Hunter Spreadsheets -- In development - Page 53

Greenpiggy · 01/29/08, 6:15 AM

Yep, just checked myself, seems I was stuck in the dark ages of version 39

Cheeky · 01/29/08, 9:25 AM

Originally Posted by Flyx

Could you make a list of items with procs that are not currently modeled in the spreadsheet. I find it hard to believe that Madness of the Betrayer is worse than Tsunami Talisman if the proc has been included.

Try adding the -armor debuffs to the target. For my gear with 5x Sunder Armor, Faerie Fire and Curse of Recklessness I see a 10 DPS gain in the spreadsheet switching my [Tsunami Talisman] to a [Madness of the Betrayer].

There is a section of the 'Calculations' tab for all modeled items. Please look through the model and see if you can find fault with it.

azelas · 01/29/08, 9:28 AM

With standard BM spec (41/20), are Black Bow of the Betrayer and Bristleblitz Striker better than Wolfslayer Sniper Rifle?

According to Cheeky's spreadsheet I found out that WSS still do better than those superior bows. Is it the fact or theres smth wrong with your spreadsheet? I have been arguing with some hunter for a while about these weapons.

I do understand that BM need faster weapon to fit in our Steady shot between auto shot. However, does item's tooltip DPS have more effect than weapon speed?

Thank you in advance

Shadewalk · 01/29/08, 12:17 PM

Someone brought this up a short while ago and I thought it was odd, though having just checked it seems to be true for the spreedsheet.

Originally Posted by tarsen

2) I see that Curse of shadows gives only 5% additional damage to arcane shot, is that correct? Does having it improved to 13% change anything?

CoS, rank 1 is 8%, and rank 2 and 3 and 10%, with 1,2,3 % talentable increase

Really at level 70 for a raid, it should by defualt be a 10% modifier and further talentable to increase to 13%.

Cheeky · 01/29/08, 1:35 PM

Originally Posted by azelas

With standard BM spec (41/20), are Black Bow of the Betrayer and Bristleblitz Striker better than Wolfslayer Sniper Rifle?

According to Cheeky's spreadsheet I found out that WSS still do better than those superior bows. Is it the fact or theres smth wrong with your spreadsheet? I have been arguing with some hunter for a while about these weapons.

I do understand that BM need faster weapon to fit in our Steady shot between auto shot. However, does item's tooltip DPS have more effect than weapon speed?

Thank you in advance

Dude, this issue has been addressed countless times on these forums.

Originally Posted by Shadewalk

Someone brought this up a short while ago and I thought it was odd, though having just checked it seems to be true for the spreedsheet.

CoS, rank 1 is 8%, and rank 2 and 3 and 10%, with 1,2,3 % talentable increase

Really at level 70 for a raid, it should by defualt be a 10% modifier and further talentable to increase to 13%.

I'll get that fixed. Thanks for providing the information.

Flyx · 01/30/08, 4:19 AM

Just a little thing, in the change log the date for v.40 is 22/1/2009.

And yes, I hadn't put up armour de-buffs which had made the Madness trinket seem less effective than it really is.

Ric Rodrigo · 01/30/08, 9:20 AM

Is there a box somewhere in the spreadsheet to show if you have 2-5 stacks of Ferocious Inspiration going how that will affect your DPS?

Cheeky · 01/30/08, 11:25 AM

Originally Posted by Ric Rodrigo

Is there a box somewhere in the spreadsheet to show if you have 2-5 stacks of Ferocious Inspiration going how that will affect your DPS?

Not currently. You can just multiply everything out by 6-15%.

Groznar · 01/30/08, 11:48 AM

Can you add a debuff under the Buffs tab for the 3% crit to pet and hunter from Improved Judgement of the Crusader from Retribution paladins?

bonnieparker · 01/30/08, 2:23 PM

Is there a way to remove items/gems from the spreadsheet? There's a lot of items/gems I don't need to see in the drop lists. Or, could that functionality be added to the sheet? Like a checkbox that removes all green gems from the tables or 5 man loot?

Thorongil · 01/30/08, 2:55 PM

Originally Posted by bonnieparker

Is there a way to remove items/gems from the spreadsheet? There's a lot of items/gems I don't need to see in the drop lists. Or, could that functionality be added to the sheet? Like a checkbox that removes all green gems from the tables or 5 man loot?

Don´t know if you have seen it already, but there´s a box in Settings&Results where you can select you´re favourite gems for the different slots. This helps quite a lot, since you normally don´t use a big variety of gems.

Cheeky · 01/30/08, 4:01 PM

Originally Posted by bonnieparker

Is there a way to remove items/gems from the spreadsheet?

Nope.

◊ Lactose · 01/31/08, 4:33 AM

My stats:
35.83% Crit
48 Hit Rating (~3.04% Hit)
Banshee Curse: -66% Hit
Adjusted Hit Chance: 95 + 3.04 - 66 = 32.04
Target: Level 70 (Shadowy Necromancer) - no debuffs on mob affecting Hit

In this scenario, my crit chance is almost 4% higher than my hit chance.
Using a 1-roll system, there is no way I would see anything other than MISS and CRIT on a Level 70 target.

Stripped combat log:

1/30 21:28:24.412  You are afflicted by Banshee Curse.
1/30 21:28:25.583  Your Steady Shot missed Shadowy Necromancer.
1/30 21:28:25.802  Your Auto Shot missed Shadowy Necromancer.
1/30 21:28:27.240  Your Steady Shot missed Shadowy Necromancer.
1/30 21:28:27.552  Your Auto Shot hits Shadowy Necromancer for 843.
1/30 21:28:28.833  Your Steady Shot missed Shadowy Necromancer.
1/30 21:28:30.099  Your Auto Shot missed Shadowy Necromancer.
1/30 21:28:31.068  Your Auto Shot missed Shadowy Necromancer.
1/30 21:28:31.896  Your Steady Shot missed Shadowy Necromancer.
1/30 21:28:32.365  Your Auto Shot hits Shadowy Necromancer for 827.
1/30 21:28:33.568  Your Steady Shot missed Shadowy Necromancer.
1/30 21:28:34.240  Your Auto Shot missed Shadowy Necromancer.
1/30 21:28:34.427  Your Multi-Shot hits Shadowy Necromancer for 989.

I stopped the combat log shortly after this. Banshee Curse was still on me at the time, which is why a 'Banshee Curse fades from you' message is not displayed here.

Hunter shots are 2-roll, both Auto Shots and specials.

Juggernaught · 01/31/08, 6:38 AM

2 small bugs.

[Charmed Amani Jewel] is missing

[Prowler's Strikeblade] is listed in the main and off hand weapon lists as Prowler's Strikerblade and does not get picked up from the armory as a result.

Also, I don't know how to embed the wowhead tooltips in a post. I had a quick search but couldn't find any info (was only a quick search tho as I'm at work)...

◊ Lactose · 01/31/08, 6:43 AM

The correct syntax for wowhead links is:
[item]Item name[ /item]

With the space after the [ removed.

Juggernaught · 01/31/08, 7:39 AM

Cheers. Updated post.

peterk0 · 01/31/08, 8:14 AM

Cheeky,

could you please post some info, equation maybe, how you model the [Ashtongue Talisman of Swiftness] in your spreadsheet?

ohrion · 01/31/08, 9:00 AM

Originally Posted by Lactose

Hunter shots are 2-roll, both Auto Shots and specials.

Is it possible that your target had resilience/defense (although iirc, defense also reduces chance to hit)? I would suggest testing on a variety of mobs to confirm.

Cheeky · 01/31/08, 10:38 AM

Originally Posted by peterk0

Cheeky,

could you please post some info, equation maybe, how you model the [Ashtongue Talisman of Swiftness] in your spreadsheet?

You can see everything in the calculations tab. Let me know if you have any specific questions.

Originally Posted by ohrion

Is it possible that your target had resilience/defense (although iirc, defense also reduces chance to hit)? I would suggest testing on a variety of mobs to confirm.

Very few mobs provide that level of debuff. What I'm curious about was if we are positive it is -66%.

◊ Sarutobi · 01/31/08, 10:47 AM

The Wowhead spell info (link) indicates that it is -66% as the tooltip suggests.

Cheeky · 01/31/08, 11:05 AM

Originally Posted by Sarutobi

The Wowhead spell info (link) indicates that it is -66% as the tooltip suggests.

Cool. This was nice piece of detective work Lactose. I really believe it's going to change the crit/hit weighings a bit. It also means getting hit-capped is probably the best way to improve DPS.

<10 minutes later>

My Gear/Talents/Shots, 1-roll system:

Hunter DPS	864.61
Pet DPS	        267.81
Total DPS	1132.42

Attribute	DPS	Per Item Budget	
Agility + 1	0.454	0.454	
AP + 1	        0.234	0.467	
Crit + 1	0.397	0.397	
Hit + 1	        0.411	0.411	
Int + 1	        0.000	0.000	
Armor Pen + 1	0.039	0.274	
Haste + 1	0.458	0.458

Same, 2-roll system Hunter, 1-roll system Pet:

Hunter DPS	857.73
Pet DPS	        267.81
Total DPS	1125.54

Attribute	DPS	Per Item Budget	
Agility + 1	0.447	0.447	
AP + 1	        0.232	0.464	
Crit + 1	0.388	0.388	
Hit + 1         0.576	0.576	
Int + 1	        0.000	0.000	
Armor Pen + 1	0.039	0.271	
Haste + 1	0.454	0.454

I lose 7 DPS, since I wasn't hit-capped.

Hit becomes vastly more valuable now. And this is with a base hit chance on level 73 mobs of 99.19%. And because of my miss rate, my other stats are depressed in value. I'll have a new version of the spreadsheet tonight if we don't get any evidence to contradict Lactose.

Kwellthân · 01/31/08, 11:25 AM

Keep getting 100% chance to hit when I in fact don't have it. A friend of mine has 6,6% and gets a 100% too :-/ (using the newest version 40)

◊ Lactose · 01/31/08, 11:33 AM

Change the target to a Level 73 one instead of a Level 70 one.

Kwellthân · 01/31/08, 11:47 AM

Thx helped a lot - though I liked my dps better before :-(

Gadget · 01/31/08, 12:57 PM

Why is "Demon Stalker Shouldergards" not supported? Perhaps you wanted to remove Dragonstalker instead?