Hunter Spreadsheets -- In development - Page 24

Lactose · 08/22/07, 8:37 AM

Originally Posted by Hunterlin

Armory does not add arrow DPS to listed damage.

Incorrect.
Looking at his profile right now, I see:
1369 RAP, Steelhawk Crossbow (155-288, 2.80 speed, +12scope), Focused Fire buff not active

Armory lists Auto Shot damage as 544-678

37*2.8+(1369/14)*2.8+155+12 = 544.4 (minimum damage is rounded down)
37*2.8+(1369/14)*2.8+288+12 = 678.4 (maximum damage is rounded up)

Cheeky · 08/22/07, 11:09 AM

Originally Posted by Hunterlin

Armory does not add arrow DPS to listed damage.

If I remember correctly it is just Ranged Weapon Specialization's effect on armor that isn't shown on the tooltip. But they may have fixed that since pre-2.0.

Cheeky · 08/22/07, 11:11 AM

Originally Posted by Lactose

As far as I know, Hunter tests aren't complete yet, and Cheeky's waiting for more data before changing it.

I think Olgas has good data that 9% is the new cap. But the effect of weapon skill on that is still up in the air. And it seems to be no longer linear in how miss% changes based on level difference.

I can go ahead and update the miss chance calculations, I think that research is mature enough. I'm going to leave +weapon skill alone until we know more.

Levidian · 08/22/07, 1:10 PM

Originally Posted by Lactose

I'd be more concerned about what you're replacing in order to fire Serpent Sting. For Beast Master Hunters, you'll probably more often than not have better / more damaging abilitites at your disposal, while Marksman / Survival Hunters might have some time now and again to throw it up there, due to having more 'dead time' between shots.

Thats what 4/5 imp arcane shot is for.

In a pure 7/48/6 build.

onsi · 08/22/07, 5:59 PM

good work with the spreadsheet Cheeky,much appreciated if you could add Madness of the betrayer any time soon.

Ralith · 08/23/07, 12:40 AM

Originally Posted by Cheeky

Since the point of the spreadsheet is sustained DPS, I work out Hunter's mark as a maxed value of +440 AP. That's a fair bit of damage for most weapons, +88 for a 2.8s weapon.

Please look through the calculations tab, I really try to spell out each part of the calculation in mind-numbing detail. You may find a bug in it. I'll use my own values real quickly to illustrate Auto Shot:

[Don Santos' Famous Hunting Rifle] - 199 average damage.
[Felbane Slugs] for a 2.7s weapon - 99.9 damage
2454.62 "Effective RAP" (Gear, Aspect of Hawk, Hunter's Mark, Santos' proc, averaged trinkets) for a 2.7s weapon - 472.39 damage

Shot damage before modifiers - 772.29
Critical Hit chance - 24.92% for 236.9% damage
Hit chance - 98.7%
Effective, average gain from Hit/Crit - 132.82%
Focused Fire - 102%
Average Ferocious Inspiration effect - 102.95%
Total Adjustment (multiplicative) - 139.48%

Total Average Auto shot damage - 1077.19 (paper doll average of 682)

Ah ok... thanks! I didn't understand how the calculations tab worked exactly, so it just adds all the items together... that makes more sense then!

khel · 08/23/07, 5:27 AM

Cheeky! Great work! I love your spreadsheet

When you have some time, do you think you could work in a few more things? The main thing that I see now is that there is no option for 1:0.5 rotations. I only see options for 1:1.5 (max specials), 1:1, and autoshotting. To maximize dps when haste effects bring your weapon speed below 1.7 though, you can fire a special between every other autoshot.

I think that this is a pretty big deal when considering how worthwhile the DST is to BM specs.

Eventually it would be nice to see a third tab for rotation adjustments during Thundering Skyfire procs, but with 3 passive procs I doubt that many people could handle managing shifting rotations so well. It would still be interesting though and a bit useful.

edit: Sorry this whole time I didn't realize that I could manually create my own rotation

Ato · 08/23/07, 5:45 AM

How do you use the buttons on the Shot Rotation tab? >_>

I click them but nothing happens. The ones like, 'Reset', 'Steady Rotation', 'PriorityRotation', etc.

LokE · 08/23/07, 6:02 AM

Im using Excel 2007, and macros was turned off by default in mine. When i open the spreadsheet i got a warning bar with a settings button on, clicking this would allow me to temporarily enable the macros, if i didn't click the button the bar would eventually dissapper after some time.

Cheeky · 08/23/07, 9:44 AM

Originally Posted by khel

Eventually it would be nice to see a third tab for rotation adjustments during Thundering Skyfire procs, but with 3 passive procs I doubt that many people could handle managing shifting rotations so well. It would still be interesting though and a bit useful.

It becomes very unwieldy to start handling multiple, simultaneous haste effects. That's why it took me so long to get the [Dragonspine Trophy] modeled with Quick Shots. If I added another one there would be 8 different shot rotations, which I find beyond ridiculous.

Right now I'm ok with leaving the [Thundering Skyfire Diamond] out.

Xenoborg · 08/23/07, 11:53 AM

I cant seem to find a good database of what kind of armor bosses have. I use 10k right now just because I think that gives a good approximation to what I actually do in raids. What do you guys use?

Reipin Pillage · 08/23/07, 12:11 PM

Quickstrider Moccasins have their Hit Rating points in the wrong slot. In your spreadsheet they are giving 15mp5 as opposed to 15 HR. Sorry if this has been mentioned.

Ailee · 08/23/07, 12:11 PM

It really depends on the boss. Example, though lower bosses, Aran doesn't have anywhere near the armor of Prince. I'd say try anywhere in the 20-30% reduction range on average for most bosses.

Cheeky · 08/23/07, 12:24 PM

Originally Posted by Xenoborg

I cant seem to find a good database of what kind of armor bosses have. I use 10k right now just because I think that gives a good approximation to what I actually do in raids. What do you guys use?

It different per boss, as Ailee said, and it also is effected by Sunder Armor and Fairy Fire. I haven't a clue what to put in there, so I leave it completely user configurable.

Lactose · 08/23/07, 1:05 PM

Once my ISP is fixed (making me able to raid), I'll do some testing on armor mitigation for bosses.

Norek · 08/23/07, 3:44 PM

Hi there cheeky, new to this whole spread sheet thing honestly, I ran a search for this post trying to find what I wanted to know without to much luck.

Basically from what I read this doesnt work all to great with open office, unfortunately thats the best I can get atm =p From what I gather in the postings I cant set the drop downs for the gems to gems only because of some Open Office shanangins, thats fine, but when I got into the drop down list it only shows maybe a total of 5 gems, which kinda hurts when trying to see valid stats.

If I could get a bit of help with getting this to "work" with open office thated be great, if you already have info posted about this some place else I'm sorry I missed it and will gladly read it if directed to it. Sorry for the block of text =p

Cheeky · 08/23/07, 4:00 PM

Originally Posted by Norek

Hi there cheeky, new to this whole spread sheet thing honestly, I ran a search for this post trying to find what I wanted to know without to much luck.

Basically from what I read this doesnt work all to great with open office, unfortunately thats the best I can get atm =p From what I gather in the postings I cant set the drop downs for the gems to gems only because of some Open Office shanangins, thats fine, but when I got into the drop down list it only shows maybe a total of 5 gems, which kinda hurts when trying to see valid stats.

If I could get a bit of help with getting this to "work" with open office thated be great, if you already have info posted about this some place else I'm sorry I missed it and will gladly read it if directed to it. Sorry for the block of text =p

This was posted a little previous in the thread:

Originally Posted by Cheeky

Since the Gem locations are unprotected, you can modify the Validity for the cells yourself. Select all the gem cells simultaneously and change the Validation to be =Gems (default will be =INDIRECT(xxx) - different for each cell). You should be fine doing that.

So are you saying you did that and it still doesn't show you all the gems? If so, I don't know what to tell you. I can't test every version of Open Office, and since I have Excel I take advantage of its features as much as possible to simplify development.

Lactose · 08/23/07, 8:24 PM

Right, couldn't find any armor formula with a quick search, so only percentages (should be correct to the closest 0.5%).
Sadly, only 3 minor bosses right now.

Pathaleon the Calculator (Heroic): 36.0% armor mitigation
Julianne: With 5x Sunder Armor and Faerie Fire (Feral) -- 21.5% armor mitigation
Romulo: With 5x Sunder Armor and Faerie Fire (Feral) -- 29.5% armor mitigation

KayossZero · 08/23/07, 10:43 PM

Originally Posted by Norek

Hi there cheeky, new to this whole spread sheet thing honestly, I ran a search for this post trying to find what I wanted to know without to much luck.

Basically from what I read this doesnt work all to great with open office, unfortunately thats the best I can get atm =p From what I gather in the postings I cant set the drop downs for the gems to gems only because of some Open Office shanangins, thats fine, but when I got into the drop down list it only shows maybe a total of 5 gems, which kinda hurts when trying to see valid stats.

If I could get a bit of help with getting this to "work" with open office thated be great, if you already have info posted about this some place else I'm sorry I missed it and will gladly read it if directed to it. Sorry for the block of text =p

Originally Posted by Glaurong

The Novell edition of Open Office has support for using/porting VBA.

You can get it at http://download.novell.com

This is what I'm using thanks to Glaurong's tip.

khel · 08/24/07, 8:31 AM

Originally Posted by Lactose

Right, couldn't find any armor formula with a quick search, so only percentages (should be correct to the closest 0.5%).
Sadly, only 3 minor bosses right now.

Pathaleon the Calculator (Heroic): 36.0% armor mitigation
Julianne: With 5x Sunder Armor and Faerie Fire (Feral) -- 21.5% armor mitigation
Romulo: With 5x Sunder Armor and Faerie Fire (Feral) -- 29.5% armor mitigation

This is great. Boss armor absorption plays such a big role in determining what our dps is, and it's useful for other physical dpsers as well.

I will try to take a WWS of our next SSC raid and see if I can help a bit. It would be a small sample-size for each boss, but reverse-engineering 700-800 shots per boss should give a reasonable estimate.

Lactose · 08/24/07, 8:40 AM

That won't be needed. The way I'm doing it I only need 1 non-crit to get the armor mitigation, and it'll be accurate to within 0.5% (inaccuracies due to rounding).
I just need my ISP to fix stuff, and values should be coming pretty fast.

Zedd · 08/24/07, 8:44 AM

Hello Cheeky.
I have been using your spreadsheet for a long time now and I have to thank your for doing an awsome job with it.
Now I have a question, I have "Shard-Bound Bracers" but I can not find them in the spreadsheet, as far as I know I have the latest version.
The item is linked here: Shard-bound Bracers - Items - World of Warcraft

Thank you,

Cheeky · 08/24/07, 10:44 AM

Originally Posted by Lactose

That won't be needed. The way I'm doing it I only need 1 non-crit to get the armor mitigation, and it'll be accurate to within 0.5% (inaccuracies due to rounding).
I just need my ISP to fix stuff, and values should be coming pretty fast.

Using a weapon with 0 damage range?

Originally Posted by Zedd

Hello Cheeky.
I have been using your spreadsheet for a long time now and I have to thank your for doing an awsome job with it.
Now I have a question, I have "Shard-Bound Bracers" but I can not find them in the spreadsheet, as far as I know I have the latest version.
The item is linked here: Shard-bound Bracers - Items - World of Warcraft

Thank you,

I'll make sure it is in. In the future if people can use the item tags for gear that's incorrect/missing ([Shard-Bound Bracers]) it helps, thanks!

Amrasellion · 08/24/07, 1:48 PM

Hey, really nice shreadsheet

Was testing some shot rotations, but then noticed that the mana costs displayed on the spreadsheet does not match the ones in game. I made sure i didnt have efficiency on and checked that i was using the right rank in the Settings tab, but they still didnt match.
Arcane Shot is displayed as 200 mana at rank 9 without efficiency, while in game its 230 mana,
Multishot is displayed as 239 mana, but is in game 273 mana,
Aimed Shot is displayed as 321 mana but should be 370 mana,
Steady Shot is displayed as 96 mana but should be 110 mana,
Scatter Shot is displayed as 169 mana, while its 6% of base mana which is 185 mana at lvl 70,
Silencing Shot is the same as Scatter Shot,
Rapid Fire is displayed as costing 0 mana, while it ingame costs 100 mana,
Beast Within is displayed as 325 mana but is according to the talent tab ingame 338 mana.

Would be rly cool if u can update this (or point out if ive made some nubmistake in settings that makes the mana costs display as less than they are :p )

edit: doh, forgot to remove Thrill of the Hunt (which was what reduced the mana cost). So seems like they are all accurate

except Beast Within and Rapid Fire.

Cheeky · 08/24/07, 1:50 PM

Originally Posted by Amrasellion

Hey, really nice shreadsheet

Was testing some shot rotations, but then noticed that the mana costs displayed on the spreadsheet does not match the ones in game. I made sure i didnt have efficiency on and checked that i was using the right rank in the Settings tab, but they still didnt match.
Arcane Shot is displayed as 200 mana at rank 9 without efficiency, while in game its 230 mana,
Multishot is displayed as 239 mana, but is in game 273 mana,
Aimed Shot is displayed as 321 mana but should be 370 mana,
Steady Shot is displayed as 96 mana but should be 110 mana,
Scatter Shot is displayed as 169 mana, while its 6% of base mana which is 185 mana at lvl 70,
Silencing Shot is the same as Scatter Shot,
Rapid Fire is displayed as costing 0 mana, while it ingame costs 100 mana,
Beast Within is displayed as 325 mana but is according to the talent tab ingame 338 mana.

Would be rly cool if u can update this (or point out if ive made some nubmistake in settings that makes the mana costs display as less than they are :p )

Did you have Thrill of the Hunt specified? I average that out (shouldn't apply to Beast Within or Rapid Shot though....)