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Bald Bull
 
Roywyn's Avatar
 
Gnome Mage
 
Argent Dawn (EU)
WotLK Talent Discussion (Part Two)

Post will be updated as more information becomes known.

Last updated:
11/21/08 Meta gem advice; "1 Slow + Rest TtW/Fire" needs 10 mages now
11/19/08 FFB 6% precision; hit caps; Torment; Simcraft + Torment/Razorice
11/12/08 Frostfire Bolt info and threat, DPS charts, Scorch/WC info, AoE caps; major clean-up
11/06/08 Bug list update, general clean-up
11/04/08 Focus Magic, Mirror Image, Water Elemental info updated
10/31/08 Some updates, Judgement of Wisdom
10/21/08 Some updates, overhaul of the Coefficient Table at the bottom of the post
10/10/08 Frostfire Set Bonus
10/07/08 Glyphs; Spell Coefficents, Master of Elements, Judgement of Wisdom, Flamestrike, Spell hit for pets
10/06/08 Build 9014, updated Frostfire Bolt, Elemental Precision, Amplify Magic, Mirror Image
09/25/08 Build 8982, updated AoE caps, Mirror Image, base health increases, class uncertainties
09/15/08 Build 8926, updated new spell pushback mechanics, Hot Streak clarification
09/07/08 Updated new info for Build 8905, clarified Arcane Blast, Pyroblast, Living Bomb, added Mirror Image, AoE cap info
08/30/08 Updated link to Mana Cost
08/27/08 Frost nova info, level 80 mage stats, mage armour, elemental precision, hit caps updated
08/20/08 Build 8788, fixed and added some random things


Table of Content
* List of bugs and class issues
* DPS comparison for mages and other casters
* Profession comparison
* Description of new talents and abilities
* Lots of Links
* Scaling coefficients of abilities and pets
* Glyph options and choices



Bugs/Inconsistencies/Issues that affect gameplay decisions

Additive/Multiplicative Scaling
Fire Power, Spell Impact and 4T6 are additive for Fireball.
Not sure whether/how Piercing Ice fits into that picture for Frostblt and Frostfire Bolt combinations.

Rune of Razorice
A Deathknight Runeforge enchant that is rather poor for personal DPS, but adds a debuff that stacks to +5% Frost damage taken on mobs.
It increases Frost and Frostfire damage and stacks on top of all other debuffs. It also affects chaos damage, but Chaos Bolt does not do chaos damage anymore.

It stacks slowly on trash, but has nearly 100% uptime on bosses.
It's generally considered bad design on all accounts and only supports Frostfire's supremacy even more.

It basically forces all mages into Frostfire spec and one Deathknight into a Razorice Runeforge.

Judgement of Wisdom
This ability has done a real rollercoaster ride on its proc chance, cooldown and mana returns.
It is currently at 25% proc, no cooldown, 1% max. mana restored.

Whenever this ability changes in a patch, it will affect longvity and DPS of mage specs, favouring efficient specs when nerfed.

Potion Sickness
All potions have a 1 minute cooldown. When using a potion in combat, the cooldown timer will only start ticking down once you properly exit combat.
Invisibility and similar abilities cannot circumvent this in boss fights, the timer will start once the fight ends properly.

You can however use a Speed Potion the second before the pull to start the timer out of combat.
You can then use another Speed or Mana Potion a minute later in combat.

4T6 Set Bonus and others
The 4T6 set bonus, and also the 2T5 set bonus are worth roughly 150 spell power if all you did was casting the affected spells.
That means 2T5 is dead for good, and 4T6 is still competitive into early Naxxramas for Frost and Fire specs.

None of those however affect Frostfire Bolt, so the effective value of all the set bonus is a big zero.



Torment the Weak
This talent does not work when specced into Molten Fury.

On normal slowable kitable mobs, just any slowing affect of any class will trigger the damage increase from Torment.

On raid bosses that cannot be slowed, this talent is only triggered by the spell "Slow".
No other debuff that would usually reduce movement speed will trigger Torment on non-slowable mobs.

It does work on most bosses, but some bosses are completely immune to the "Slow" talent and thus Torment.
Currently, the only untormentable known boss is Brutallus.

To make it clear, to benefit from Torment the Weak in boss fights, you need a mage who is specced for Slow and recasts it every 15 seconds.
It is not known whether this is intended or not, and is generally considered really bad design.

The following is a list of abilities/debuffs of the slowing type that do not trigger Torment on bosses:
Frostbolt, Frostfire Bolt, Infected Wounds.

It is believed that Torment works of the "Ensnared" flag, which might be applied by the rogue talent "Waylay".
Which isn't much of a concern since Waylay can only be applied on cooldowns with extremely subpar specs.


Arcane Potency
Non-damage spells like Slow or Counterspell can also consume the crit buff.

Also, it is possible to double-dip from Arcane Potency by chaining an instant spell right to a cast time spell.
This requires the same timing and experiencee as Fingers of Frost.

Arcane Barrage/Blast
We're likely to see a nerf to Arcane Barrage spam and a complete redesign of Arcane Blast to improve Arcane PvE DPS.

Flamestrike
Its cast time has been reduced to 2 seconds for lower ranks. High ranks have not been changed and are still at 3 seconds.

The DoTs of different ranks of Flamestrike also stack. Staggering the 2, maybe 3 even highest ranks is viable to maximise DPS.

Ignite
Is working and bugging as usual. You're most likely to lose damage from Fireball-Pyroblast crits.
Casting Scorch before your Pyroblast however has the highest chance to gain damage from Ignite bugs.

It is uncertain if this outweighs the damage loss from casting Scorch more often.

The new ranks of Molten Armour proc Ignite again, likely not intended.

Master of Elements
Arcane Missiles rank 11 and Blizzard rank 6 currently do not proc this talents. The other ranks seem to work fine.

Blast Wave
Blast Wave, Typhoon and Thunderstorm are AoE spells with a knockback which is rather disruptive for AoE in raids.
They have been banned by quite a few raid leaders.

Living Bomb
The DoT doesn't get +10% damage from Firepower.

Also, the explosion after 12 seconds does not occurs if the caster is unable to cast spells.
I.e. when stunned, silenced, dead, Ice Blocked, or when the target is beyond the 100 yard range.
It is uncertain if moving out of line of sight prevents the explosion.

Frostfire Bolt
This ability double-dips from Amplify and Dampen Magic.
At level 80 against a target with a talented +/- 360 spell power taken buff, it gainst +/-720 spell spower.

Almost all other cases of double-dipping have been fixed.
It seems to still get 6% hit or more from Elemental Precision though. It used to bug out every other patch.

Frostfire Bolt also does not get pushback protection from Icy Veins.

The DoT portion does not scale with spell power anymore. It can be safely ignored, just spam max rank.
It used to scale in all kind of fashion in beta, but there is no scaling anymore on no rank or talent.


Blizzard
Several effects are not triggered by Blizzard. This includes Ashtongue Talisman of Insight and Sundial of the Exalted trinkets.

Improved Blizzard also does not proc Fingers of Frost unless specced for Frostbite as well.

Fingers of Frost
Fingers of Frost and Frostbite will always proc simultaneously if specced for both. This is intentional by design.
The idead of the talent to make Frostbite useful in raids and some other situation where mobs/players do not stay frozen.

If the spell that is cast on the 2nd (or 3rd) FoF charge also procs FoF, this new proc immediately disappears and is lost.

You can cast an instant spell right after your 2nd spell under FoF to get a 3rd spell with the FoF buff off.
It is not known whether this is intended behaviour as shatter combo or not.

It is a DPS loss in any PvE setting once the second bug is fixed and the 2nd FoF can properly proc FoF.
While the bug persists, it is still a DPS loss in most sensible gear settings.

Molten Armour procs also consume a charge on Fingers of Frost.

(Water Elemental)
(Does not have an aviodance talent to reduce damage taken from AoE.)


Mage and Caster DPS at Level 80

The latest Simcraft results can be found here SampleOutput - simulationcraft - Google Code

Specs with at least 18 points in Arcane assume Torment the Weak.
There are also Frost/Fire specs directly labeled to not have Torment.
The lastest update includes Rune of Razorice.

It also doesn't include old set bonuses, but T6 will be replaced at that gear level anyway.

Frostfire Bolt specs like 0/53/18 are currently the highest DPS specs. and can compete with Shadow Priests and possibly Moonkin.
Properly played Warlock specs are well beyond our reach. Elemental Shaman DPS is garbage.

The only spec that can outdamage Frostfire Bolt is a Fireball spec with Torment like 20/51/0.
It does however require a Deep Arcane Mage who focuses on keeping up Slow for the whole boss fight.

It would require about 10 mages for a "1 Slow, rest Torment/Fireball" setup to outdamage an "all Frostfire" setup.
Also, Fireball specs are much more taxing on mana than Frostfire specs which will have implications on long fights.

Fireball specs like 20/51/0 without Torment are still competitive, but slightly below Frostfire specs.

Frost specs do not look competitive for single target DPS in a geared and buffed raid.

Deep Arcance specs are only slightly above frost, but a redesign of Arcane has been announced, in particular Arcance Blast.
Specs that go deep into Arcane for Spell Power but want to focus on a non-Arcane nuke are garbage as well.


Level 80 Spec Scorebard for Naxxramas gear
A more details anylysis is shown under WotLK Talent Discussion (Part Two).
It accounts for not having a Slow slave for Torment and other, more practical things.


Mage Gearing and Hit Cap at Level 80
Your first prority is getting spell damage. Your second second priority is also spell damage.
Even in crit heavy Fire and Frostfire specs, spell damage will be your best stat to stack via gems for a long while.

You also want to cap spell hit, but not at the cost of using inferior gear just because it has more hit.
When you get decked out in wisely chosen Naxxramas gear, you should easily reach the hit cap. Gem for it if you're close.

You want to reach 17% spell hit. You can gain 1% from a Draenei in your group, 3% from a raid debuff, 3% from talents.
Frostfire Bolt seems to gain 6% hit from Elemental Precision, a bug that's going to get fixed sooner or later.
The rest has to be obtained by gear, you need 26.232 hit rating for 1% spell hit at level 80.

That means if you have no spell buffs or talents, you need 446 hit rating for 17% spell hit chance.
Your Water Elemental and Mirror Image pets also get the spell hit from your gear, but not from your talents.

Crit and Haste then are your secondary DPS stats. They are vastly worse than spell power until you get around 4k spell power or more.
1 haste rating: Is worth about 0.7-0.8 spell power in full Naxxramas gear for most specs.
1 crit rating: Is worth 0.8 spell power for Frostfire, 0.7 for Fire, 0.6 for Arcane/Fire, 0.5 for Frost.

Intellect is on par with crit for Arcane/Fire and is has 1/3 of the strength of crit for the other specs. Spirit is mostly useless.

Mana is also very important, make sure you never run out of it.
If you use everything at your disposal and still run out of mana, check your spec and buffs.
If that still doesn't help then drop some haste, get some intellect, use Mage Armour. But don't stack spirit ever.

The percentage conversion for all ratings and stats at level 80 can be found in Combat Ratings at level 80

As for meta gems, the only acceptable choice is one of the +3% crit damage meta gems due to how it actually works.
It is worth about 150-200 DPS, which makes most headpieces without a meta socket a bad choice.



Mage Profession gains
The whole list of Profession benefits can be found at The WotLK profession thread
It is possible that the options get upgraded

* Jewelcrafting: +59 spell power and -24 stamina (or -16 spirit) with rare gems. +49 spell power and -30 stamina (-20 spirit) when/if epic gems appear.
You can use Prismatic gems to unlock your meta gem requirement, allowing you to skip the two blue/purple coloured gems.
* Blacksmithing: +38 spell power with rare gems socketed, +46 spell power once/if epic gems get implemented.
Epic gems are in the database, but with placehlder icons. They may or may not get implemented at all.
* These two professions also have the advantage that you can chose which stat you want to improve by chosing gems.
If we ever reach the point where crit or haste beats spell power, we can switch to these gems.

* Inscription +37 spell power, +43 spell power in the first 2 months when not Exalted with Sons of Hodir (daily grind)

* Herbalism may offer something in the +33-40 spell power region via Fire Seeds if you can properly stack cooldowns.
Fire Seeds have been completely non-functional throughout beta though.

* Enchanting +38 spell power, Leatherworking +37 spell power, Alchemy +37 spell power

* Mining, Skinning, Tailoring, Engineering are currently not competitive options for Mage DPS.
Lightweave Embroidery isn't better than a regular cloak enchant, and the Engineering gimmicks are only situationally useful.



WotLK Mage Mechanics Changes


This post first covers general changes in spellcasting mechanics.

It will then explain ambiguous talents and changes in mechanics of existing spells.

I am not going to mention every talent that has been changed, because nearly everything has changed.
35 talents are unchanged - actually some of those have been moved around a bit - while 51 talents are new or have been changed.

Several of the new talents are bugged or not implemented yet, most have been mentioned.


Raid Synergies and Changes - Patch 3.0.2 - On Debuffs, Buffs, and Raid Stacking
Raid buffs and debuff have been unified and categorised into non-stacking types.
This list is an augmented list of an official post on what stacks and what not.

Rawr - http://elitistjerks.com/f31/t21713-r...eased_10_26_a/
Probably the best tool out there for fine-tuning mage gear, stats and decisions.

It's strongest point is that it uses a solver that takes mana into account to maximise your performance.
This includes partial use of mana dumps (Living Bomb, Arcane Blast) and the choice of using or skipping Mage Armour, Evocation, Mana Gems, Mana Potions for better DPS choices.

It does require some proper setup. And if it tells you to spam intellect gems, you likely lack buffs or set the fight length too long.

Theory Craft-o-Matic - Theory Craft-o-Matic
Lhivera's popular tool to quickly find gear weighing stats. It's great for quick checks.
It does show your mana consumption, but it has no way of knowing how much mana you have available.

Vontre's Magegraf - http://www.magegraf.com/
A mage/warlock casting simulator updated for the current level 80 talents and abilities.

Simulationcraft - SimulationCraft Model Development
A simulator that simulates a whole raid. Has the great advantage of being able to compare across classes.
Also shows mana gains and expenditure from different sources, and allows interaction of talents like Focus Magic.

Mage Level 80 Stats and Base Damage - WotLK Talent Discussion (Part Two)
This post and the following list base stats and base damage for level 80 mage spells.

Mana Cost as percentage of base mana - WotLK Talent Discussion (Part Two)
Any level 80 mage has 3268 Base Mana, mana cost is given as percentage and absolute.

Mana regeneration from Spirit and outside sources - WotLK Talent Discussion (Part Two)
Lists pure regeneration to estimate sustainability of specs, does not include Base Mana Pool and Evocation.


Generic Mechanics


Level 80 Statistics
A level 80 undead mage has the following statistics:
35 Strength, 41 Agility, 60 Stamina, 179 Intellect, 179 Spirit
7883 HP, 5673 Mana, 1.98% spell crit

This means the Base Mana of any level 80 mage regardless of race is 3268, Base Health is 7463.

Base Health of any pet including Water Elemental pets has been significantly boosted.
With 737 stamina and 703 intellect, a mage has 14653 HP / 13533 Mana while his pet has 9218 HP / 3948 Mana.

The water elemental scales with 30% of its master's Stamina and Intellect, 35% of it's master's Armour and 33% of its master's Spell Damage.
It gains slightly less than 7.5 HP per Stamina and 5.0 Mana per Intellect.
Waterbolt costs 163 Mana, deals 601-673 base damage, Freeze costs 817 Mana.


Raid Buff Normalisation
Many raid buffs and debuff have been changed and share categories in which they don't stack.
For example rogues, paladins and shaman can all provide a 3% crit debuff on mobs, only one of those is needed however.

For mages, that means that Improved Scorch and Winter's Chill are in the same category, and no other debuff is in it.
That means the 10% crit debuff of both abilities doesn't stack, and every raid needs 1 mage who is specced for one of them.


Breaking Frost Nova
Frost Nova, Frostbite, Entangling Roots, Fear and other effects that had a chance on breaking on damage now break after a certain amount of health lost during the effect.

The amount of damage depends on the target's health pool. The amount of damage is different in PvP and PvE.
It might also be different for elite mobs, since it could make effects hardly ever break on them.
Currently, this cap seems to be 40% of the mob's health for all of the mentioned effects.

Effect/Issue: This gives Frost Mages a spell damage threshold when fighting mobs of a narrow level range.
Below that threshold, Frostbolt crits will never break Frost Nova/Frostbite, so you can shatter 3 spells on them (2 Frostbolts and 1 Ice Lance).
If you get above the threshold, you'll sometimes/often/always break Frost Nova/Frostbite after one crit.

This of course depends on your level, your spell rank and the mob levels (for the mob's health).
More info on WotLK Talent Discussion (Part Two) and WotLK Talent Discussion (Part Two).


Area of Effect Damage Caps
The Area of Effect Damage Caps have been loosened.
All of them are now capped at 25.000 damage for every second base cast time at level 80, instants count as 1.5s as always.
That means instant spells are capped at 37.500 damage, Blizzard is capped at 25.000 damage per wave.

The base mechanics are still the same however.
Crits and damage debuffs allow you to exceed the cap, more spell power of self-buffs do not.


Spell Pushback
Any spell you cast can get pushed back only twice now.
The first two hits cause 0.5s pushback, further hits cause no effect. Channeled spells lose 25% channeling time per pushback.

Pushback resistance talents and abilities now reduce the pushback time instead of chance.
So, with Burning Soul, you lose 0.15s casting time for the first two hits, for a total 0.3s instead of 1.0s.
Concentration Aura and similar talents work the same way and stack.


Mana Reduction Talents
All talents and effects that reduce mana costs are multiplicative unless listed as special case.

The only exception is Arcane Blast, which has the Arcane Power +30% cost, the Tirisfal Regalia +20% cost and the Arcane Blast debuff +200% cost (up to 3 times) are added together to form one multiplier which is then multiplied with the remaining talent multipliers.

So, everything behaves like on live.


Mana Cost
All spell mana costs are being changed to a percentage of base mana.
Downranking now costs the same mana for the last three rank and even more for any rank before that.


Downranking Penalties
Around 5-7 levels after learning a spell, it will start taking a 5% penalty from your spell power for every level after that certain level. After 20 more levels, it only gets its base damage.
This is mostly irrelevant since downranking doesn't reduce a spell's mana cost any more.


Full Resists
It is now possible to fully cap spell hit. The 99% hit cap has been removed.
Full resists appear as misses in the combat log.

The miss rates for spells have not been changed, this has been verified with several thousand casts.
They are still 4%/5%/6%/17% for mobs 0/1/2/3 levels above you.

Elemental Precision had been be fixed to grant 3% hit to all spells it affects, including Frostfire Bolt.
It now seems to grant 6% hit or even more for Frostfire Bolt, but no other fire or frost spells.


Partial Resists
Every spell with a damage component can now be partially resisted.
Level-based partial resists are still in the game, but do not follow the strict 25%/50%/75% pattern any more.
It seems to be 10%/20%/30% for mobs slightly above you, and scales up to 60%/70%/75% for mobs far above you.
Spell penetration was tested to still have no impact.


Amplify/Dampen Magic
The healing part is now considered direct spell power and has been reduced since the spell power scaling of heals has increased with the removal of +healing.
The overall effect is like before now.


Shields and Wards
Fire Ward, Frost Ward, Mana Shield and Ice Barrier now scale with 80.7% of your spell power.
That's 1.5/3.5 for being an instant multiplied with 0.855/0.455 for being a healing effect.
None of these shield seem to be affected by Amplify/Dampen Magic.


Wanding
Wanding now causes only 1 global cooldown when you start wanding. The GCD is a 1.5s physical GCD which is not affected by haste/heroism/etc.
After that, you continue wanding but you are not put on another GCD.

So, while wanding, you can cast a new spell at any time now and react immediately.


4/5 Frostfire Garb Set Bonus

This set bonus works like a 5% version of Spell Power and works additive with it.
That means it's roughly 2.5% increase of the absolute crit modifier, 3.5% with Ignite.
For all practical purposes at around 50% crit rate, it's a 0.9%-1.1% DPS increase and not worth giving up upgrades for.


Arcane Abilities


Mirror Image
This is the new level 80 Mage Spell. It summons 3 mirror images of the mage who cast Frostbolts and Fire Blasts at hostile targets for 30 seconds. They may also polymorph a secondary target.
The Mirror Images inherit the mage's threat lists. The mage also gain a 90M threat reduction debuff like fade.

The images deal about 15.000 damage over 30 seconds and do scale with gear.
The exact scaling is listed on the bottom of the post.
Mirror Images are not on the global cooldown, but the do trigger a 1.5s GCD on all other abilities that are not on the GCD.
It can be circumvented by macroing Icy Veins/Arcane Power/etc., Trinket, DPS consumable, Mirror Image and Fireball/Frostbolt/Whatever in that order.
It's not clear whether that is a bug or intended.

The mage and their images do not swap position upon casting Mirror Image anymore.
Newly cast spells will not be aimed at you if cast after the Mirror Images appear.

Bug/Issues: Copies may currently break crowd control effects, or polymorph and heal a primary target.


Arcane Blast
The Arcane Blast debuff was changed to +200% mana cost, +15% damage, stacking additive 3 times.
The debuff duration was changed to 3.0 seconds, making it very easy to lose the debuff.
2/5 Tirisfal regalia has been changed to a 5% damage and mana cost increase and while still being a valuable set bonus, it is no longer manadatory to maximise DPS.

The Mana Cost increases from the Arcane Blast debuff, Arcane Power and 2/5 Tirisfal Regalia are additive, not multiplicative.
They form a single coefficient for the spell's mana cost which is then multiplied with all other mana cost talents.

Issue: Arcane Blast spam currently produces mediocre DPS that is not sutainable at all.
It has been announced to be redesigned in the near future.


Mana Shield
The Damage-Mana ratio has been reduced to 1:1.5 and can be reduced to 1:1 with talents now.

Mage Armour
Mage Armour only reduces the duration of magic-type dispellable debuffs.
If a magic DoT ticks 5 times over 15 seconds, it will now tick 2 times over 7.5 seconds. The fractional tick is lost.
Channeled DoTs like Mind Flay or Drain Life are unaffected.

Torment the Weak
On snarable targets, every snaring ability triggers Torment on that mob. Hamstring, Frostbolt, everything.
On unsnarable targets like raid bosses, only the Mage Talent "Slow" triggers Torment.

Prismatic Cloak
Taking all three points of this talent makes Invisibility instant. It works properly now.

Incanter's Absorption
The buff memorises its absorption timers.
If you absorb two hits for 1k each at 0s and at 5s, you will get +150 damage from 0-5s, 10s-15s and +300 dmg from 5s-10s.
There doesn't seem to be a way to make it a rolling effect like the old Ignite or prolong the effects in any other way.

Missile Barrage
The 2.5s channeling time is then affected normally by all other haste effects.
The buff proc on spell cast, not spell hit, and can be reacted on when proccing off Arcane Barrage.

Netherwind Presence
This haste effect is multiplicative with all other haste effects.

Arcane Barrage
It is an instant spell that scales like a 3s cast time spell, it gains 85.7% scaling with your spell power.
It had 3/4 of that value during one push which is 64.3%, but that was reverted back to the old value in the subsequent push.


Fire Abilities

Ignite
Ignite ticks can still get lost when landing simultaneous critical strikes.
This problem is mainly during Hot Streak, if an instant Pyroblast crit follows a Fireball crit.

Flamestrike
Its cast time has been reduced to 2 seconds for lower ranks. High ranks have not been changed yet, so we don't know if the scaling will be changed or not.
The scaling of the DoT has been changed to 12.2% of your spell power per tick.

Pyroblast
Even though the cast time has been reduced to 5 second, the coefficients are unchanged.
It's is still 115% on the direct hit and 5% on each of the 4 DoT ticks.

Master of Elements
Arcane Missiles and Blizzard now proc Master of Elements properly.
If a wave crits, you get refunded 30% of 1/5 of the mana cost for Arcane Missiles, or of 1/8th of the mana cost of Blizzard.
Living Bomb also refunds mana if the final detonation crits. And costs mana if specced for Burnout.

Dragon's Breath
Does not share a cooldown with Cone of Cold any more.

Hot Streak
This talent works like a counter that counts how many critical strikes with the listed spells you have just had in a row.
When it reaches 2, the counter resets and you gain the Hot Streak buff for one instant Pyroblast.

The counter continues to count anew even if you haven't cast your Pyroblast yet.
You're not going to lose charges to double crits just because you cannot react on your most recent spell.

Living Bomb
The DoT ticks every 3 seconds and gains 20% of your spell power on each tick. The final explosion gains 40% of your spell power.
The DoT only ticks on the single target, while the final explosion is an AoE effect.

This spell is very valuable for single target DPS in its current state.

Frostfire Bolt
It is affected by almost every ability that affects fire spells or frost spells.
The only exceptions are range talents which do not apply. Its range is fixed at 40 yards.
The Fireball/Frostbolt cast time talents do not affect it either, which is expected.

The direct damage part scales as expected with 85.7%. The DoT ticks 3 times every 3s for 9s total.
Permafrost affects the length of the Frostfire Bolt debuff. If you spec at least 2/3 Permafrost, you will get a 4th tick of the DoT.
The DoT does not scale with spell power anymore.

The whole spell deals Frostfire damage all the time.
If Frostfire Bolt gets counterspelled, it locks out both, Fire and Frost spells.
Also, locking out either school will also lock out Frostfire Bolt.

When dealing with mobs that are resistant/vulnerable/immune to either Frost of Fire, damage calculation is based on the weakest type to inflict the highest damage.

Note that Ignite itself still does only Fire damage, so Fire immune mobs won't take any Ignite damage.


Frostfire Bolt threat is affected by Burning Soul and Frost Channeling, but they don't stack.
So you get 10% threat reduction if you have one of them or both. DoT and direct damage threat is affected.
Ignite threat likely won't be affected by Frost Channeling, but it has not been tested.
Note that threat over time is mostly irrelevant. Burst threat on the pull is dealt with Mirror Image.


This spell does not have very strong basic scaling, but it can compensate through its extremely powerful scaling by combining critical strike damage talents and Ignite.

It used to benefit twice from many talents because it dealt frost and fire damage. Most of the issues have been fixed though.

Bug: It seems to gain 6% hit or more from Elemental Precision, but only 3% mana cost reduction.


Frost Abilities

Blizzard
The individual hits in the individual waves are now capable of critical strikes.
Blizzard triggers Winter's Chill on every wave. It also triggers Fingers of Frost if Frostbite is specced for Imprved Blizzard to get a slow effect.
Fingers of Frost and Frostbite only proc simultaneously, but they provide a large amount of Shatter uptime for AoE spells.
Bug: It currently only procs Fingers of you also have Frostbite specced.
It also doesn't proc quite a large amount of trinlets.

Elemental Precision
Elemental Precision seems to grant 6% hit or more for Frostfire Bolt.
All other Frost and Fire spells receive the expected 3% hit.
It seems to work fine with mana costs right now. It bugs one way or the other every other build.

Shattered Barrier
The Freeze effect does not cause damage or break crowd control.
It counts as proper freeze effect for Ice Lance and Shatter.

Fingers of Frost
Fingers of Frost procs will always conincide with Frostbite procs. This intentional by design.
It allows your spells cast to be affected by Shatter, causes your Ice Lances to do triple damage and allows you to lauch Deep Freeze stun at targets that are not frozen.

You can currently cast 3 spells under 1 proc of Fingers of Frost, if the 3rd spell is an instant spell that is cast right after the 2nd spell.
It might require some practise and may or may not be intended.

Deep Freeze
The spell requires your target to be frozen at the beginning and the end of Deep Freeze's cast time.
Deep Freeze scales like a 1.5s cast time spell with 42.9% of your spell power.
The first point is moot now as it's instant, the second is now moot since it does no damage any more.

For the 5 second duration of the Deep Freeze debuff debuff, your target is considered frozen and stunned.

Bug: Impact stuns currently overwrite and remove Deep Freeze, even if Impact procs from the same cast.
Unconfirmed: Diminuishing returns with respect to freezing and stunning have been reported.
It is not tested whether it shares diminuishing returns with cheap shot or kidney shot.



Coefficient Scaling

Mage Spells
Mana Shield, Fire/Frost Ward, Ice Barrier: 80.53% (1.5/2.5 as instant * 0.855/0.455 healing conversion); unaffected by Amplify/Dampen Magic
Pyroblast: 115% direct damage, 5% per DoT tick
Frostbolt: 81.43% direct damage, with and without Glyph
Frostfire Bolt: 85.71% direct damage, the DoT does not scale at all
Flamestrike: direct damage 23.57% unchanged, new ranks still have 3s cast time; 12.2% per DoT tick
Frost Nova: (19.3% I think, 1.5/3.5 instant * 0.5 AoE * 0.9 freeze penalty)

Water Elemental
The Water Elemental gains all raid buffs like auras, totems and procs.

It gains 1/3 (33.33%) of its master's spell power, and all their spell hit from gear.
That means double-dipping from the spell power buffs like Totem of Wrath for example.

Waterbolt then scales with 5/6 (83.33%) of the pet's spell power.
Waterbolt base damage is 256-328 + 11.5*(level-50).

Its Stamina is 118 + 30% master's stamina, Intellect is 369 + 30% master's intellect, Armour is 7822 + 35% master's armour.
Its Health then is 6676 + 7.5 * Stamina and Mana is 1082 + 4.95 * Intellect.

Mirror Image
Casting Mirror Images is not on the GCD. Casting it however invokes a GCD on all abilities that are not on the GCD.
In particular Arcane Power, Icy Veins, Counterspell and all activated Trinkets.
It is unknown whether this is intended or not, or what the purpose is.

This can be circumvented by macroing Icy Veins/Arcane Power/etc., Trinket, DPS consumable, Mirror Image and Fireball/Frostbolt/NukeOfChoice in that order.

They do not get raid buffs themselves unlike the Water Elemental. So, they only scale indirectly with buffs on the player.

They last 30s when cast and can usually get 12 Fire Blasts and 24 Frostbolts off in total, in a 1:2 rotation.
They have a cast delay like all other pets, but their Fire Blast has no GCD.

They inherit 1/3 (33.33%) of their master's spell power each.

Their Frostbolts do 163-169 + 30% of their spell power as frost damage. They crit for 150%.
They also slow their target by 40% for 4 seconds.
Their Fire Blasts do 88-98 + 15% of their spell power as fire damage. They crit for 150%.
Links: WotLK Talent Discussion (Part Two)
Latest tests: WotLK Talent Discussion (Part Two)


Glyphs
Frostbolt - The glyph is a flat 5% multiplier on top of everything. The coefficient does not change. Frostbolt continues to proc Frostbite and Fingers of Frost.
Water Elemental - The -30 seconds are applied before talents. The cooldown is 2:00 when glyphed and talented.
Mana Gem - The Glyph stacks with Serpent-Coil Braid. And with 2/5 T7 I think, not certain though.

Glyphs at 70
You have 2 Major Glyph slots at level 70. There are only a few useful Major Glyphs that do not require Northrend herbs.
Arcane Power, Improved Scorch and Mage Armour are the only raid relevant glyphs at level 70. Maybe Mana Gem as well.

Leveling Glyphs
Evocation and Frost Nova are nice Glyphs for leveling. At least I prefer an emergency heal and less freeze breaking over some straight damage modifiers
Deep Frost builds are the best leveling specs for that matter. You don't get your 3rd Major Glyph Slot until level 80.

Glyphs at 80
At 80 for raid DPS, you should Glyph your Armour, your main Nuke and you have one slot left.
That should go to Improved Scorch or Summon Water Elemental. If you're Arcane specced and always the second mage in a raid, you might also Glyph Arcane Power.
I'm not sure I'd recommend it though, I'd still prefer Glyph of Scorch for Heroics for example.


Forum Links:

Zaldinar's AoE testing - WotLK Talent Discussion (Part Two)
Zaldinar'S Knockback tests - WotLK Talent Discussion (Part Two)

Simulationcraft build 8982 - WotLK Talent Discussion (Part Two)

Last edited by Roywyn : 11/22/08 at 2:19 PM.

The Blue Bar and you - the complete Fire Mage 2.4 mana compendium: http://elitistjerks.com/658230-post3191.html

DPS spec and class comparison in Naxxramas gear: http://code.google.com/p/simulationc...i/SampleOutput
This assumes Rune of Razorice and Slow for Torment unless noted as "No TtW".
More detailed at http://elitistjerks.com/923110-post2775.html

And [Timbal's Focusing Crystal] doesn't proc on AM.
 
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Old 08/16/08, 8:22 PM   #2 (permalink)
King Hippo
 
Tyrian's Avatar
 
Human Mage
 
Blackrock
It would also be nice for us to eventually summarise the important WOTLK synergy-related class buffs that benefit mages in raids. I usually follow the mage changes closely, but easily overlook/forget what other class synergy buff changes are happening and which affect mages.

It seems one fire mage (imp scorch) + one frost mage (winters chill) seems to be the most optimal combination if you only have two mages in a raid. Moonkin in group highly wanted. Is totem of wrath party only still?

How much does the value of crit for a Frostfire build (With over 350% crits facting in: ignite, ice shards, burnout, CSD etc) differ to the value of crit for other builds? Thats a pretty massive multiplier. Im drooling at the thought of a 51-20 Frostfire build, with molten armor, moonkin aura, imp JOTC by a ret paladin, ele shaman/totem of wrath in my group and a frost mage in the raid for WC - thats 24% crit from these buffs alone! And stacking a strong amount of crit from gear (say 25-30% crit from gear at entry raid level = ~50-55% crit all up?) with the huge 350% multiplier to abuse it.

Its been previously mentioned that hot streak gains alot more value when used in a frostfire elementalist crit-happy build - but is there a way to quantify it a little more? How much more valuable does Hot Streak become when you spec/gear into a 51-20 Frostfire playstyle compared to just a full fire (fireball) or fire/arcane build.

Last edited by Tyrian : 08/16/08 at 10:27 PM.
 
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Old 08/16/08, 8:23 PM   #3 (permalink)
Don Flamenco
 
Night Elf Warrior
 
Ravencrest (EU)
Don't have access to Beta yet, but with the deminishing returns on spells does that work only on the spell you're casting or do you get immune to pushback for a while like with other deminishing return effects?

What!?
 
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Old 08/16/08, 9:06 PM   #4 (permalink)
Von Kaiser
 
Lovend
Undead Mage
 
Non-US/EU Server (EU)
It is sometimes possible to chain Area of Effect spells under permanent Hot Streak uptime, but apparently is a bit random.
As far as I know this randomness comes from some weird rule that for the critical streak to go on all the three subsequent crits also need to come subsequent in the combatlog. Say you have hot streak up and crit 8 mobs with an aoe spell, this means you gain hot streak 2 and 2/3 times, the third build-up overwrites the other 2 hence you won't get the hot streak effect. This means you can only chain hot streak through aoeing by critting x amount of mobs where x is a number dividable by 3 without getting decimals, 3, 6, 9, 12 etcetera. That is how I interpreted it though, any corrections or confirmations would be nice.

Totem of Wrath: As far as I know they made all totems apply a raid-wide aura, if it still stacks with itself though I have no idea but in the end it probably won't.
 
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Old 08/16/08, 9:52 PM   1 links from elsewhere to this Post. Click to view. #5 (permalink)
Glass Joe
 
Undead Mage
 
Moon Guard
Originally Posted by Tyrian View Post
It would also be nice for us to eventually summarise the important WOTLK synergy-related class buffs that benefit mages in raids.
Send me additions/corrections via PM if you'd like! Hope this saves someone some time searching.

Optimal Dmg party for a mage (Elemental Shaman, BM Hunter, Balance Druid, Shadow Priest, Mage)

+39% damage
+223 spell power + 10% spell power
+6% arcane damage
+21% critical strike chance
+6% critical damage
+8% haste + 20% haste on proc (30sec cooldown) +30% haste (10 minute cooldown)
+5% intellect +5% spirit
+36% total mana returned (2.4min cd) + unknown mana from J.of the Wise +2% SP's dmg returned as mana +9% Pally spell power returned as mana
-6% mana cost to spells
-165 enemy resistances
+3% hit (+1% additional hit if Draenei in group)

Optimal Mana party for a mage (Resto Shaman, Survival Hunter, Balance Druid, Shadow Priest, Mage)

+30% damage
+223 spell power + 10% spell damage
+6% arcane damage
+18% critical strike chance
+8% haste + 20% haste on proc (30sec cooldown) +30% haste (10 minute cooldown)
+5% intellect +5% spirit
+36% total mana returned (2.4min cd) + unknown mana from J.of the Wise +2% SP's dmg returned as mana +9% Pally spell power returned as mana +2% of hunter's mana per hunter's crit +24% mana back (5 min cd)
-165 enemy resistances
+3% hit (+1% additional hit if Draenei in group)


Net change (Dmg Party +9% dmg, +3% critical strike chance +6% critical damage -6% mana cost of spells exchanged for Mana Party +24% mana back on 5 min cooldown + 2% of hunter's mana per hunter's crit)


:P = Party effect
:R = Raid effect


Warlocks (+13%dmg/+5%int/+5%spirit/+10%spell power/-165 resistance)

Curse of Elements (w/Afflic talented 3 pts Malediction): Curses the target for 5 min, reducing Arcane, Fire, Frost, Nature, and Shadow resistances by 165 and increasing Arcane, Fire, Frost, Nature and Shadow damage taken by 13%. (+dmg/-resist:R)

Fel Intelligence (w/Improved Felhunter): Increases total Intellect and Spirit of party and raid members by 5%. Lasts until cancelled.(+attrib:R)

Demonic Pact (talent): Your pet's criticals apply the Demonic Pact effect to the target. Demonic Pact increases the spell power of all attackers against that target by 10% of your Spell Damage for 12 sec.(+dmg:R)


Shamans (+73spell power/+5%haste/+6%dmg/+3%crit/+6%crit dmg/-6%mana cost/+24% mana 5 min cd/+30% haste 10 min cd)

Flametongue Totem (lvl 67 - affects raid as well): Party members within 20 yards of the totem have their spell damage and healing increased by up to 73.(+dmg:P)

Wrath of Air Totem (lvl 64): The totem provides 5% spell haste to all party members within 30 yards.(+haste:P)

Totem of Wrath (talent): The totem increases the damage done by spells and effects by 6% and increases the critical strike chance of spells and effects by by 3% for all party and raid members within 30 yards.(+dmg:R)

Elemental Oath (talent): Your spell critical strikes grant your party Elemental Oath, reducing the mana cost of spells and abilities by your party by 2% and increasing critical strike damage by 2%. Stacks up to 3 times. Lasts 15 seconds. {*Roywyn, "This crit damage bonus works like having 2 [item]Chaotic Skyfire Diamond[item]s."}(+attrib/+dmg:P)

Mana Tide Totem (talent): Summons a Mana Tide Totem with 5 health at the feet of the caster for 12 sec that restores 6% of total mana every 3 seconds to group members within 30 yards.(+attrib:P)

Bloodlust/Heroism (talent): Increases melee, ranged, and spell casting speed by 30% for all party members. Lasts 40 sec.(+haste:P)


Paladains (+3%haste/+2%dmg/+3%crit/+9% of pally's spell power as mana/+unkwn mana)

Swift Retribution (Talent): Your Retribution Aura also increases casting, ranged and melee attack speeds by 3%.(+haste:R)

Judgement of Wisdom: Unleashes the energy of a Seal spell to judge an enemy for 20 sec, granting attacks and spells used against the judged enemy a chance to restore [ 9% of AP + 9% of Spell Power ] mana to the attacker. {*Roywyn, "It is a 100% proc now with a 4 second cooldown. Mana returned is calculated from the paladin's AP/AP."}(+attrib:R)

Judgements of the Wise: Your Judgement spells restore mana to up to 3 group or raid members totaling 60% of the damage caused.(+attrib:R)

Heart of the Crusader: In addition to the normal effect, your Judgement spells will also increase the critical strike chance of all attacks made against that target by an additional 3%.(+crit:R)

Sanctified Retribution: Damage caused by targets affected by Retribution Aura is increased by 2%.(+dmg:R)


Hunters (+3%dmg/+2% of hunter's mana per hunter's crit)

Ferocious Inspiration (talent): When your pet scores a critical hit, all party members have all damage increased by 3% for 10 sec.(+dmg:P)

Hunting Party (talent): Your critical shots have a 100% chance to restore 2% mana, 10 energy, 4 rage or 10 Runic Power to all members of your party. This effect has a 8 sec. cooldown.(+attrib:P)


Druids (+6%arcane dmg/+20%haste/+5%crit/+3%hit)

Earth and Moon (talent): Your Wrath and Starfire spells have a 100% chance to to apply the Earth and Moon effect, which increases Nature and Arcane damage done to the target by 2% for 12 sec. Stacks up to 3 times.(+dmg:R)

Improved Moonkin Form (talent): Your Moonkin Aura also causes affected targets to have a 100% chance to gain 20% spell haste when they critically hit with spells for 8 sec. This effect has a 30 second cooldown. Also, all party members within 30 yards have their spell critical chance increased by 5%. (+haste/+crit:P)

Improved Faerie Fire (talent): Your Faerie Fire spell also increases the chance the target will be hit by melee, ranged and spell attacks by 3%.(+hit:R)


Priests (+2%mana battery/+5%dmg)

Vampiric Touch (talent): Causes 850 Shadow damage over 15 sec to your target and causes all party members to gain mana equal to 2% of any Shadow spell damage you deal.(+attrib:P)

Misery (talent): Your Shadow Word: Pain, Mind Flay and Vampiric Touch spells also cause the target to take an additional 5% spell damage.(+dmg:R)


Death Knights (13% damage, overwrites CoE)

Ebon Plaguebringer (talent): Your Crypt Fever morphs into Ebon Plague, which increases vulnerability to magic by 13% in addition to increasing the damage done by diseases. {
*Roywyn, "It works like a 13% Curse of Elements without the spell penetration part that is usually useless anyway."}
(-resist:R)


Mages (+10%crit/+10%dmg/+150spell power/+36% total mana per ImpWE)

Winter's Chill (talent): Gives your Frost damage spells a 100% chance to apply the Winter's Chill effect, which increases the chance Arcane, Fire and Frost spells will critically hit the target by 2% for 15 sec. Stacks up to 5 times.(+crit:R)

Improved Scorch (talent): Your Scorch spells have a 100% chance to cause your target to be vulnerable to Fire, Frost and Arcane damage, increasing damage taken by 2% and lasts 30 sec. Stacks up to 5 times.(+dmg:R)

Focus Magic (talent): Focus your energy on the target, increasing all magic damage taken by that target by 150. Lasts 1 min or until 50 charges are expended.(+dmg:R)

Improved Water Elemental (talent): Increases the duration of your Summon Water Elemental spell by 15 sec and your Water Elemental restores mana to all party or raid members an amount equal to 3% of their total mana every 5 secs (60 sec uptime, 36% total returned).(+attrib:R)


Draenei (+1%hit)

Heroic Presence (Racial Passive): Increases chance to hit by 1% for you and all party members within 30 yards.(+hit:P)


Thanks Roywyn, Solisa, Aeverius, Fortris, Shuror, Disargeria and Nehrak for the updates!

Last edited by deadlyice : 08/17/08 at 4:47 PM.
 
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Old 08/16/08, 10:54 PM   #6 (permalink)
Piston Honda
 
Undead Warlock
 
Tichondrius
Originally Posted by Roywyn View Post
Every spell with a damage penalty can now be partially resisted.
What exactly do you mean by this?
 
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Old 08/16/08, 11:11 PM   #7 (permalink)
Von Kaiser
 
Lovend
Undead Mage
 
Non-US/EU Server (EU)
Say for example frostbolt, it has a 5% coefficient penalty because of the added snare effect, before it could not be partially resisted, now it can. That's how I interpret it.

As for the synergy list, you forgot (druid)moonkin aura and (hunter)hunting party.

Oh and on druid summary it should be 6% arcane damage unless I'm visually impaired.
 
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Old 08/16/08, 11:15 PM   #8 (permalink)
Von Kaiser
 
Draenei Mage
 
Lightning's Blade
If I'm not mistaken, don't Shamans also provide elemental oath?

Elemental Oath - Spell - World of Warcraft
 
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Old 08/17/08, 1:33 AM   #9 (permalink)
Glass Joe
 
Fortris's Avatar
 
Gnome Warrior
 
Dath'Remar
Originally Posted by deadlyice View Post
Paladains (+3%haste/+9%spell power as mana/+unkwn mana/+2%dmg/+3%crit)

Judgement of Wisdom: Unleashes the energy of a Seal spell to judge an enemy for 20 sec, granting attacks and spells used against the judged enemy a chance to restore [ 9% of AP + 9% of Spell Power ] mana to the attacker.(+attrib:R)
You have the mana return of JoW listed as '9% spell power as mana'. I am uncertain whether you intend (and people will understand) this to mean that the mana return is 9% of attackers total spell power per cast, or the like.

As i understand the ability currently (which i have been following closely due to having a long-suffering Ret Paladin), the strength of the Judgement is based purely off the stats of the Paladin who judged it, not those of the other raid members who gain benefit from it.

To clarify : If you had a Ret Paladin specced for Sheath of Light (which gives 30% AP as +SD) judging Wisdom on a mob, and said Paladin had 3000AP raid buffed and no spell damage from gear, the proc from JoW would be worth ((3000+(0.3*3000))*.09) = 351 mana per proc. Since the new iteration of JoW has a 4 second (iirc) cooldown internally, thats approximately 281 Mp5 to the raid as long as they cast something at the boss at least every 4 seconds
 
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Old 08/17/08, 2:01 AM   #10 (permalink)
Von Kaiser
 
Draenei Mage
 
Lightning's Blade
Originally Posted by Fortris View Post
You have the mana return of JoW listed as '9% spell power as mana'. I am uncertain whether you intend (and people will understand) this to mean that the mana return is 9% of attackers total spell power per cast, or the like.

As i understand the ability currently (which i have been following closely due to having a long-suffering Ret Paladin), the strength of the Judgement is based purely off the stats of the Paladin who judged it, not those of the other raid members who gain benefit from it.

To clarify : If you had a Ret Paladin specced for Sheath of Light (which gives 30% AP as +SD) judging Wisdom on a mob, and said Paladin had 3000AP raid buffed and no spell damage from gear, the proc from JoW would be worth ((3000+(0.3*3000))*.09) = 351 mana per proc. Since the new iteration of JoW has a 4 second (iirc) cooldown internally, thats approximately 281 Mp5 to the raid as long as they cast something at the boss at least every 4 seconds
I think he knows this, the text in his post is a direct quote from the wowhead text, which would be read from the Paladin's point of view. It might beg some clarification, though.
 
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Old 08/17/08, 2:27 AM   #11 (permalink)
Bald Bull
 
Blood Elf Paladin
 
Echo Isles
Originally Posted by Vhad View Post
Don't have access to Beta yet, but with the deminishing returns on spells does that work only on the spell you're casting or do you get immune to pushback for a while like with other deminishing return effects?
It is on a per-cast basis. You cannot get interrupted more than twice per cast for a maximum penalty of +1.0 second cast time, but you can and will get interrupted again on second and succeeding casts.

Also, if your pushback resistance talent prevents a pushback, it does not count against the diminishing returns. That is, if you were hit 5 times and none of those produced a pushback, the 6th will still cause an 0.5 second pushback once the talent fails.

Finally, Blizzard has stated that they plan to change pushback resistance talents. Instead of reducing the chance of getting pushback, these talents will instead reduce the amount of pushback you get. That is, with 70% pushback resistance, the first hit would add 0.15 seconds to your cast time, while the second hit would add 0.30 seconds to your cast time. Ostensibly, the percentages are still subject to change with the new rules.

 
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Old 08/17/08, 3:25 AM   #12 (permalink)
Soda Popinski
 
Lord BEEF's Avatar
 
Tauren Druid
 
Mal'Ganis
Moonkins give 6% arcane damage, not 10% (Just stacks 3 times currently)
 
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Old 08/17/08, 4:56 AM   #13 (permalink)
Piston Honda
 
Human Death Knight
 
Khadgar
Death Knights (-resist 13%?)

Ebon Plaguebringer (talent): Your Crypt Fever morphs into Ebon Plague, which increases vulnerability to magic by 13% in addition to increasing the damage done by diseases.(-resist:R)
I'm not in the beta but my understanding is that Ebon Plaguebringer is identical to Curse of Elements with Malediction (+13% spell damage) and does not stack with it.

Please note I am not certain, just calling attention to this so hopefully someone in the beta can confirm/deny.