Oh I wasn't implying that crits did, just that there was a second roll.... involved. Maybe I misunderstood the question earlier in the thread about whether hunter shots were based on a 1 or 2 roll system.
That question was regarding whether or not crit was on a second roll, I believe =)
Last edited by Lactose : 06/29/07 at 4:56 PM.
Reason: Added quote
Look, Lactose, we'd rather you didn't eradicate the whole human race.
- Sam & Max
As an aside, a number of these (97 to be precise) were blocked, and the blocked shots were made up of both hits and crits, which (correct me if I'm wrong) implies a 2 roll system doesnt it?
this is against dr. boom or another mob? if the latter what mob level?
Well assuming its versus doc I compiled the results for 350 and 355 for dr.boom
350: 255/6678 = 3.8185%
355: 291/8283 = 3.5132%
So far it appears to be 0.06% to hit per ranged skill point, to be updated with more results in the future?
Second set of gun (350 weapon skill data):
2975 hits - 80.3%
591 crits - 16.0%
137 misses - 3.7%
And I am officially sick of shooting Dr. Boom.
One note, this last test was one I paid more attention to, since I was interested in Santos Blessings procs. I saw 271 procs on 3566 hits, but ProcWatch doesn't count re-procs. I did witness proc's of the Blessing on back to back shots, so there is no internal cooldown at all.
ProcWatch gave a 7.6% rate, but counting re-procs I'm betting it is closer to 8%.
This means for a BM Hunter (1.96 shot cycle, 1:1 rotation) Santos blessing is up 48.5% of the time for an average benefit of +121 AP. Well worth the 900g I paid for it.
Version 21 of my spreadsheet is available. It does not include the new weapon skill to hit information we are compiling this week.
Here is a copy of the Change Log:
- Added new gear (Boots of the Crimson Hawk)
- Darkened cell boarders on gear page.
- Added hand adjustment row to Pet Buffs.
- Fixed some item values (Pulsing Amthemyst)
- Fixed haste on Custom items.
- Corrected bug in Trinket procs.
- Added second neck socket to custom tab.
- Removed Boss flag. Further testing on hit rates leads me to believe there is no difference in Boss-ness.
- Added in support for Talon of Alar and it's effect on Steady Shot, Arcane Shot, Multi Shot, and Aimed Shot.
- Added 3 gem sockets for melee weapons.
- Provide total count of gems by color on gear page.
- Allow for 3 sockets for melee weapons on Custom Gear tab.
As a note, I am going to be on vacation the next week and a half, so any updates will begin after that.
Second set of gun (350 weapon skill data):
2975 hits - 80.3%
591 crits - 16.0%
137 misses - 3.7%
And I am officially sick of shooting Dr. Boom.
One note, this last test was one I paid more attention to, since I was interested in Santos Blessings procs. I saw 271 procs on 3566 hits, but ProcWatch doesn't count re-procs. I did witness proc's of the Blessing on back to back shots, so there is no internal cooldown at all.
ProcWatch gave a 7.6% rate, but counting re-procs I'm betting it is closer to 8%.
This means for a BM Hunter (1.96 shot cycle, 1:1 rotation) Santos blessing is up 48.5% of the time for an average benefit of +121 AP. Well worth the 900g I paid for it.
with the amount of data were starting to have its heavily leaning toward 0.12% hit per weapon skill point i believe... can we accept that as a general rule yet or would we need more data to prove it?
I am using OpenOffice.org Calc for this spreadsheet and most the of the spreadsheet boxes say "Err.504".
I was wondering if anyone else uses OpenOffice.org Calc and could help me with this problem if I should be enabling an option or something to fix this.
I am using OpenOffice.org Calc for this spreadsheet and most the of the spreadsheet boxes say "Err.504".
I was wondering if anyone else uses OpenOffice.org Calc and could help me with this problem if I should be enabling an option or something to fix this.
Just noticed in Version 21 that Shifting Nightseye is counting as Red and Yellow, where Wicked Noble Topaz is counting as Red and Blue. I believe that Shifting Nightseye is Red and Blue, whereas Wicked Noble Topaz is Red and Yellow. (when it comes to the calculations at the top of the gear page)
Cheeky your spreadsheets calculations for Thrill of the Hunt do not facter in bonus crit due to Master Tactician. One thing I am looking at is comparing MT and IAotH for my gear and build. I am noticing that MT is actually better for a max special rotation (a rotation I personally hate) another thing I want to see is MTs effect on the mana returned by TotH.
On another note why is the sheet locked and password protected? Is it to force people like me to report the bugs ;-).
First I'd like to thank you for all your time you spent into these spreadsheets. I love them and use them as often as I'm trying new builds.
These days I was thinking about a good build for my pet (wanna test the scorpid poison =)).
I just found a small bug in Cheeky's spreadsheet.
The pet-skill avoidance isn't countet into the total amount of points spent.
About your tests with Don Santos at Dr. Bumm (poor guy =)).
I installed a tool to count procs as well (ProcMeter [doesn't count re-procs too]) but with a data over 10'000 shots i've got about 4.3% of procs (no re-proc-count). I'm tended to say the proc is about 5% in total.
so long
*long time user, first time poster* - Belzi
After I save my gear, make a few modifications (or even do nothing) and then hit the Load button, I get the following error:
Run-time error '1004': Application-defined or object-defined error.
When I head to debug, it breaks on this line:
cell.value = Cells(row, col).value
I watched some of the variables and this is what I get. Not knowing exactly how everything is coded, I'm not sure what it means.
row is currently = 13
col is currently = 53
cell.value = "Achieved"
cell.column = 2
Cells(Row, col).Value = "Achieved"
It seems like I forgot to adjust a name binding when I added the Weapon sockets. Fixed.
Originally Posted by Belzi.ET
The pet-skill avoidance isn't countet into the total amount of points spent.
Fixed.
Originally Posted by Xoran
Just played around somemore with the spreadsheet and noticed that the 4pc Riftstalker (T5) bonus (5% extra crit on steady shots) isn't applied!
Fixed.
Originally Posted by Seipher
Cheeky your spreadsheets calculations for Thrill of the Hunt do not facter in bonus crit due to Master Tactician.
Yes, it does. If you look on the calculations page, you'll see the value for Crit% (Cell B34) go up when you put points in Master Tactician. This same value is used in cell N27 for Thrill of the Hunt.
Version 22 is posted.
Last edited by Cheeky : 07/04/07 at 2:16 PM.
Reason: Version is actually 22.
Ah your right it is. I think what I might be seeing is some sort of error in factoring that into the Time to Mana Exhaustion. Here is what is happening for me using a simple steady/auto rotation:
w/ TotH, w/o MT: 155.89s
w/ TotH, w/ MT: 155.79s
Dince TotH returns mana on crit and MT increases crits it should increase not decrease. The recovery shown for TotH with MT is 13% and 11.75% without, so that part of the spreadsheet is working, but it isn't translating into the mana exhaustion for some reason. I should be able to go for longer with MT than without. Alternatively, If I add in 5% crit by adding a LotP buff the mana exhaustion time does go up as we would expect.
If I get rid of TotH altogether I go down (as expected) to 139.52s. So it seems to be working except when I add in the MT crit.
That is with a base crit of 29% (before MT). Strangely enough if I add in raid buffs and get up to around 40% crit I see a very small improvement from MT (changing from 226 to about 228).
Anyways this could just be something to do with rounding in the sheet. Obviously MT will not relate to much in the way of mana efficiency and either way I can still see the % change in the TotH spell detail and that looks correct.
An excellent spreadsheet though. It is incredibly detailed and accurate. I've never seen anything more useful for hunter theorycrafting before.
Ah your right it is. I think what I might be seeing is some sort of error in factoring that into the Time to Mana Exhaustion. Here is what is happening for me using a simple steady/auto rotation:
w/ TotH, w/o MT: 155.89s
w/ TotH, w/ MT: 155.79s
Dince TotH returns mana on crit and MT increases crits it should increase not decrease. The recovery shown for TotH with MT is 13% and 11.75% without, so that part of the spreadsheet is working, but it isn't translating into the mana exhaustion for some reason. I should be able to go for longer with MT than without. Alternatively, If I add in 5% crit by adding a LotP buff the mana exhaustion time does go up as we would expect.
If I get rid of TotH altogether I go down (as expected) to 139.52s. So it seems to be working except when I add in the MT crit.
That is with a base crit of 29% (before MT). Strangely enough if I add in raid buffs and get up to around 40% crit I see a very small improvement from MT (changing from 226 to about 228).
Anyways this could just be something to do with rounding in the sheet. Obviously MT will not relate to much in the way of mana efficiency and either way I can still see the % change in the TotH spell detail and that looks correct.
An excellent spreadsheet though. It is incredibly detailed and accurate. I've never seen anything more useful for hunter theorycrafting before.
I think the differences might be due to the higher usage of Kill Command based on the increased critical rate. Try using Rank 0 Kill Command (disabling it) and checking the numbers again. For certain ranges of critcial hit % the usage of KC scales better than the mana efficiency form TotH.
I'd assume this is the first you heard of this Cheeky, but your base stats for Blood Elves at level 70 are a bit off. I noticed a slit difference in agility and intellect from what I was at in game, so I stripped down to get the right numbers.
Hope that helps! Other than those small errors, the spreadsheet has been spot on and very useful.
Edit: I appear to have a small bug with my crit rating in the spreadsheet as well. The sheet accurately (minus the 3 agility error on base stats) lists my crit bonus from agility and my 201 crit rating, but is calculating my crit at 22.77%, wheras my in-game character sheet is at 23.30%.
I apologize in advance if any of this had been covered earlier, I read as much as I could of the previous pages but it's quite possible that I simply missed something. Thanks again.
I'd assume this is the first you heard of this Cheeky, but your base stats for Blood Elves at level 70 are a bit off. I noticed a slit difference in agility and intellect from what I was at in game, so I stripped down to get the right numbers.
Hope that helps! Other than those small errors, the spreadsheet has been spot on and very useful.
Edit: I appear to have a small bug with my crit rating in the spreadsheet as well. The sheet accurately (minus the 3 agility error on base stats) lists my crit bonus from agility and my 201 crit rating, but is calculating my crit at 22.77%, wheras my in-game character sheet is at 23.30%.
I apologize in advance if any of this had been covered earlier, I read as much as I could of the previous pages but it's quite possible that I simply missed something. Thanks again.
If the spreadsheet stats are too low it might be combat experience if you have it.
06/29/07, 4:56 PM
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