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Old 07/06/07, 8:33 AM   #1151
Nemaa
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As I know Hyjal does not have a boss that needs any threat modules, they don't wipe, reduce or modify aggro at all.
About Black Temple, I THINK Supremus clears his threat list at the end of every phase 2, I can't remember the sentence he yells. Gurtogg Bloodboil has the insignificance and fel rage debuffs mentioned before. I don't know the bosses after him.

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Old 07/06/07, 9:52 AM   #1152
♦ Praetorian
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Gurtogg also does Eject, but I have no clue what the magnitude of this deaggro is. It'd be wonderful to be able to model it, though.

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Old 07/06/07, 2:14 PM   #1153
 sadris
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Could you please add support for 2p T6 bonus for Thunderheart (druids)?

"+15% threat to Mangle in Bear Form only."

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Old 07/06/07, 2:53 PM   #1154
Antiarc
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Originally Posted by Cromfel View Post
As Paladin I have my Judgement of command triggering -150 threat modifier instead of the -1000 modifier, even as the attack is using spell hit and is spell damage. Same with SoC procs, where the proc is spell damage but triggers the -150 threat modifier (As it should). Did I misunderstand your post, that it isnt showing correctly in Omen according to your description?
Hm. Judgments should trigger the -1000, but SoC should trigger the -150?

The way I do it right now is "if the crit was physical damage, subtract 150. If it was magical (as in, it had a magic school), then subtract 1000." If that's giving incorrect results, I'll need to tweak it a bit.

Originally Posted by songster View Post
Surely neither of those is correct? Doesn't invisibility tick something like 10%, 10%, 10%, 10%, 60% over the course of 5 seconds, for a total of 100%?
ThreatLib handles mage threat as follows:

Tick 1: Threat * 90 / 100
Tick 2: Threat * 80 / 90
Tick 3: Threat * 70 / 80
Tick 4: Threat * 60 / 70
Tick 5: 0

If you start out with 100 threat, then the ticks are as follows:

90, (90 * 80 / 90) = 80, (80 * 70) / 80 = 70, etc, resulting in a 10% reduction for four ticks, then a full reduction on the last tick.
Originally Posted by Nemaa View Post
This is in, as mentioned, but this is not in:
One people gets a debuff called "Fel Rage" and he/she is the target of Bloodboil at phase2. The one who has fel rage gains extra damage and healing powers and does not produce threat as well, because after fel rage ends Bloodboil goes for the main tanks even the fel raged person exceeds their threat level.
If Fel Rage is a "fixate" ability (ie, the mob is "taunted" onto them but there's no extra inherent threat) then I generally don't model those in ThreatLib, since they don't actually affect threat levels; only aggro.

If the debuff causes the player to generate zero threat, then I need to add that. Is this in fact the case?

Originally Posted by dukes View Post
Does Threat include the Feral Druid 2t6 bonus for 15% more threat from mangle? I've just looked through both KTM and Threat (slow day at work) and KTM definitely doesn't have it as it spells out each and every set bonus that it includes, while all I can find in Threat is a generic string to check for if there are any threat modifiers from set bonuses. Will this work for it?
It doesn't have it; I'll add it in today.

Edit: It's added.

Edit again: It's in right now as a multiplicative bonus - that is, Mangle becomes (damage * 1.495). Should it be additive (damage * (1.3 + 0.15 = 1.45)) ?

Originally Posted by Praetorian View Post
Gurtogg also does Eject, but I have no clue what the magnitude of this deaggro is. It'd be wonderful to be able to model it, though.
Can you elaborate on this ability?

Last edited by Antiarc : 07/06/07 at 3:08 PM.

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Old 07/06/07, 3:31 PM   #1155
Thezilch
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Originally Posted by Praetorian View Post
Gurtogg also does Eject, but I have no clue what the magnitude of this deaggro is. It'd be wonderful to be able to model it, though.
25% deaggro (75% multiplier). We publish the spell/multiplier to KTM, and it works like a charm. Same event (mechanic) as Knock Away on Onyxia / VR (no effect when avoided).

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Old 07/06/07, 3:34 PM   #1156
Antiarc
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Is it a damage ability, like Knock Away?

Edit: Is the full ability name "Eject"? A combat log or screenshot would be best here.

Last edited by Antiarc : 07/06/07 at 3:40 PM.

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Old 07/06/07, 3:38 PM   #1157
Thezilch
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Originally Posted by Antiarc View Post
Is it a damage ability, like Knock Away?
Correct.

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Old 07/06/07, 3:40 PM   #1158
divulse
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Originally Posted by Antiarc View Post
Was your threat level excessively high, or only the TPS?

What would you have estimated your true TPS to be?
Sorry for the late reply, was on vacation. My threat was excessively high, easily double the tanks. With a scorch spam, blessing of salv and -10% threat talent, my actual threat should have been around 460ish TPS. In order to have my threat at the levels reported, I would have had to be pumping around 1500-1800 tps, roughly. At around 85% of phase one Prince M, my threat was easily 180% of the tanks, but I didn't catch the actual TPS at the time. Once I invis'd out, everything started reporting correctly.

My high threat was read by everyone in the raid, KTM and Omen users alike.

Next time I'll get a screen shot, sorry I didn't have the presence of mind to think of that in the first place.

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Old 07/06/07, 3:41 PM   #1159
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No problem; I'll see if I can figure out what's going on there.

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Old 07/06/07, 3:43 PM   #1160
♦ Praetorian
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Originally Posted by Thezilch View Post
25% deaggro (75% multiplier). We publish the spell/multiplier to KTM, and it works like a charm. Same event (mechanic) as Knock Away on Onyxia / VR (no effect when avoided).
Ah nice, thanks very much.

Antiarc, here's a log excerpt:

7/2 23:44:39.721 Gurtogg Bloodboil's Eject hits Paches for 855.

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Old 07/06/07, 3:46 PM   #1161
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I've added a Bloodboil module to handle Eject with a 0.75 multiplier. Needs non-enUS translations for "Eject" though.

Edit: You can override the multiplier with:
/run AceLibrary("Threat-1.0"):SetNPCModuleValue("EjectMultiplier", 0.8)
Where the second parameter is the multiplier. Requires officer status to override.

(I really need to add a UI to that function)

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Old 07/06/07, 5:04 PM   #1162
Nemaa
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Originally Posted by Antiarc View Post
If Fel Rage is a "fixate" ability (ie, the mob is "taunted" onto them but there's no extra inherent threat) then I generally don't model those in ThreatLib, since they don't actually affect threat levels; only aggro.

If the debuff causes the player to generate zero threat, then I need to add that. Is this in fact the case?
The thing I explained before happened 3 times so I'm can say confidently Fel Rage is the same as Insignificance, at least threat-wise.

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Old 07/06/07, 6:52 PM   #1163
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Originally Posted by Antiarc View Post
Edit again: It's in right now as a multiplicative bonus - that is, Mangle becomes (damage * 1.495). Should it be additive (damage * (1.3 + 0.15 = 1.45)) ?
I actually have no idea at all. Will try and get some testing done later!

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Old 07/06/07, 6:53 PM   #1164
Cromfel
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Originally Posted by Antiarc View Post
Hm. Judgments should trigger the -1000, but SoC should trigger the -150?

The way I do it right now is "if the crit was physical damage, subtract 150. If it was magical (as in, it had a magic school), then subtract 1000." If that's giving incorrect results, I'll need to tweak it a bit.
I did some testing. I will do more when I find someone to help me (Forgot to /combatlog for exact dmg values).

Edit: See below (Removed to prevent confusion)

Last edited by Cromfel : 07/06/07 at 9:32 PM.

.:. Retribution Paladin Hideout .:. http://cromfel.battlefield.fi/

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Old 07/06/07, 7:10 PM   #1165
Nemaa
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Supremus resets aggro every time he emotes this:
"Supremus punches the ground in anger!"
This is the transition from p2->p1

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Old 07/06/07, 7:27 PM   #1166
Cromfel
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I did another agro flipper test with Prism of Inner Calm, and here is complete combatlog from the fight with agro swaps and WWS report from each phase before agro changes.

http://cromfel.battlefield.fi/wow/Omen_POIC_WWS.rar

I will try to fetch what I can from it. But It may be easier for you to evaluate the trinket behavior.

Phase 1:
Elrath does 5 451 and Timangi starts to attack, while Elrath stops attacking.
Timangi does 6 088 damage, and gains agro with last attack of 227 damage.
- Statistic of Phase
2 crits with Judgement of Command (900 average)
2 crits with Melee (358 average)

Phase 2:
Timangi total damage to Servant 6257
Elrath does 2 033 damage, and gains agro with last attack of 79 damage.

Phase 3:
Elrath have now done 9591 damage to servant.
Timangi starts to attack and gains agro after doing 3 853 more damage
Timangi total damage to gain agro 10110 with last attack of 169
- Statistic of Phase
2 crits with Melee (367 average)

Phase 4:
Timangi deals additional 6 490 damage to Servant, reaching total of 16600
Elrath starts to attack Servant and gains agro after 8 851 damage with last attack of 114 damage
Elrath total damage now 18442
- Statistic of Phase
4 crits with Melee (390 average)
1 crit with Judgement of Command (1009)
1 crit with Seal of Command (483) (Notice low damage due attacking with fists)

Total damages and crits:
Timangi 16600 damage
8 melee crits
3 JoC crits
1 SoC crit

Elrath 18442 damage
______________________

Doesnt it seem that the damn trinket isnt working at all?

Last edited by Cromfel : 07/06/07 at 8:39 PM.

.:. Retribution Paladin Hideout .:. http://cromfel.battlefield.fi/

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Old 07/06/07, 8:00 PM   #1167
Nemaa
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We encountered a little bug when someone changed from ktm to omen in our raid. He deleted the ktm folder in his interface/addons directory and installed omen. He relogged to wow and configured omen, everything worked fine for him. His name still had an * after his name on his threat bar.

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Old 07/06/07, 8:20 PM   #1168
Cromfel
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Oh crap, now that I started to think about it, shouldnt it go like this:

Phase 1:
Elrath does 5 451 and Timangi starts to attack, while Elrath stops attacking.
Timangi does 6 088 damage, and gains agro with last attack of 227 damage.
- Statistic of Phase
2 crits with Judgement of Command (900 average)
2 crits with Melee (358 average)

Elrath was at 5996.1 threat as hes 110% agro gain limit.
Timangi pulls agro after 6 088 damage, but have done 4 critical attacks
Agro limit should have been at 6688 threat?

(Both players are Paladins)

From this test it seems that Prism of Inner Calm agro reduction is not aplied? Im not that familiar with agro and threat mechanism of WoW, could anyone please tell if this was correct result of the test?

.:. Retribution Paladin Hideout .:. http://cromfel.battlefield.fi/

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Old 07/06/07, 8:29 PM   #1169
warpandas
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Originally Posted by Antiarc View Post
If Fel Rage is a "fixate" ability (ie, the mob is "taunted" onto them but there's no extra inherent threat) then I generally don't model those in ThreatLib, since they don't actually affect threat levels; only aggro.

If the debuff causes the player to generate zero threat, then I need to add that. Is this in fact the case?
Fel Rage causes the player to generate zero threat. So does the Buff/Debuff called Insignificance. It is applied to the whole raid in phase 2 even on the person with Fel Rage in phase 2 so threat is pretty much at a paused state here.

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Old 07/06/07, 8:40 PM   #1170
Antiarc
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It does appear that the trinket's -threat is not applying, Cromfel. 5451 * 1.1 = 5996, which is right in between 5861 and 6088. It might be a Blizzard bug, or the trinket might just not apply like we think it does.

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Old 07/06/07, 8:43 PM   #1171
Antiarc
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Originally Posted by warpandas View Post
Fel Rage causes the player to generate zero threat. So does the Buff/Debuff called Insignificance. It is applied to the whole raid in phase 2 even on the person with Fel Rage in phase 2 so threat is pretty much at a paused state here.
If the player has Insignifigance at the same time as Fel Rage, then we can just ignore Fel Rage for threat purposes, since Insignifigance already multiplies generated threat by 0.

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Old 07/06/07, 8:45 PM   #1172
Cromfel
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Originally Posted by Antiarc View Post
It does appear that the trinket's -threat is not applying, Cromfel. 5451 * 1.1 = 5996, which is right in between 5861 and 6088. It might be a Blizzard bug, or the trinket might just not apply like we think it does.
I had to double check that I really had the trinket equiped during the test, and yes I had it on. It isnt working at all.

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Old 07/06/07, 9:01 PM   #1173
Nemaa
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Originally Posted by Antiarc View Post
If the player has Insignifigance at the same time as Fel Rage, then we can just ignore Fel Rage for threat purposes, since Insignifigance already multiplies generated threat by 0.
The one who gets Fel Rage does not get Insignificance as well. Also Insignificance can be resisted, Fel Rage cannot be resisted.

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Old 07/06/07, 9:42 PM   #1174
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Heh, okay. I'll just add another handler for Fel Rage.

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Old 07/06/07, 9:56 PM   #1175
♦ Praetorian
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How do you KNOW that Fel Rage causes the target to generate no threat?

Why would there not be any indication if it were an effect?

Fel Rage does this:
1) http://thottbot.com/s40604
2) http://thottbot.com/s40616
3) http://thottbot.com/s41625

Insignificance very clearly modified threat generation: http://thottbot.com/s40618

Fel Rage does not. It would be unusual for a buff to have a hidden effect like this. Now, an attack on the other hand....

When Fel Rage is in effect, Gurtogg does not use the same Eject ability that he does normally (http://thottbot.com/s40486 ). Instead, he uses this version: http://thottbot.com/s40597 , which leaves a lingering stun debuff, but, being an ability, is a much more likely candidate for having a hidden threat modifier.

What if his Fel Rage Eject is a full deaggro, or a larger deaggro? He always does one Eject during Fel Rage, no more, and no less.

Can anyone prove to me that the Fel Rage player generates 0 threat while Rage'd, as opposed to generating normal threat, but then having a massive deaggro applied via Eject?

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