To everyone who edits the spreadsheet and uploads it in this thread:
Please uncheck "New Blue Post on +skill" before you upload your version.
If someone uploads one sheet with this enabled, there are allways popping up some posts with "Latro's >> Quickblade" Questions.
There might be possible setups were Latro's is still better than Quickblade, but they are very rare and I doubt it can result in +9dps or something high like this with "New Blue Post" unchecked.


Furthermore I try to model the new Sword Spec which resulted in several questions:
1. Anyone knows for sure, wether Sword Spec yellow hits are able to proc Sword Spec Procs?
I'm not sure wether this was already solved, only saw pf's post where he mentioned that Proc on Procs might be disabled now.
2. I'm a bit confused about the fact, that Style crit rate is always lower than normal crit rate.
-> Why is I20 modeled like crit=hits*critrate, instead of hits=1-misses-critrate like its done with white hits?
-> =MIN(1;(M8+WENN(instatk="bs";impBS;0)+Q7*bosscrit-(Q6-350)*0,0004))*(1-I17-I18)
3. If 1 is possitv, so Sword Spec Hits are able to proc more procs, would R11 be correct with:
-> =(1-C17-C18)*Q11*(1/(1-(1-I17-I18)*Q11))
-> first proc modeled with white missrate/dodgerate, following procs modeled with style missrate/dodgerate


I also looked over the Poison Vial formula ones more and changed it to a 3% instead of ppm. (proc dmg drops from ~17-18 dps in previous versions to ~11-12 dps)

If someone has accurate data about the thundering skyfire diamond (internal cooldown, proc rate) I could try updating this, too.


Will upload the new version as soon as I am done with the sword spec issue.

i had Romulo's vial proc today on just a 70 mob while farming today for 358 (higher than it's max) so i believe the +poison talents do apply to this trinket

Posting the German statements won't help you much in an English forum.
"WENN" is the "IF" statement in English.

That's due to styles are on a two roll system. It first has to hit to be able to crit.
So any dodge you face reduces your effective style crit rate by crit rate * (dodge rate*100).

30% crit= 0.3*5 = 1.5% crit lost [only 30% out of 95% landed swings will crit = 28.5%]
50% crit= 0.5*5 = 2.5% crit lost [only 50% out of 95% landed swings will crit = 47.5%]

not sure, i have 3 procs in 2 sec. but i don't have screen or log to check it

It is not hard to check, grab a sword, goto blasted lands, remove offhand, beat on mob till you get a double sword proc or until you have like 1000 sword procs without a double (just a random number, you could use stats to come up with a 95% or higher certainty). I did this on the PTR back when they were going to remove proc on procs but did not, and it did not take long for a double proc, but with a 5% chance on 5%, and a 2 speed weapon, it should take an average of less than 15 minutes to get a double proc.

At this point, it might be a good time to rid the sheet of some unused leveling items. An example would be remove weapons under 70dps. I also would not be surprised if latro's comes out on top of quickblade for 1s/5r cycles. When guesses were done about the power of the 2 weapons, only rough dpe measures were used, and the 1s/5r cycles have a higher dpe than what was used. Might also be a good time to ninja edit the armor down to 70->75% since that is more realistic.

As stated before, with so many changes to formulas (cut cycles, sword spec, etc) the macro approach to nextstat is needed now more than ever before as I doubt there is anyone with the knowledge/willing time able to fix that sheet up to be as accurate as it once was. The macro approach to nextstat was demonstrated with a link in post #1769 which would make the nextstat values run through the entirety of the sheet creating better values. And as long as this function is not made crucial to formulas, it should not break OO compatability except that OO users would not have access to the macro.

Also, if some people want to give me a savefile project link that will remain static (file links dont work), then I would edit the first post to create less confusion and an easier way for people to get more updated versions.

To be 95% certain that sword specs can't proc sword specs, one would need to test until 60 sword spec procs have occurred (~1200 swings total). To be 99% sure would require 90 sword spec procs (~1800 swings).

there is nothing conclusive at all about that. You could have a proc from the SS and a proc from the following hit. General rule when looking at combat log procs is that a proc could have occurred from any action in the previous 1.5ish seconds. An auto-attack only test is required to get certainty (and I do not suggest using anything faster than 1.6 speed).

Jesus I can't believe I forgot this. 2.2.5 is the first version I grabbed since patch and I completely forgot to uncheck that after putting in my gear. Used to having it off. Thanks Siq=)

I went to Blasted Lands with Spiteblade/Vindicators(2.7/2.6) and did ~40 minutes of swinging. No specials attacks. Used Blade Flurry some and Berserking some, neither of which gets either weapon below 1.6 speed, even when Dragonspine procs(1.66oh with BF).

1583 swings
78 sword spec procs

Zero even remotely back to back. I'll go do more because I know 78 procs is far from definitive. Only posting because I noticed something else. Offhand procs seem to be proccing offhand swings now. If this was already posted I just missed it. But a lot of Sword Spec swings appear to have either proc'd combat potency or Fiery Weapon, which is only on my offhand.

Sooo, yeah.

I don't know about procs, since I haven't tested enough to conclusively see *any* proc off a sword spec hit. But offhand hits appear to me to proc sword spec hits with mainhand damage ranges. I stood sideways for a half-hour and only hit Shiv with Latro's and a Paw for 21 sword spec procs. Max Shiv damage was 279, and the average sword spec hit was 393.

I have it hit higher then it's max, and I have zero poison talents. The proc is not considered a poison, which is why it hits elementals. Also, if something becomes susceptible to nature damage, I have had it hit for over 800 in SSC.

You're mutilate, I'd imagine find weakness would affect it, would it not? Not to mention you have murder as well, which would also have an effect on ogres.

Murder gives it a 339 max damage
Find weakness gives it a 365 max damage
Murder + Find weakness gives it a 371 (?) max damage.

If it were affected by poison talents you could add another 10% to the proc rate, which would make it an amazing trinket. Sadly this is not the case.

I have a few anecdotes and observations post patch. Prior to 2.1 I was combat daggers (armory: http://armory.worldofwarcraft.com/#c...scalp&n=Zandig just replace my current weapons with gladiator's shanker and shiv). Since the patch came out, a spiteblade dropped and I have since spec'd swords (although I'm considering reallocating my points to have a few more points in vile poisons and ditching a point in nerves of steel), and the changes to sword spec in concert with the changes to glancing blows is mind boggling.

On morogrim, with a feral druid, resto shaman and warrior in my group, I was sustaining about 1300 dps for several minutes prior to being graved. Offhand sword spec procs DO seem to proc offhand swings, which in turn can proc the offhand poison and combat potency, as far as I can tell. The fact that these swings can proc poisons on CP, alongside the fact that they cannot glance, puts sword spec far and away the best weapon spec in my mind, at the moment. It always seemed to me that prior to the patch, Sinister strike specs were better damage per energy, but due to itemization, dagger specs simply had better energy. Now with easily obtainable 1.5 speed fists and swords, it seems like the energy gap is smaller (or no longer there?) and the sinister strike specs will likely simply pull ahead. Of them, my gut feeling, without doing a lot of number crunching) is that sword spec is now the best weapon spec for rogues.

Incorrect, look at the damage done by your seemingly "offhand sword spec procs," they will turn out to be above the range of your offhand.

What is blaringly obvious is the type of swing. It seems while the damage dealt is always your mainhand, things liek combat potency and poison procs can trigger from sword specs, while are, if the lgoic holds, procc'd from your offhand.

I ran a Sword Spec Proc on Proc test in blasted lands:
mh: Vindicator's Brand (no mongoose)
oh: nothing
no speed up things

2564 Swings
135 Sword Spec Hits

result: no proc on procs

-> 99,9% probabillity that there are no sword spec proc on procs in 2.1

Wrong, a simple 5-10 min test will prove that all your sword spec procs are out of the damage range of the offhand.

That is unless they ninja patched this since 2.1 came live because I tested this for 30+ minutes in blasted lands not a single sword spec proc was within the damage range of my offhand. I did this on patch day.

Yeah I'd have to go back over the log(on wrong PC now) and look, but just glancing at it the ones that I thought were offhand were all pretty low. Well within the listed range for my OH damage. Nothing over 400's where as the MH ones get up into the 500-600's. But again, I wasn't even looking for that was just something I noticed looking for proc'd procs.

What Sokkou said sounds quite possibly like the explanation too. Because I was definately getting offhand weapon procs/effects from the sword spec swings.

I've meticulously watched my combat log and SCT while farming eggs and all, and I'm 90% sure of what I said.

2.2.5a
http://www.savefile.com/files/757941

added
Scroll of Strength/Agility
Hyjal/Black Temple items

removed
Juju Power/Juju Might
strength only gems

updated
Talon of the Phoenix (Offhand -> Mainhand)

changed
glancing blow damage reduction 20%->25%
Warp-Spring Coil 125 -> 250 armor reduce

fixed
Deathmantle Chestguard


ToDo:
Sword spec
TNB new procrate

Actually there are one of each..

http://www.wowhead.com/?item=32944 <- the main hand in its live status.
http://www.wowhead.com/?item=29948 <- the off hand in its pre-patch status (live stats at the bottom of the page)

Claw of the Phoenix
98 - 183 93.7dps
20 agility
28 stamina
Equip: Increases attack power by 38

1.5 speed if i recall :P

Was helping a guildie with the terrok sub bosses in skettis when I got attacked by one of the flying kaliri while idling, they got a "swoop" ability that knocks you down for ~2 seconds.



I've seen some delays on combat potency procs but this would be around 3 seconds from the previous OH hit, using Latro's as OH, around 110 MS delay, so it would seem that it's a combat potency proc from the sword specialization, too bad I didn't /combatlog to get better timestamps.

Anyone got a "double" proc with daggers?

Dual mongoose for combat daggers, yay or nay? Someone told me the enchant has been changed in the patch so that having two of them won't be as beneficial, but finding specifics or even confirmation on this has been tricky. The latest version of the sheet still favours dual mongoose so I think I'll just disregard it but thought I'd ask here just to be sure I'm not missing something obvious.