Whats currently the optimal cycle for non 2piece Nblade combat swords?
My spreadsheet appears to not work for some reason, probably the ancient version of Excel.

thanks in advance.

Edge effects. DP stack may not drop off once it's up, since that only requires 1 proc in 12 seconds, but it'll certainly build a bit slower at the start of each fight, and after each Envenom.

naxro, I noticed the same problem ages ago when I first specced mutilate. Having run through the numbers by hand it does not seem to be a bug. First, how much OH mutilate damage do you lose by changing weapon speeds?

- A base of (1.8 - 1.4) * 97.5 = 39
- * ~1.35 for critical strike chance
- * 1.5 for poisoned target bonus
- * 1.1 for find weakness

Then, depending on your spec,

- * 1.2 for opportunity
- * 0.5 or 0.75 for offhand damage

This comes to a total of 52 or 65 damage. My spreadsheet suggests one mutilate per ~6.4 seconds, giving 8-10 dps, or 6-7 after armor. The extra DP damage your offhand provides can exceed this. Although it may seem that DP never falls off with a 1.8 speed offhand, it is not uncommon. Your offhand hit rate is:

- a base of 1/1.8 = 0.55 hits per second
- * 1.3 for SnD
- * 0.85 for miss and dodge
- + 1/6.4 for mutilate

[top] 0.77 OH hits per second

For DP to fall off you would need 12 / 0.77

9 DP-misses in a row. On a +3 mob deadly poison has a 67% chance not to apply, giving an overall chance of 0.67^9 = 2.7%. This will happen every 1/37 hits, or ~30 seconds.

So, how does your OH weapon speed correspond to overall DP damage? Plugging some rough numbers into my spreadsheet gives an average DP stack count of 4.3 with the 1.8 offhand and 4.7 with the mainhand. Each DP stack does 15-18 dps depending on talents, for a dps increase of 6-7 dps.

With these rough calculations you are breaking even. Depending on the way DP is modelled and the other specifics of your gear I wouldn't be surprised to see a 1-5 dps difference.

I just got me the new arena sword, specced combat swords (19-42-0) and was wondering, what the best cycle was for it, so I thought I'd download the spreadsheet. Unfortunately http://rogue.bleedo.net seems to be offline.

I was hopeing you guys could help me then. I never played combat-swords before, so I'm quite unsure what the best cycle is, dpswise.

If you need any gear or talent information, please look @ my armory profile.

Alternatively it would be great, if someone could upload the latest version of the spreadsheet somewhere or pm me for my emailadress and mail it to me plz.

Thanks in advance.

*edit: added armory link to my profile, as i realised it wasn't created automatically from the other wow profile information.

If you managed to find this thread, why not manage to look a few pages back too?

I'd say slam your r/e(if immune to r, or r already active), then hope to get another combopoint in time.

What to waste?
1 Combotpoint worth = average finisher dmg / 5
2 seconds of energy wasted = average combogenerator dmg / (combogenerator energycost / 20)
2 seconds of without slice'n'dice = (white dps * 2)*0,3

The calculation above is missing alot of variables, but I don't think any of the variables will have any extreme impact on the results.

For me in a quick approximation (not checking exact numbers here, but I suspect others numbers w)
wasting 1 combopoint = wasting 300 dmg
wasting 2 seconds of energy = wasting 500 dmg
wasting 2 seconds of slice'n'dice = wasting 300 dmg

So anyway, from these calculations I'd say that energy is the last thing you want to spill, it's better to waste either slice'n'dice uptime or building more combopoints when already at 5.

I do personally believe that having a flexible cycle that is micromanaged is better than wasting stuff at all by trying to be too strict to a cycle. With all the stuff going on in a real fight, I have to do it anyway -- and that's one of the fun things with playing rogue imo.

3pt SnD/5pt Rupture (similarly, anything of the form Xs/Yr is Xpt SnD, Ypt Rupture; Xs/Ye is snd/evis; Xs/Ys/Z(e|r) is snd/snd/(rupture|evis), etc etc).

Check the 'Unbuffed Cycles' sheet to see the gory details.

Thank you very much, you have no idea how much effort and private messaging to the moderator of the forum it took to get this answer! Once again ty mate!

Please don't link that page. First he started off with some completely wrong math, and then he followed it up with fixes by trying to say 7% was insignificant.

I found two interesting things useing the spreadsheet, was wondering what you guys thought.

1. As combat daggers it gives me an optimal rotation of 5s/4r, even though I can easily pull off 5s/5r. I assume its because of the NB 2 piece set bonus which I read can actually be interperited incorrectly by the sheet as a waste of combo points or something like that, when in reality 5s/5r is extremely easy and I often have SnD to spare.

2. Recently I was looking at possibly grabbing the merciless gladiators shiv to replace my searing sunblade. I was suprised when I saw the spreadsheet tell me I actually lost 0.4 dps (buffed) when I did. I assume the 0.1 speed difference in the offhand allows for more combat potency procs, more WF procs and my other proc items(mongoose,DST,ect..). However I was still suprised at my finding.

So I was wondering if you guys thought these were errors in the spreadsheet (I'm almost positive #1 is) or if they really are correct.

The poster below your original post is correct in that your mod is only recording one hand of the attack.

MutilateCrit Mod however, will add both attacks together and keep track of record hits.

That doesn't sound right at all. What spreadsheet are you using? Are you putting in your talents correctly? With your gear, and Combat Daggers with a 1.4 speed offhand, only 450 dps buffed, -on paper-, is simply impossible.

This should help.

T4 4 piece bonus and Ruthlessness for combat daggers


-----------

I also saw some mention of Void Reaver and DPS a few posts up. While not direclty on-topic, I did find some helpful hints for Rogues who will be attempting this shortly with the attunement veil lifted.

1.) His "red circle" on the ground is very small, but his hit box is very large. If you're at max melee range, you only need to backstep a few yards to get out of Pound range, and you can wait until about 1s left on the timer. It's really that short of a distance between melee and out-of-pound range.

2.) Pound does arcane damage. You can use Cloak of Shadows or a Major Arcane Protection to absorb all of this. So save your Cloak until you're ready to use AR or BF and stay in for the full duration, resisting all of the Pound damage.

My guild walked in and 3-shotted VR last night, and on all 3 attempts, I was #1 on the damage output - by a larger and larger margin each attempt as I figured out these little tricks. I think we had about 30s on the Enrage timer on the kill.

Then I am reading it wrong, perhaps. Evidently doing something wrong.

I misclicked on a couple of talents and went back and fixed those, but this is what I am seeing on my screen:



and the premium cycle for me reporting that number is 3s/5s/5r

so I must be doing something wrong then if it's still only 519 and some people are reporting more than double that.

Unless the number people are looking at is this:



and reporting the lowest number - the total of 1154

Another tip for your melee on void reaver...grab a shaman and just eat the pounding. It takes approx. 2-3 chain heals to heal 4-5 melee through a pounding, and they gain about 6 seconds of DPS time per pounding.

You're looking in completely the wrong place. Redownload the file so none of your changes are in there. The only 2 pages you should be changing anything on are "Talents" and "Gear_Buffs", where you enter your gear, buffs checklist at the bottom. There's a Unbuffed DPS box and a Buffed DPS box at the top of both of those sheets, which is where you should be looking.

I just edited my post as you were posting this - I didn't realize it wasn't taking into account the other things that the second image totals as well.

This makes me feel a bit better.

I found two interesting things useing the spreadsheet, was wondering what you guys thought.

1. As combat daggers it gives me an optimal rotation of 5s/4r, even though I can easily pull off 5s/5r. I assume its because of the NB 2 piece set bonus which I read can actually be interperited incorrectly by the sheet as a waste of combo points or something like that, when in reality 5s/5r is extremely easy and I often have SnD to spare.

2. Recently I was looking at possibly grabbing the merciless gladiators shiv to replace my searing sunblade. I was suprised when I saw the spreadsheet tell me I actually lost 0.4 dps (buffed) when I did. I assume the 0.1 speed difference in the offhand allows for more combat potency procs, more WF procs and my other proc items(mongoose,DST,ect..). However I was still suprised at my finding.

So I was wondering if you guys thought these were errors in the spreadsheet (I'm almost positive #1 is) or if they really are correct.

Reposting thise so it doesnt dissapear.

Offhand attackspeed is mostly underestimated

For example: If i put Latros Shifting Longsword (1.4 - 71 DPS) in my offhand it does only 4 DPS less than Gladiators Quickblade (1.5 - 91 DPS).

I'm not sure if this is working incorrectly or if the recent updates have produced more accurate calculations but...

I had been working with the 2.2.4J version of the spreadsheet for awhile now and using a 41/20/0 build it was calculated that I would exhibit 832.90 DPS unbuffed (4cp+ cycle).

However, upon downloading and filling in the new 2.2.7F version of the spreadsheet with the same gear/talents I am now determined to yield 649.11 DPS unbuffed (4cp+ cycle), which is quite obviously a huge difference.

I have all macros enabled and the AP/Crit/HP/Etc. calculated from my gear is identical to my stats in game on both spreadsheets.

Was there some huge reconstruction of the calculations or is one of these spreadsheets entirely wrong?

Thanks in advance

read changelog plx, thx

This spreadsheet depresses me so much combat daggers falls so far behind when you give WF to Sword or Fist spec =(((
Its not even worth the bother of playing combat daggers i mean you cant farm or pvp but with a SS spam spec you can uhg

Sorry for the QQ just very irritated atm