Scrub - Raidmember talent scanner (was TalentShow) - Page 3

Caligula · 12/17/07, 11:33 AM

Originally Posted by Lazare

Here's a stab for priests:

Holy:
- Red Flags:
-- [<5] Divine Fury (2,5)
-- [>0] Blessed Recover (2,7)
-- [<3] Improved Healing (2,10)
-- [>0] Improved Healing (2,11)
-- [<1] Spirit of Redemption (2,13)
-- [<5] Spiritual Guidance (2,14)
-- [>0] Surge of Light (2,15)
-- [<5] Spiritual Healing (2,16)
-- [>0] Blessed Resilience (2,19)
-- [<3] Empowered Healing (2,20)
-- [<1] Inner Focus (1,8)
-- [<3] Meditation (1,9)

-- [>5] Deeper than T1 in shadow tree (3,3+)
-- [>23] Deeper than Imp DS in disc tree (1,16+)

-If < 39 points in Holy then red flag:
-- [<1] Divine Spirit (1,14)
-- [<2] Improved Divine Spirit (1,15)

-If > 38 points in Holy then red flag:
-- [<5] Empowered Healing (2,20)

-If >40 points in Holy then red flag:
-- [<1] Circle of Healing

- Yellow Flags:
-- [<2] Healing Focus (2,1)
-- [<3] Improved Renew (2,2)
-- [<3] Inspiration (2,8)
-- [<3] Holy Concentration (2,17)
-- [<2] Improved Power Word: Fortitude (1,4)

Shadow:
- Red Flags:
-- [<3] Shadow Affinity (3,3) 
-- [<2] Improved Shadow Word: Pain (3,4)
-- [<1] Mind Flay (3,8)
-- [<1] Mind Flay (3,8)
-- [>0] Improved Fade (3,9)
-- [<3] Shadow Weaving (3,11)
-- [<1] Vampiric Embrace (3,13)
-- [<3] Focused Mind (3,15)
-- [>0] Shadow Resilience (3,16)
-- [<5] Darkness (3,17)
-- [<1] Shadowform (3,18)
-- [<5] Misery (3,20)
-- [<1] Vampiric Touch (3,21)

If Silence (3,12) is NOT taken then:
-- [>0] Improved Psychic Scream (3,6)

-- [>14] Deeper than Meditation and Inner Focus in disc tree (1,10+)
-- [>0] Points in holy tree (2,1+)

- Yellow Flags:
-- [<2] Improved Power Word: Fortitude (1,4)
-- [<1] Inner Focus (1,9)
-- [<3] Meditation (1,9)
-- [<2] Shadow Reach (3,10)
-- [>0] Silence (3,12)
-- [<5] Shadow Power (3,19)

Discipline:
- Red Flags
-- Being discipline spec.  :)

Some of the red flag stuff could be yellow flags, arguably. I think that's close, unless I made any errors...

Should weed out any obvious retardation or pvp builds, but isn't too strict.

One point I'm not sure of is I suggested yellow flagging Silence. It is a pvp talent, but it's not completely without pve utility, and you don't gimp yourself too badly taking it. I think a yellow flag would be about right, but some might disagree.

I also ignored the Shadow Focus, since the proper number of points is gear dependent. If you allow the addon to count up hit rating, then checking to make sure that they have an appropriate number of points in Shadow Focus would be very nice - although many priests swap in hit gear just for boss fights, so...probably not feasible.

You could say that anything less than 3/5 Shadow Focus would get a yellow flag. I think at that point you either don't understand the value of +hit, you're sacrificing damage for hit on your gear, or lastly (least likely scenario) you have over 120+ hit rating on your full damage set. That either means you have access to a wide variety of gear or the RNG has blessed you a lot of gear with hit rating on it and none of the gear without.

Basically what it comes down to is, if you have less than 3/5 SF you either know exactly what you're doing or you don't have any idea what you're doing.

Gearknight · 12/17/07, 11:57 AM

Originally Posted by Enova

Well, since nobody seems to know how talents are supposed to work for hunters, I wrapped up a few flags for you. Of course it is just my opinion, so I don't want to impose it into your add-on. However, it's a hunter's thoughts on hunter specs, at least give it a look. Anybody has other opinions, by all means, I live to learn

Beast Mastery (<=30 points)

RED: IF NO 2/2 Focused Fire
RED: =>1/3 Improved Aspect of the Monkey
RED: =>1/2 Pathfinding
RED: IF NO 5/5 Ferocity FOR points in Beast Mastery =>20
YELLOW: =>1/2 Spirit Bond
RED: IF NO 5/5 Frenzy FOR points in Beast Mastery =>30

Beast Mastery (>30 points)

RED: IF NO Intimidation
RED: <1/2 Animal Handler IF 3/3 Ferocious Inspiration
RED: IF NO 2/2 Animal Handler FOR points in Beast Mastery >31 AND <3/3 Ferocious Inspiration
RED: IF NO 5/5 Serpent's Swiftness FOR points in Beast Mastery >35 (No shit, that's why you go Beast Mastery for...)
RED: IF NO Bestial Wrath FOR points in Beast Mastery >30
RED: IF NO The Beast Within FOR points in Beast Mastery >40 (actually, i was thinking to remove the FOR points... requirement... you spend 30+ in BM, get this)

Marksmanship (<=30 points)

RED: IF NO 5/5 Lethal Shots (currently, every raid build should have this; flag red by default  regardless of points in Marksmanship perhaps)
RED: IF NO 5/5 Mortal Shots (currently, every raid build should have this; flag red by default, IF spec is not x/20+/x perhaps)
RED: IF NO Aimed shot (required for Mortal Shots)
YELLOW: =>1/5 Improved stings FOR <=20 points in Marksmanship
RED: => 1/5 Concussive Barrage (Major fail, even in a PVP build; This should have a /gkick flag on)
RED: IF NO 5/5 Ranged Weapon Specialization FOR =>30 points in Marksmanship
YELLOW: IF NO 5/5 Efficiency OR NO 5/5 Hunter's Mark (NO 5/5 tier 2 talents; better stack on one instead of going half way on both or getting improved concussive shot)
RED: => 1/5 Improved Concussive Shot (Definite No-No)
YELLOW: IF NO 2/2 Go for the throat AND NO 2/2 Rapid Killing. (Not that bad as a full MM; have someone check it out for 41/20/0 or 0/20/41)

Marksmanship (>30 points)

YELLOW: NO Trueshot Aura (it may be weak, but no reason not to take it)
RED: IF NO 5/5 Master Marksman FOR points in Marksman >35
RED: IF NO 3/3 Careful Aim FOR points in Marksmanship >30 (You'll get intellect on your gear, that's for sure - use it wisely)

Not sure about this, but
YELLOW: IF NO 2/2 Combat Experience


Survival (<=30 points)

RED: => 1/2 Savage Strikes (Definite No-No)
RED: => 1/3 Improved Wing Clip (PVE IS NOT PVP)
YELLOW: 1/1 Deterrence
RED: 1/1 Counterattack
YELLOW: > 1/2 Trap Mastery (Don't argue; you can't trap raid bosses; 2/2 is overkill for everything else)
RED: IF NO 3/3 Killer Instinct FOR points in Survival >20
YELLOW: NO 2/2 Survival Instincts FOR points in Survival >23
RED: IF NO 5/5 Lightning Reflexes FOR points in Survival =>30
RED: => 1/5 Deflection
RED: IF NO 3/3 Surefooted FOR points in Survival >15 (You spend 15 points in survival, that means you're either stopping there or going full survival. Surefooted is wort all 18 points)
RED: IF 1/3 OR 2/3 Hawk Eye. (It's a bloody first tier. Either 3/3 or nothing. Major idiot check)

Survival (>30 points)

RED: < 2/3 Expose Weakness
YELLOW: IF NO 3/3 Expose Weakness FOR points in survival >35 AND NO Readiness
RED: IF NO 3/3 Thrill of the Hunt FOR points in Survival >35
RED: IF Scatter Shot AND NO Readiness.

A few comments on these hunter flags (in general, I think you're being too strict):

BM:
4/5 Frenzy with 2/2 Animal Handler should be OK
Spirit Bond isn't so terrible, some people may prefer it over Imp Mend
No point red flagging for lacking intimidation, it's a pvp talent (I'd yellow flag for lacking TBW)

MM:
Same thing with aimed shot, it doesn't need its own flag, the flag should be on Mortal Shots
Careful Aim won't be on a 0/31/30 build, so that flag should say for >=34 in MM, not >30
I wouldn't attach any flag to combat experience (except definately flag for combat experience but incomplete Ranged Weapon Specialization)

SV:
After Slaying and Hawk Eye, 1 point needs to be spent somewhere to access the 3rd tier and the only talents available are PvP ones, so don't flag for just 1 point in Savage Strikes, Entrapment, or Imp Wing Clip (and lots of hybrid pvp/pve builds will take more, and maybe even skip monster slaying, so only yellow flag)
Same thing for deterrence and counterattack, they may be in hydrid pvp/pve builds, yellow flag at most
I believe a 2nd point in trap mastery helps lower resists on mobs with frost resistance or other increased trap resistance, like the spell shades in Kara (I've never actually tested this though). Yellow flag at most.
3/3 Thrill of the hunt shouldn't be required - take my build for example.

I'd also add a red flag for having none of these things: 5/5 Serpent Swiftness, Trueshot Aura, or at least 2/3 Expose Weakness. Without any of those, your hunter essentially doesn't have a useful tree.

Also: the easiest and most useful implementation of this information would be as a 4th page added into BigBrother, because they share the same sort of purpose in my mind (making sure your raid is prepared)

Unaz · 12/17/07, 12:07 PM

Originally Posted by Kalman

Actually, given that I have no desire to write talent scanners for 9 classes, please do continue to discuss what is a common set of requirements.

Well, as an alternative (and since I plan on using it myself), I codified the list I posted before of what I look for, so if anyone is interested: http://www.underhanded.org/wow/Shaman.lua

I changed the format a bit to make it more readable to me for quick editing, and haven't had a chance to test it in game yet, but it should work. I'll fix any errors otherwise tonight.

Edit: Edited to allow for concussion-> ele warding in elemental in a resto build. I still think it's an inefficient use of points, but if enough people like the spec, then whatever.

Kalaghan · 12/17/07, 12:10 PM

Okay, thought I'd take a crack at healing (i.e. resto or dreamstate) druid builds. Sorry if there's any glaring errors. This is my first post on EJ so constructive criticism is more than welcome.

First off, use >=27 points in resto as you're identifier for a healer (DS requires 33 points into balance, I don't believe theres any reason for more than that and you certainly don't need points in feral). I'm trying to write these flags to allow for a DS build because even though it's not really valid endgame (imo), initially you can make an argument for it since it does facilitate higher HPS in 5-mans and people may still be gearing up via heroics and unable to heal them otherwise. Due to scaling, and raid composition (i.e. other people direct heal better in 25-mans), it really doesn't have a place beyond Kara if you ask me. That's a whole other topic.

If >23 points in balance (i.e. you don't have treeform so you should be DS)
Red Flag:
Moonglow < 3/3
Lunar Guidance < 3/3
Nature's Grace < 1/1
Naturalist < 5/5
Improved Regrowth > 0/5 (DS spec has no reason to be casting inefficient regrowth; HT for direct heals & rejuv/LB for HoTs)
Furor > 0/5 (only affects feral forms)
Omen of Clarity > 0/1 (healers shouldn't be doing melee in a raid)
Natural Shapeshifter > 0/3 (you don't have treeform so any form you do have is not healing related)
Dreamstate > 0/3 & Intensity < 3/3
If (Tranq. Spirit + Gift of Nature + Empowered Touch + Nature's Swiftness + Subtelty) < 15 points (maybe there's a better way to term that, but I can't think of it offhand...essentially your last 18 points should be spread among those talents, and there's only room for debate regarding the distribution)

Yellow Flag:
Subtlety < 2/5
Nature's Swiftness < 1/1
Empowered Touch < 2/2
Imp. MotW < 5/5 (Yes, only 1 person in the raid needs this. The alternative is furor, which has no PvE benefit for a raiding healer. Further, as noted I think DS is only viable in early raiding aka mostly Kara, which means the odds of more than 1 healing druid being present are slim. So you should have it.)
If Intensity > 0/3 and Nature's Swiftness < 1/1

I don't have much experience (read: any) with Dreamstate healing, but this seems about right to me. Gift of Nature, Subtlety, Nature's Swiftness/Intensity and Empowered Touch are all useful talents in a build focusing on healing touch. You have to fall 3 points short of maxing them all out (unless you don't take DS). Personally, I think you might argue no Nature's Swiftness = Red, but I'm trying to be lenient here and some people might argue you shouldn't depend on a 3-min cooldown spell (as noted by Goedel, for any realistic stat composition you will get more mp5 from Intensity than DS so it's a red flag). Also, unlike with a pure tree build, you're able to use all 61 points to maximize healing effectiveness (whereas a tree build receives minimal benefit beyond 42 points invested).

For a pure resto build, check Balance < 23 points
Red Flag:
Nature's Swiftness < 1/1
Improved Rejuvenation < 3/3
Swiftmend < 1/1
Tree of Life < 1/1 (I debated this as a yellow flag, but decided based on my own experience and feedback there was no justification for not putting the extra point in here)

Yellow Flag:
Living Spirit < 3/3
Subtletly < 5/5
Imp. MotW < 5/5 (more likely someone else has it, but it certainly warrants a second look to make sure someone does and they're not just slacking)
Improved Regrowth < 5/5 (less is a minor issue. There's no alternative that really helps your healing particularly as a tree healer. However, the benefit is small enough I can forgive someone for going say 2/5 in a pure HoT build and getting Nature's Reach for PvP.)

• Slake · 12/17/07, 12:27 PM

A few quick warlock notes:

Affliction
Red: Any points in (1, 3) Improved Curse of Weakness
Yellow: >=42 points in tree without 5/5 (1, 13) Shadow Embrace
Red: >=21 points in tree without (1, 14) Siphon Life
Yellow: >=25 points in tree without 5/5 in (1, 16) Shadow Mastery
Red: >=31 points in tree without (1, 18) Dark Pact
Yellow: >=38 points in tree without (1, 20) Malediction
Yellow: >=41 points in tree without (1, 21) Unstable Affliction

Demonology
Red: Any points in (2, 5) Improved Voidwalker
Red: Any points in (2, 7) Improved Succubus
Yellow: >=13 points in tree without 3/3 (2, 10) Demonic Aegis
Red: Any points in (2, 12) Unholy Power without (2, 22) Summon Felguard
Red: Any points in (2, 13) Improved Enslave Demon
Red: Any points in (2, 15) Master Conjurer
Yellow: >1 point in (2, 16) Mana Feed
Red: >=30 points in tree without 5/5 (2, 17) Master Demonologist
Red: Any points in (2, 18) Demonic Resilience
Yellow: >=31 points in tree without (2, 19) Soul Link
Red: >=41 points in tree without (2, 22) Summon Felguard

Destruction
Red: >=5 points in tree without 5/5 (3, 1) Improved Shadow Bolt
Red: >=10 points in tree without 5/5 (3, 3) Bane
Red: Any points in (3, 4) Aftermath
Red: Any points in (3, 5) Improved Firebolt
Red: Any points in (3, 6) Improved Lash of Pain
Yellow: >=11 points in tree without (3, 8) Shadowburn
Yellow: >1 point in (3, 11) Improved Searing Pain
Red: Any points in (3, 12) Pyroclasm
Red: >=21 points in tree without (3, 14) Ruin
Red: >=40 points in tree without 5/5 (3, 20) Shadow and Flame
Yellow: Any points in (3, 21) Shadowfury

Also, haven't had a chance to play with it yet but does the mod give a reason for the red or yellow flag? I'll look through the code later but something like a simple test harness that takes in a {test function, flag description} double and gets either a "green", "yellow", or "red" result from the test function would be good. Very modular, and when you mouseover the yellow or red flagged name in the UI list it could show you a tooltip with the (appropriately colored) reasons that the talent spec was flagged, based on the tests it failed.

Unaz · 12/17/07, 1:00 PM

Originally Posted by Slake

Also, haven't had a chance to play with it yet but does the mod give a reason for the red or yellow flag?

No it doesn't currently, but I imagine you could modify the return values to be indicative of the reason fairly easily. Right now it's more of a "Hey this guy did something majorly wrong and shouldn't be raiding" or "There's something that doesn't smell right here, you should take a look". The reasons would probably be helpful to save time though.

• Slake · 12/17/07, 1:31 PM

Yeah I'm messing around with the source at work right now, it looks like it would require a bit of work to implement the unit-test like structure I talked about above but I guess I'll see how it looks afterwards.

Kalman · 12/17/07, 1:33 PM

It would also require some modification to the display method, since the display method is basically two large fontstrings, not individual per-player fontstrings as would be required for mouseover tooltips to be meaningful.

If you want to take that project on, you have my blessing. :p

• Slake · 12/17/07, 1:49 PM

Heh, well I'll start drycoding the changes I'm thinking about, we'll see how it goes when I get home and can actually test stuff. If it works, it'll be really pretty from a code standpoint!

Gearknight · 12/17/07, 2:14 PM

A good feature to go along with the "Which healthstones do we have?" monitor would be a concise display of who's got Improved Mark of the Wild, Improved Hunter's Mark, etc, so that you can make sure you have it in your raid and tell those people to apply it.

giansm · 12/17/07, 2:52 PM

Originally Posted by Kalaghan

First off, use >27 points in resto as you're identifier for a healer [...]

If >20 points in balance (i.e. you don't have treeform so you should be DS)
Red Flag:
Moonglow < 3/3
Lunar Guidance < 3/3
Nature's Grace < 1/1
Dreamstate < 3/3
Naturalist < 5/5
If (Tranq. Spirit + Gift of Nature + Empowered Touch + Intensity + Nature's Swiftness) < 13 points (maybe there's a better way to term that, but I can't think of it offhand...essentially your last 13 points should be spread among those talents, and there's only room for debate regarding the distribution)

Yellow Flag:
Subtlety < 2/5
Nature's Swiftness < 1/1
Empowered Touch < 2/2
Imp. MotW < 5/5 (Yes, only 1 person in the raid needs this. The alternative is furor, which has no PvE benefit for a raiding healer. Further, as noted I think DS is only viable in early raiding aka mostly Kara, which means the odds of more than 1 healing druid being present are slim. So you should have it.)

I don't have much experience (read: any) with Dreamstate healing, but this seems about right to me. Gift of Nature, Subtlety, Nature's Swiftness/Intensity and Empowered Touch are all useful talents in a build focusing on healing touch. You have to fall 3 points short of maxing them all out. Personally, I think you might argue no Nature's Swiftness = Red, but I'm trying to be lenient here and some people might argue you shouldn't depend on a 3-min cooldown spell (likewise you could argue with Dreamstate you don't need the mp5 from intensity...personally, that's crazy talk).

The combo Balance/Restoration healing build should probably be identified by >= 27 points in resto and not > 27, since some people get moonkin form for a total of 34/0/27. I don't think any serious DPS build will have this many points in Restoration. This won't catch some of the truly off-the-wall builds I've seen (people trying to heal as 36/0/25 with IFF and DS) but at that point it can be difficult to distinguish bad Balance/Restoration healing builds from bad Balance DPS builds. There are also more Restoration-heavy Balance/Resto builds, for example the 23/0/38 build which has Moonglow, and is a HT-based build that picks up more HoT power from Restoration by dropping Dreamstate in Balance. The best solution is probably just to make Balance/Restoration healing builds identified by Restoration points at >=27 and Balance points at >= 23 (I believe they all get Moonglow, which requires 23).

Originally Posted by Kalaghan

For a pure resto build, check Resto > 30 points
Red Flag:
Nature's Swiftness < 1/1
Improved Rejuvenation < 3/3
Gift of Nature < 5/5
Swiftmend < 1/1
Empowered Rejuvenation < 5/5

Yellow Flag:
Living Spirit < 3/3
Subtletly < 5/5
Imp. MotW < 5/5 (more likely someone else has it, but it certainly warrants a second look to make sure someone does and they're not just slacking)
Tree of Life < 1/1 (I debated this as a red flag, but my understanding is in full T6 a pure resto druid can stack straight + heal and still virtually never encounter mana problems. This would make ToL optional at high gear levels.)
Improved Regrowth < 5/5 (less is a minor issue. There's no alternative that really helps your healing particularly as a tree healer. However, the benefit is small enough I can forgive someone for going say 2/5 in a pure HoT build and getting Nature's Reach for PvP.)

Identifying the pure restoration build by > 30 points should be ok, alternatively it can be >= 27 in Restoration but < 23 in Balance to match the criteria for Balance/Restoration. This also means that the general criterion for a druid healing build would be Restoration points >= 27, which sounds fine to me. Most of the red/yellow flags listed here are fine and this looks like a complete list. The one thing I would change is that Tree of Life < 1/1 should be a red flag since unless I'm horribly mistaken, it is not optional even at high gear levels. Staying in tree form is worth at least 100 mp5 and often more, I don't think there are many people out there that stack +heal and still have enough regen to lose that bonus.

So the way to identify a healing build should probably be just Restoration >= 27, and use the pure-resto flag set if Balance < 23 and the Balance/Resto healing flag set if Balance >= 23. If Restoration < 27 then use the Balance DPS flag set, since it's not a healing build.

Kalaghan · 12/17/07, 3:17 PM

Originally Posted by giansm

The combo Balance/Restoration healing build should probably be identified by >= 27 points in resto and not > 27, since some people get moonkin form for a total of 34/0/27. I don't think any serious DPS build will have this many points in Restoration....

Just wanted to say all good points and I agree 100%. I should have looked at that resto >= 27 and come up with a consistent single indicator of a healing build. It certainly makes things easier. As for the tree form being a red flag - well, in my experience it should absolutely be required but I could swear I've read some respected guides out there that indicate it may not be a necessity at higher gear levels. I'm certainly open to move on this one though, because as noted, the benefits you get from that single extra talent point are utterly huge. I'm perfectly happy to go with the consensus on this one. I'd note for efficiency, if you do move tree form to the red flag list, then you can remove 5/5 empowered rejuvenation since it's a pre-requisite to Tree of Life.

Rosvall · 12/17/07, 3:27 PM

Originally Posted by koaschten

Just a note, if you plan to import it to the WoWAce Repository, you might have to think of another name, there is already a Talent-Checking Lib, named that way.

As for Rogue stuff.

red - any Blade Twisting
red - Riposte
yellow - Deadened Nerves

I'd like to add;

Assassination

Red - Murder (If 41+ combat and 5 sub)
Red - Improved Evicerate (If 41+ combat and 5 sub)
Red - Imp Expose Armor (If 41+ combat and 5 sub)
Red - Remorsless attacks

Subtlety

Red - Master of Deception (If 41+ combat)
Yellow - Master of Deception (If 41+ assassination)
Red - More than 5 points in sub if 41+ combat)
Yellow - More than 5 points in sub if 41+ assassination)

Kalman · 12/17/07, 3:53 PM

oh god I need more sleep.

Goedel · 12/17/07, 4:06 PM

Re: Kalaghan's suggestions for druid healing
-----
For the Dreamstate-type builds, shouldn't < 3/3 Intensity be a red flag? The point isn't that this talent is necessary for mana regen but that if one is taking mana regen talents it should come first. I may be making mistakes in calculating the equivalence, but even allowing what feel like generous estimates of int vs. spi gearing at the levels where this approach might be reasonable, it seems that each point in Intensity contributes more mana regeneration (after the change to Intensity) than each point in Dremstate. Have I done something horribly wrong there?

< 5/5 Gift of Nature needn't be flagged if < 1/1 Swiftmend is flagged, since the former is a prerequisite to the latter.

• Slake · 12/17/07, 4:55 PM

Well, the drycoding is mostly done, hopefully I don't spend too long picking through it later for bugs. As an example of the more modular unit-test like checks I was talking about, my above affliction checks would go into code in the warlock.lua file like so:

Originally Posted by Slake

Affliction
Red: Any points in (1, 3) Improved Curse of Weakness
Yellow: >=42 points in tree without 5/5 (1, 13) Shadow Embrace
Red: >=21 points in tree without (1, 14) Siphon Life
Yellow: >=25 points in tree without 5/5 in (1, 16) Shadow Mastery
Red: >=31 points in tree without (1, 18) Dark Pact
Yellow: >=38 points in tree without (1, 20) Malediction
Yellow: >=41 points in tree without (1, 21) Unstable Affliction

-- Affliction
addCheck("Improved Curse of Weakness",  RED,    function (talents) return talents:rank(1, 3) > 0; end);
addCheck("Shadow Embrace",              YELLOW, function (talents) return (talents:spent(1) >= 42) and (talents:rank(1, 13) < 5); end);
addCheck("Siphon Life",                 RED,    function (talents) return (talents:spent(1) >= 21) and (talents:rank(1, 14) < 1); end);
addCheck("Shadow Mastery",              YELLOW, function (talents) return (talents:spent(1) >= 25) and (talents:rank(1, 16) < 5); end);
addCheck("Dark Pact",                   RED,    function (talents) return (talents:spent(1) >= 31) and (talents:rank(1, 18) < 1); end);
addCheck("Malediction",                 YELLOW, function (talents) return (talents:spent(1) >= 38) and (talents:rank(1, 20) < 3); end);
addCheck("Unstable Affliction",         YELLOW, function (talents) return (talents:spent(1) >= 41) and (talents:rank(1, 21) < 1); end);

Sayessa · 12/17/07, 5:21 PM

Originally Posted by Kalroth

Personally I don't think -120 attack power matches +10% damage on all 1H hits, even if you're going for mitigation/survival. The additional threat from 1HWS is pretty big once you get a decent 1H weapon, especially since the 10% extra damage is added to Heroic Strike and Devastate too.

I'm not a big fan of 8/10/43 builds, but I suppose you could do something like Wowhead - Warrior 8/10/43 if you wanted to focus on mitigation/survival.

Last time I checked, 1HWS affected Shield Slam, so thats pretty huge, but I don't know if that is still the case.

Kalaghan · 12/17/07, 5:29 PM

Originally Posted by Goedel

Re: Kalaghan's suggestions for druid healing
-----
For the Dreamstate-type builds, shouldn't < 3/3 Intensity be a red flag? The point isn't that this talent is necessary for mana regen but that if one is taking mana regen talents it should come first. I may be making mistakes in calculating the equivalence, but even allowing what feel like generous estimates of int vs. spi gearing at the levels where this approach might be reasonable, it seems that each point in Intensity contributes more mana regeneration (after the change to Intensity) than each point in Dreamstate. Have I done something horribly wrong there?

I'll use my own armory stats as an example. I'm at work and currently partially raid buffed (relevant buffs are MotW, AI & golden fishsticks), but it should at least indicate whether there's room for debate. I have int = 513 and spirit = 505.
10% x 513 = 51.3mp5
(505 spirit /4.5 + 15) x 0.3 = 38.2mp2
Edit: 38.2mp2 *5/2 = 95.5mp5 (edited because I completely forgot in my calc that the spirit formula is per tick)

So ya, you're absolutely right Goedel. Even accounting for the fact that I'm geared to favor spirit, there's no way a druid should take Dreamstate before Intensity. I've adjusted my original post to account for this.

Originally Posted by Goedel

< 5/5 Gift of Nature needn't be flagged if < 1/1 Swiftmend is flagged, since the former is a prerequisite to the latter.

Good catch, absolutely.

Vonwen · 12/17/07, 6:39 PM

No bug to report actually, good job, a very useful addon. It's just missing a fubar plugin at the moment.

Keline · 12/17/07, 7:26 PM

Originally Posted by Chicken

Some more thinking in the Pally direction:

Holy:

Divine Strength - Yellow Flag, unless there's 41 points in Ret.
Pure of Heart - Red Flag if there's any points in it.
Light's Grace - If there's at least 30 points in Holy, Red Flag if this isn't 3/3.
.

What the hell is wrong with Pure of Heart?
While my spec should raise at least 3 red flags, there's no reason to blacklist the talent completly.

giansm · 12/17/07, 7:46 PM

Originally Posted by Kalaghan

(505 spirit /4.5 + 15) x 0.3 = 38.2mp5

The ( Spirit / 4.5 + 15 ) formula is per tick, which happen every two seconds, and so it's actually:

(505 spirit / 4.5 + 15 ) / 2 * 5 * 0.3 = 94.5 mp5

• Slake · 12/17/07, 8:20 PM

Well, the drycoding -mostly- worked, here's what I've got so far: Scrub.zip - FileFront.com

Most of the changes are in the code structure, but the UI is slightly enhanced; names are colored by severity (green = no problem, yellow = questionable talents, red = wtf), and have a spec icon next to them. When you hover over someone's name, a tooltip gives you their name/class, talent spec and breakdown by tree, and a list of the tests that caused them to show yellow or red (if any).

So far only the warlock tests are filled out, it would be super helpful if people could fill in other class files and post the relevant section here for me to include... otherwise I'll probably get around to copying some of the stuff earlier in the thread down eventually.

Edit: the "similar threads" box amuses me.

hugh1130 · 12/17/07, 9:38 PM

Originally Posted by Keline

What the hell is wrong with Pure of Heart?
While my spec should raise at least 3 red flags, there's no reason to blacklist the talent completly.

Agreed, pure of heart is an acceptable filler talent, and the only time to ever red flag the talent is if your are 41/20 because then you are missing out on PvE talents for it.

• Slake · 12/17/07, 11:23 PM

Those of you who have posted talent checks, if you could please either edit or repost your checks keeping in mind that it is no longer just a one-off yellow or red flag? I.E. it is possible to be much more descriptive, and while obvious ones like "no MS" or "any points in wand spec" are still applicable you can be more subtle and do checks such as "any points in unholy power without the felguard talent". I believe Manly has a check similar to this already about AM.

Anyway, working on coding some of the checks already laid out in the thread, but if you guys want to make more descriptive ones checking for overall specs or pvp talents or whatever, please do. The more complete you are, the better the mod will be.

Nite_Moogle · 12/18/07, 12:45 AM

It'd be great if this worked in 5-man groups as well as raids. An icon to the left of the user might be more intuitive than recoloring their name, as yellow = rogue and that can be confusing. Are you planning to add a way for scrub to display the information that flags the user as having a silly spec?