WoWAce to close its doors (sort of) - Page 5

Margot · 08/21/08, 10:07 AM

It somewhat clarifies things, I just hope the curse client does disembedded properly, because I suppose the libraries will not available on wowinterface etc, only in a repository and unreleased?

Ammo · 08/21/08, 11:31 AM

Disembedding is discouraged greatly. If you want to go through the effort of disembedding you will probably have to do lots of manual actions.

It's causing more issues than it solves.

Mokhtar · 08/21/08, 11:47 AM

Originally Posted by Ammo

Disembedding is discouraged greatly. If you want to go through the effort of disembedding you will probably have to do lots of manual actions.

It's causing more issues than it solves.

Such as ?
I've not had a problem with disembedding neither as a developper nor as an avid addon user... It may be a dead horse so feel free to direct me toward existing resources for your answer

funkydude · 08/21/08, 11:57 AM

Originally Posted by Mokhtar

Such as ?
I've not had a problem with disembedding neither as a developper nor as an avid addon user... It may be a dead horse so feel free to direct me toward existing resources for your answer

Too many new users coming on wowace and posting errors that are simply missing libraries, I blame this mainly on WAU.

Mokhtar · 08/21/08, 12:03 PM

Originally Posted by funkydude

Too many new users coming on wowace and posting errors that are simply missing libraries, I blame this mainly on WAU.

OK so it's not a problem of disembedded per se (from a performance / philosophy standpoint) but the way people use it brainlessly.

Margot · 08/21/08, 2:49 PM

So essentially, if we want to run disembedded, we will probably need SVN accounts and to be using an svn client. That seems like a dumb idea on the part of Curse.

Mokhtar · 08/21/08, 3:15 PM

Not sure about that but I guess we should also edit the embeds.xml

Tallage · 08/21/08, 4:11 PM

Originally Posted by Margot

So essentially, if we want to run disembedded, we will probably need SVN accounts and to be using an svn client. That seems like a dumb idea on the part of Curse.

Using an SVN client just to disembed for performance would defeat the object somewhat. The performance you gain from disembedding would happen in your loading screen when you log into WoW for the first time. Using SVN on Windows will deposit hidden .svn folders with a good dozen of base files within. When you start your client WoW.exe will spend extra time just to read all these files.

Disembedding does not actually increase your FPS or decrease your latency.

The only real reason for disembedding, realistically, is to profile addons properly. Unless you have FPS/lag issues, disembedding is really not needed.

dinesh · 08/21/08, 6:16 PM

Not that I expect this is widespread, but it is also useful for those of us who make occasional local modifications to shared libraries, since we don't have to guess/figure out which embedded copy is actually getting loaded.

funkydude · 08/21/08, 6:32 PM

Originally Posted by dinesh

Not that I expect this is widespread, but it is also useful for those of us who make occasional local modifications to shared libraries, since we don't have to guess/figure out which embedded copy is actually getting loaded.

In such a case you just increment the library's specific revision number to something stupidly high.

Maeltne · 08/21/08, 11:03 PM

Well I tried to move to curse in anticipation of this, and all I have to say is that ... curse has a *LONG* way to go...

Margot · 08/22/08, 1:29 PM

Originally Posted by Tallage

Using an SVN client just to disembed for performance would defeat the object somewhat. The performance you gain from disembedding would happen in your loading screen when you log into WoW for the first time. Using SVN on Windows will deposit hidden .svn folders with a good dozen of base files within. When you start your client WoW.exe will spend extra time just to read all these files.

Disembedding does not actually increase your FPS or decrease your latency.

The only real reason for disembedding, realistically, is to profile addons properly. Unless you have FPS/lag issues, disembedding is really not needed.

I never said a single word about performance. I just like being informed about what I have installed, and the dependencies, etc. This is somewhat of a hassle to track down with embedded, and it's just a convenience & control issue for me. Figuring out what addon or lib is the problem is also a lot easier with disembedded.

Essentially - I understand that the primary motivation for packing things with libraries is so that users don't mess things up. But for a competent user, the primary motivation for disembedding things is so that when authors mess things up, I can track it down and correct it within a few minutes.

hsifgnik · 08/23/08, 6:23 AM

Speaking of reverse engineering, here's some code that connects to their servers that can:
- pull the entire addon list
- pull changes for a list of addons specified by ids
- pull changelogs for addons

http://warp13.co.uk/static/purse.txt

Hopefully someone can convert this to C# and integrate this into the existing WAU code, or integrate it into WUU.

Note that the authentication uses a modified version of RC4[1], the key scheduling algorithm is different (and completely broken cryptographically), and the PRNG stream XORs the previous value into the next one.

1: I hope since they're US based they're paying RSA Data Security for use of their RC4 patent.

Nabor · 08/24/08, 12:53 AM

After reading most of this, it seems like some people are overreacting just a little bit. No one really knows everything that is going to happen when WAU stops working (and it hasn't yet.) With just a little patience we might all be very surprised.

Zenedra · 09/07/08, 7:25 AM

From a simple minded and not very code enthusiast user pov, what I'm mostly concerned about this entire thing, is where I have to go when WotLK hits live to update my addons and when Ace will stop working. Should I expect an announcement in the WAU itself or seek the information on it's homepage, on Curse or maybe another unkown place?

windcape · 09/07/08, 8:38 PM

Zenedra the community will make sure to let you know. It'll be posted on WowAce, Curse, here, mmo-champion, nihilum.eu and various other community-news sites.

I wouldn't worry now

If anything, I rather be concerned about Curse pushing the release of the new client to early. The current beta versions of the CurseUpdater is terrible.

Sichosis · 09/15/08, 9:16 AM

Originally Posted by windcape

If anything, I rather be concerned about Curse pushing the release of the new client to early. The current beta versions of the CurseUpdater is terrible.

That's my main concern as well. I trust wowace too much, mainly because I have never had or heard of anyone getting keyloggers etc from their site, curse on the other hand I have heard multiple issues about. If they push the release too soon, it will be filled with bugs. That's just my take on the situation.

Quaunaut · 09/29/08, 1:53 PM

Today is the day it seems.

Today is the day that the below plans go into action. Please be patient while we transition to the new site.

Main Page - WowAce Wiki

• Goatbert · 09/30/08, 7:33 PM

This is crap. I don't want to be forced to use the crappy curse client. I have my addons just as I want them in jWowUpdater. Maybe I'll manually plug in all the project IDs from WowInterface or something, unless an alternative pops up.

Niallest · 10/01/08, 10:19 AM

I'd really love to see another alternative. Curse client is buggy and feels "spyware-ish", and WoWMatrix takes forever to update addons. Are there other options at the moment? Or does anyone know of something in development? I'd even pay for WAU to keep working!

If only i could code!

Kit Engel · 10/01/08, 11:35 PM

If most of your addons are available on WoWinterface or stuff, you can use JWoWupdater and just plug in the addon IDs. It's fairly fast and simple.

Meiriel · 10/02/08, 12:07 PM

I tried that, but it didn't work really well. Some really ancient versions of some addons kept appearing, apparently because the version on WoWAce was much more up to date than on WoWInterface. Other addons were never recognised from their ID. And some weeks ago it started to ignore Omen. Omen complained about not being up to date ingame but JWoWUpdater couldn't find any new versions. Not talking about what a hassle it was to feed it several dozend addon IDs from three different websites.

• Goatbert · 10/02/08, 1:05 PM

Seems like my only choice is going to be to drastically scale back my mod usage and only use mods that have regularly updated WoWInterface pages. 3.0 is going to be a total nightmare. I wish the WOWAce people had put it out there that they needed money so badly, I'd have gladly donated $20 a year or something to not have this happen. I tried the curse updater and it didn't even list most of my mods. And I don't trust it at all, and it won't update my Mac, only my PC. Awesome =/

• Theras · 10/02/08, 1:12 PM

I don't mind WowMatrix so much. Yeah, it takes forever and a day to update your addons, but then again I usually go to the men's room and fill my drink* before I log in anyways. Plus it actually works properly, which is more than I can say for the Curse client at the moment.

* Edit: It was suggested that I point out that I do not fill my drink in the men's room. It's two tasks.

Nabor · 10/02/08, 1:12 PM

You have to give them a little time to get eveything squared away Goatbert. On the WoWAce forums they are still talking about getting everything meshed together. People just need to give them some time