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Old 03/28/07, 11:12 AM   #16
CheshireCat
Bald Bull
 
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Blood Elf Priest
 
Mal'Ganis
I'm considering switching over to WWS, but I'm curious-- how well does the timelining function on it work? Can you log the whole night and pull out specific attempts after parsing? Or do you need to /combatlog, fight, /combatlog, rename/move the file, /combatlog again, fight again, etc?

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Old 03/28/07, 11:15 AM   #17
Valoran
Piston Honda
 
Human Rogue
 
Shadowsong (EU)
Originally Posted by CheshireCat View Post
I'm considering switching over to WWS, but I'm curious-- how well does the timelining function on it work? Can you log the whole night and pull out specific attempts after parsing? Or do you need to /combatlog, fight, /combatlog, rename/move the file, /combatlog again, fight again, etc?
From my experience with WWS, yes, that's basically what you need to do. Although, my last experience was version 1.3a, there have probably been leaps and bounds made since.

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Old 03/28/07, 11:16 AM   #18
Suesse
Don Flamenco
 
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Human Death Knight
 
Llane
Originally Posted by Valoran View Post
For example, SW_stats still has issues with hunter pets (pets in general, really) and hunter autoshots, counting a hunters damage as Munter did x damage and Munter' s Autoshot did y damage, rather than adding the two. This is just one of many examples of parsing mistakes.
I believe that bug was fixed months ago. Perhaps someone in your raid/party is still using the old version, contaminating your data.

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Old 03/29/07, 6:36 PM   #19
lossendil
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Tauren Hunter
 
Eldre'Thalas (EU)
Originally Posted by CheshireCat View Post
I'm considering switching over to WWS, but I'm curious-- how well does the timelining function on it work? Can you log the whole night and pull out specific attempts after parsing? Or do you need to /combatlog, fight, /combatlog, rename/move the file, /combatlog again, fight again, etc?
Hi, I'm currently developing the server version of WWS, that allows to split the combatlog, either manually, or automatically. Here are some examples : hover on the Split menu at the top for automatic splitting or go to the timeline for manual splitting :

http://www.lossendil.com/wws/?report=6nzghpjpwpfxk
http://www.lossendil.com/wws/?report=f4farjfxbphd1
http://www.lossendil.com/wws/?report=hob4xxk21em4g

There are also some new features. For example, the "death replay", that allow to view the 30 seconds of the log before a player death with only his actions or damage taken.

http://www.lossendil.com/wws/?report...m4g&a=28&dth=1

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Old 03/30/07, 3:37 AM   #20
djor
Von Kaiser
 
Tauren Priest
 
Kazzak (EU)
Originally Posted by lossendil View Post
There are also some new features. For example, the "death replay", that allow to view the 30 seconds of the log before a player death with only his actions or damage taken.
I'd kill for an addon that would let me do this ingame. I even tried writing one that would let me pick out specific events and pcs/npcs and display the combatlog for them - that did not end well.

http://ctprofiles.net/2861210

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Old 03/30/07, 5:04 AM   #21
• Chicken
Mod
 
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Gnome Monk
 
Azjol-Nerub (EU)
Originally Posted by RK View Post
"Pet damage" bugs also includes warlocks enslaving somethign and then being awarded all the damage one by mobs of that name
I can remember the same happening with Mind Control during one ZG run in which I was, uh, checking out mob abilities. It ended with pretty much all MCable mobs getting their damage and healing attributed to my Priest.

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Old 03/30/07, 7:30 AM   #22
CasT
Piston Honda
 
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Night Elf Druid
 
Outland (EU)
Originally Posted by Pane View Post
I often hear people lament when confronted with their (so-so) dps after a raid that 'those meters are inaccurate'. So I made it my mission to have the best dmg meter out there to catch out the slackers ;-)

So what is the accepted 'gold-standard' dps meter? I use Recap atm, but is there something better/more accurate?
It's very obvious to me that damagemeters all in all are slightly inaccurate. This is based on one single AV game with recap/ damagemeter and SW running all three gave different results and none where the same as the score board of the game.

Closest was SW stats.


But do remember that there is much more to this game than beeing to notch DPS. I firmly belive the pushing to much attention to the Damage meter will end up in ppl pulling aggro and forgetting their shackel/ sheep WE just to be no.1 healer/dpser


To really say who is slacking and who is not you need more to look at what abilities they use and how they react to the dynamics of the game. At least thats how we do it in PVP. Put a warlock in WSG midfield and he will easily win damage done. Try to compare him to a hunter who's guarding in the flag. and only will fight the occasional rogue/ druid who'll get by.

Summary: I value more the ability to act/react than Gear and 1337-DPS

Do not matter how much you play, you will never get the carrot.

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Old 03/30/07, 11:50 AM   #23
Quasar
Don Flamenco
 
Draenei Shaman
 
Dragonmaw
Originally Posted by Renaldo View Post
If you're looking to catch slackers, it doesn't really matter what damage meter you use. Either way, the players with the lowest damage/healing done are the slackers.
Not necessarily, but in a general sense yes.

Personally I use Recap, having tried SW Stats and DamageMeters. I like Recap's UI by far, and I like how it breaks down damage information with all the little details (averages, crits, % breakdowns by spells, etc).

JUICE! Aww I'm sorry. Did... did anyone want some juice?

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Old 03/30/07, 5:06 PM   #24
Pane
Piston Honda
 
Blood Elf Paladin
 
Al'Akir (EU)
Originally Posted by CasT View Post
But do remember that there is much more to this game than beeing to notch DPS. I firmly belive the pushing to much attention to the Damage meter will end up in ppl pulling aggro and forgetting their shackel/ sheep WE just to be no.1 healer/dpser
Well obviously. But at the same time, with smaller raids, people have to pull their weight. You can't drag along a 300 dps rogue anymore, or something like that. Pulling agro or forgetting crowd control are obvious no-goes, and infinitely more visible.

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Old 04/02/07, 8:26 AM   #25
CasT
Piston Honda
 
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Night Elf Druid
 
Outland (EU)
Originally Posted by Pane View Post
Well obviously. But at the same time, with smaller raids, people have to pull their weight. You can't drag along a 300 dps rogue anymore, or something like that. Pulling agro or forgetting crowd control are obvious no-goes, and infinitely more visible.

If you ar hunting 300 dps rogues they can not blame it on a damagemeter, well maybe if the poster is ranged and player is melee, but syncronization changed all that and the in accuracy is more down to the %.

But do keep in mind that healing is now not going to be usefull since both Prayer of Mending and Lifebloom counts as the targets heal and not the caster.

Do not matter how much you play, you will never get the carrot.

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Old 04/05/07, 9:48 AM   #26
Christmas
Piston Honda
 
Murloc Warlock
 
Defias Brotherhood (EU)
I use Recap for infight things and WoW Web Stats for post-raid analysis. Lossendil's work on the WWS server is absolutely fantastic.

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Old 04/05/07, 9:55 AM   #27
Durza
Von Kaiser
 
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Undead Death Knight
 
Doomhammer (EU)
Have to agree with Christmas, absolutely in love with WWS and the new beta server since last week. Great job Lossendil!

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Old 04/11/07, 6:12 AM   #28
Elsia
Banned
 
Night Elf Hunter
 
Earthen Ring (EU)
I know this is probably too hard if not in many cases impossible, but having a damage meter that actually amortizes utility would be neat. What I mean by that is that if one class provides a damage buff to another class, the damage increase is attributed to the buffing class, not the damage dealing class.

For example some buff gives you 3% extra damage. That 3% should be attributed to the buffer, not the damage dealer.

This way one could see more clearly synergies and effects of group setup and overall raid composition.

I can see that it's hard to give actual utility for percentage chance increases, as it's chance, so one can't just factor out 3% crit increase trivially though doing so would be very good ballpark. Also for some abilities I'm not sure if it's detectable who procced a certain buff (say shadow weaving or expose weakness when multiple shadow priests or surv hunters are present).

Anyway, this would give a clearer picture of class and raid composition contribution to raid DPS than individual DPS as we have it now... seeing both would be very helpful I think.

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Old 04/11/07, 6:22 AM   #29
aya
Von Kaiser
 
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Blood Elf Death Knight
 
Bloodhoof (EU)
Originally Posted by Elsia View Post
For example some buff gives you 3% extra damage. That 3% should be attributed to the buffer, not the damage dealer.

This way one could see more clearly synergies and effects of group setup and overall raid composition.
While I can see occasional use of such tables every now and then, I think it's called synenergy because it takes two to dance tango. A part of a given rogus DPS might be derived from a warriors battleshout, that doesn't mean the battleshout alone would do the DPS even if the rogue wasn't there.

Taking the idea further, I think it would be interesting to see statistics which only showed DPS from buffs!
"Windfury did this and this much for our group in this fight",
"This and this much was gained from keeping TSA on", and so on.

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Old 04/11/07, 6:37 AM   #30
Elsia
Banned
 
Night Elf Hunter
 
Earthen Ring (EU)
Well that's pretty much what I'm saying.

I think it'd be very valuable to learn where the DPS levels come from, because as you say it takes two to dance. Current damage meters show only one.

The reason why individualized reattribution would be neat is because you'd learn more about group composition. So shammy X was in group 2 and shammy Y was in group 3. Damage contributions were different and you can look at the group makeup to learn a whole lot from it.

I think about this like I think about recap, an analytical tool to understand the situation better. For a hunter at least cast bars are more important to gauge and improve your DPS performance than a damage meter I found. But I know that damage meters have a pride factor, but that doesn't have much to do with understanding the situation of the fight.

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