields fixed 10% is a bug, would be ridiculous weird otherwise.
Mental Quickness is now 50% less effective for healing spells, also very weird. Any resto shaman shaman that would want this has to spec 28 points into enhancement to get this, why nerf it down so bigtime ? At the same time the paladins talent Sheat of Light (20-23 in Ret) is still 30% of AP to spellpower AND 60% of a crit heal is applied as HoT on the target, from a healing perspective more then twice as strong as our Mental Quickness.

That they nerf Improved Earth shield is also very unexpected, that talent was very weak to start with, the rank 2 now only adds 5% more healing to earth shield, not an other charge. The enh talent Improved shields already was better then this tier 9 talent, now it owns it up completely.

What they want with Tidal waves is beyond me. The speed bonus went up to -50% casting time after a CH, which is of course very nice, but how in the world are we going to pay for that ? 2 1520 mana Heal waves in 2.2 seconds or 2 960 mana lesser healing waves in 1.3 seconds, we're going oom faster then ever before.

The should focus on a decent mana conservation/regeneration system for the resto tree rather then adding new gimmicks.

 

Sprout

On the imp shields, it does look like a bug but I would not be suprised it that were not the case

0/28/43 is no lionger viable IMHO as a secondary spec for healers. Which is a shame because I dont see any other spots to put the points except a pure resto build. They did the same thing with elemental focus. It seems that unlike enh and even elemental, resto is not supposed to go more than 10 points deep in any other tree.

Imp ES was bad to begin with, this just means it is that much worse. 10% to 1 good (not great) spell for 2 talent points is pointless (no pun intended)

Tidal waves.....just wow. Talk about a bump in power. OP, I dont think you are seering the potential here. Even with the downranking nerf, CH1 followed by HW12x2 becomes a very viable option for a spam rotation. Include AA procs off that, Eartchshield, and SL and you have a pretty potent healing cycle for Mt healing. Personally I question whether 50% will stick but it will be interesting.

 

Negg

If imp shields isnt a bug, then this would further weak the already weak Improved water shield, the amount of mana generated is already insane low and depending on a crit.

But about tidal waves, I find it very hard to find a role for such a spell rotation in raids, it's not that great for tank healing as you have to throw a CH into it, means a 3 sec gap between HWs landing, way to dangerous (and a Sheat of Light paly is unbeateble at tank healing). Raid wide healing it has some potential, but other spells are just better there (OP CoH). And as I said, mana... how in the world do you wanna pay for it ?

 

Kyuki

Mana is my biggest concern too. The rest will fall into place I'm sure, but all mana costs for shaman spells in general looks incredibly high..

 

Wednesday

How exactly do you figure that? It just seems like a clarification since talents can effect either healing or damage components. There doesn't appear to be a change in raw numbers, so I'm not sure why you think it's less powerful.

 

Negg

Because spellpower is 2x (well 1.9) times as effective for healing spells as +healing ?

Used to be: 3k AP = 1k spellpower = +1900 on a heal (before mods)

Now (at least according to the patch notes wording) 3k AP= 1k damage and healing= +1k on a heal (before mods).

Spellpower is nothing more then the combination of spelldamege (value = 0.9) and +healing (value = 0,5) into one stat, so healing spells will be getting 190% of your spellpower and damage spells 100%.

This is also why Nature's Blessing was changed from 30% of int -> spelldamage and healing into 15% -> spellpower. ALmost the same +healing +28,5% just half the spelldamage (15%).

 

madrix

Nature's Blessing according to the Blizzard talent calculator is only increasing healing by 15% of intellect.

 

Wednesday

Yes, but there is no longer a '+healing' stat. There are talents that increase your healing or damage by a given amount, but the numbers themselves correspond directly to spellpower as far as I can tell.

 

Daidalos

Healing and damage are still seperate categories spellpower just applies to both. The 2pct6 ele shaman bonus for example gives spell damage but not healing. This is the only example I know of off the top of my head but there are still 2 different categories in my stats in the current beta build and I assume it will stay that way.

Elemental Shaman calculations: http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?k...IWuwb3e2IkuZKw

Restoration Shaman calculations:http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?k...IWv3sPmcYnEJUg

 

Negg

That would be really weird, would be a 50% nerf on +healing received then, must be an eror. Blizz is making a lot of erors with the spellpower <-> spell damage/healing switch.

 

Daidalos

A 50% nerf from current beta builds but not much of one from live to beta due to our coef changes. THey might have removed teh damage compenent but since it is not on the beta servers yet its hard to be sure.

Elemental Shaman calculations: http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?k...IWuwb3e2IkuZKw

Restoration Shaman calculations:http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?k...IWv3sPmcYnEJUg

 

Gurth999

Obviously this hasn't gone live (er live on beta if that makes sense), but I think the first part is what has people concerned. If the talent is only going to improve healing by ~90 with 600int (current live equivalent of 180) is that really worthy of a tier 8 talent for 3 points?

 

Sprout

I think the idea is this:

Drop totems
ES tank
SL Tank
3x HW rank 1 for healing way


Pull boss

bounce HW off the tank to heal the SL recipients
Use HW to heal the tank

In addition to the straight heals you get ES procs, ELW Procs, AF Procs, and AA Procs. All of these on top of other MT healers. Im not saying I would make shaman the primary MT healers, but it sure does look like we would be better off than we are now....

 

Daidalos

Again this is no noticeable change from BC builds. This is really a nonissue. 90 spellpower is about 180 healing in BC if you think its good now well its the same if you think its bad now well then its still the same.

Elemental Shaman calculations: http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?k...IWuwb3e2IkuZKw

Restoration Shaman calculations:http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?k...IWv3sPmcYnEJUg