The trinket is a bad joke honestly. When you find yourself killing Mag, you should have good enough gear that 10% resists rates in boss fights arent your everyday life.

I still havent figured out why on earth blizzard implemented something like that. Even with lvl 70 instance gear its not worth it imo.

Like the lotttery, a tax on people who don't understand math.

Interesting results for level based resistance. Within the margin of error I would consider significant, even if we still can not figure out 2% or 8 per level for certain.

I doubt the Eye will be buffed, I assume it is meant to be a PvP trinket. However, the "big" day of retuned raid items is supposed to be tomorrow, so perhaps I am wrong.

To the guy that used your dkp, Mag's Eye is in most cases better than Tear for PvP and trash mobs.

pvp wtf? where do you have spellresists except cc. You need only 3% hit in pvp and in addition to this you cant really always cast your dmg spells, because you have to cc, have to run etc.

In PvP you should be constantly casting and even though you should have 3% to hit with your gear, you still will get resisted due to talents (like Priests with 30%+ to resist silence and Rogues with 90% to resist for 5 seconds) and the 1% hard resist will happen.

Any spell that is resisted, not just damage spells, will proc the Eye.

Hey, the trinket is not as bad as everyone seems to make it!

1) The proc has no internal cooldown, it can renew itself and proc back to back.
2) Thus, it's better than the Icon of the Silver Crescent if you get resists faster than every 67 seconds. That's around 5% miss for Frostbolt and Fireball, 1.5% miss for Arcane Missiles.

In most encounters with adds, I usually drop some hit gear for damage/crit if damage to the adds is crucial, leaving me with a higher miss chance than usual. I'm also pretty far from hit-capped, i haven't really found a lot of nice gear with spell hit.

Also, remember Murphy's Law? When the boss is at 20% and you pop flamecap, crescent and combustion, you always get a resist? The eye will turn that into your advantage for even bigger numbers!

+ competitive trinket for people with >5% miss
+ dampens the impact of resists for your damage output

- scales backwards with spell hit, best cost:dps raid stat
- provides only a sidegrade to the common trinkets

With crit heavy gear, and 33/28 build - is the spell rotation for max dps just scorch spam, with a fire blast when mana allows, or should i be using fb also ?

Ah of course, for some reason I thought you were deep frost.

In regards to Mag's Eye. Faxmonkey on the official mage forums was talking about how great it was for a frost mage for PVE. I assume the eye only procs on full resist. The eye still seems a bit gimp in the fact that the better your gear gets, the worse it performs. Just curious if anybody has done the numbers for it's relative value of Fire vs Frost.

Well frost spells do NOT get more full resists than fire or arcane spells. Fire and arcane spells get *additional* partial resists. So no reason for eye of magtheridon to be any better for frost specs than anything else.
Unless you manage to find a boss with frost resistance (I only know of the netherdrake in Ramparts).

Seems like Mag's Eye is getting a buff in the next patch:
http://www.worldofraids.com/news/upg...agtheridon.jpg

Went from 42 to 54 damage. The proc is still somewhat questionable, but the passive damage goes a long way of making it worth it now.

The eye is arguably better for a frost mage because they are casting more often than a fire mage. It's only something that would be discussed for in-depth theorycrafting... in game the eye should be valued as equally powerful for fire/frost mages and ignored by arcane mages, shadow priests and affliction warlocks.

It is true. You're missing a lot of information if you think spell penetration is useful for boss fights.

The quick summary- 99% of bosses are either immune to a school or have zero base resists. Non-binary spells have a partial resist rate of approximately 5% (I could be off on that figure) that can not be mitigated. Binary spells don't suffer from this "glancing blow" mechanic.

I was definitely not advocating stacking Penetration. Quite the opposite, my assumption is that most people will not have much, if any.

edit:

You're right I had missed the parsing that had been done regarding the magic glancing blows. It's puzzling to me this "feature" isn't better documented. If anyone else missed it, the ancient thread about this is here.

I'd disagree that an arcane mage should ignore this trinket. With arcane focus, it becomes easy to be +hit capped for arcane, and the benefit of further +hit to help secondary school is marginal to say the least. This can leave an arcane mage with considerable +hit gap for the secondary school and this trinket could be quite useful by procing on the secondary school part of the Arcane Blast cycle and giving benefit to the primary school damage.

I can confirm it does *NOT* proc on partial resists (otherwise it would be the most wonderful trinket for fire mages EVAR, imagine blizzard doing something like that, adding a useful new trinket, nevar! they added quag's eye just to nerf spell haste bad next patch, wheee), only FULL resists of DAMAGING spells, doesn't proc off a resisted Counterspell or Detect Magic for example, and I haven't done any deep theorycrafting at all on it but I can say my overall experience with it was quite poor, I didn't like it, it is however, an interesting trinket if you don't have a tear. I'll definately try it again after the buff next patch, even though only +12 dmg will most likely not change my mind. I can't help feeling like it's a Trap-trinket, which would make you want to get lazy with spell hit gear thinking everything would be fine but its proc doesn't cover the dmg lost on a resisted spell AT ALL, let alone increase your overall dmg. I could see it being a nice trinket for everyone without a tear though, because it would have the purpose of compensating the unfortunate event of having a resisted spell and you wouldn't get this guilty feeling that maybe if you had that extra 16 hit rating, that combusted+destruction+flame capped fireball at < 20% would not have gotten resisted in the first place.

I recently got the trinket, now the good thing about this trinket is that it stacks ,
with the Spellstrike set bonus +92dmg which procs quite often and also my other trinket
Xi'ris gift, so for 10 sec, I can get a boost of dmg of +412 , which is a nice addition to my regular dmg and if you have arcane Power , you can add another 30% to that amount, so when you are fighting a boss and its the last 20% and you need to squeeze out as much dmg as possible this is a really good solution

Returning momentarily to the "glancing spells" dicussion (sorry!), Yeonora's and Kavan's results strike me as rather significant. With frostbolt seemingly getting back (in terms of theorycraft) 5-6% of its damage from "glancing" immunity, and the 5% damage modifier added to Arctic Winds, deep frost is looking more and more competitive. Also Frost, and especially Arc/Frost, stands to gain the most from the 2.1 item buffs as the tier 4- and 5-lvl raid armor is no longer totally outclassed by the Spellfire set.

Vontre, any plans to remove the "glancing" modifier from the frostbolt calculations on your sheet?

You have a larger sample set yet? 384 frostbolts was the last sample size I saw. I think a thousand or more would be needed to say with absolute certainty that frostbolts are not effected by level based resists.

I usually didn't care about level based resists (beyond knowing that they existed) because there is absolutely nothing I could do about it. If frost bypasses this, it is something to consider.

Frost improves, but it's still signifigantly behind fire in terms of raw DPS. Unless the situation highlights frost's survivability, a heavy fire build will continue to be the default for 25-man raiding.

Not yet; the problem is that I basically have different hit ratings every single fight because of sometimes having an elemental shaman and sometimes not and because of gear improvements (e.g. I just got the ruby slippers replacing my boots of blasphemy for boss fights).
I suppose to get the best results you need some thousand samples on exactly the same mob with exactly the same hit rating :-/

Edit: Tomorrow we're doing Gruul and Magtheridon again... I'll try and get as close to exactly 16% hit including everything as I can again and post that data. Plus ResistTracker will accumulate data over time and I can recall it subdivided by mob name, spell penetration, hit rating on gear and extra hit%. Eventually I'll have some thousand samples of frostbolts (with some ice lances thrown in) on a raid boss mob with ~16% hit.
If any of you has a better idea of how to get a large sample size with frostbolts on a boss mob faster, please tell me. I read somewhere that Anachronos somehow doesn't work for that, as melee doesn't glance against him, but never tried it out.

I hope 17 points counts as heavy fire, because 40/17/3 AB/Fireball is almost dead even with 10/48/3 (even w/o AP+POM modeled). ...and just wait till we all have 2/5 tier5!