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Old 02/01/09, 12:42 PM   #1
Kaubel
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Infraction for Arantis: 1. All posters are to make an effort to communicate clearly.

Post: In-Depth Fury DPS Discussion
User: Arantis
Infraction: 1. All posters are to make an effort to communicate clearly.
Points: 1

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Message to User:
"I" is capitalized and "lol" is the fruit of idiots.
Original Post:
Originally Posted by aylene View Post
Looking at a few older parses of mine some quick napkin math showed me that the bloodthirst attack, counted in number of swings, equaled in a range of 9-12 % of all attacks made on bosses where you are fairly stationed. To be relying on crits on an entity of ~10%, give or take, of all your attacks made to lock up the extra ability, that is truly RNG. The new design is less RNG since it allows you to pick a way bigger number of attacks over the same period of time, thus smoothing out the RNG of critting an attack that is on a cooldown (be it a short one) that is so strikingly clear, especially on these short encounters we're dealing with.

It is indeed RNG-based however, but heavy? That is a matter of perspective what some people consider being heavy RNG. You could state that the whole warrior dps is heavily luckbased to rely on flurry uptime and the like to do damage. But we can at least find out if its less luckbased than having a decent crit rate on ~10 % of your attacks? Absolutely.

What is wrong with an unnormalized attack when we're using 2handers vs another AP-based attack? Please elaborate on this one if you can find the time.

And why slam is on the GCD is a fairly obvious one if you look at the PvP section of this game. Imagine one of those slams at the very same moment you drop a bloodthirst and the second before that a whirlwind. That is some insane damage for being over 1.5 seconds only and is obviously very overpowered.

And as someone stated before that this was an obvious scaling nerf, that is indeed true if Blizzard would only be considering unbuffed warriors. However in raids this new system presents a remarkable scaling alongside with temporary buffs such as Heroism and eventual haste on proc / use, speed pots and so forth. Also the better gear we're getting increases our flurry uptime (albeit high already) which means more overall haste that gives us more attacks over the same time and thus more Bloodsurge procs. Also keep in mind the overall rage gain gets increased (also this one is high already) and since we're not at the gear lvl where we can hs on every mainhand swing and still manage to keep 2 attacks and eventual slams on cooldown that means we only have more procs to look forward to. And if we're looking towards the blueposts stating that Blizzard wants to buff haste for melee, perhaps it gets even better?

While in combat the new scaling of Bloodsurge has significantly increased its value on short term buffs which can prove very useful whenever we're facing an encounter (hopefully in Ulduar) that requires a shitload of damage over a short amount of time, but yet remain a steady source of damage in the longer run.

To conclude, in the beta I was very pessimistic towards the Bloodsurge change and I really didn't like the feeling of how slams would just appear on random and so on. However after extensive hours of practice on rotations I found a sense of how this really is something that can separate a good warrior from a bad one. A good warrior will have to make choices on every encounter and engage himself alot in combat to gain the most amount of damage possible from this talent.

Having bloodsurge procing from more than BT and from hits instead of crits brought 1) unlinking slam from crit and therefor making crit rating worthless for the ability per se to proc and 2) seeing slam procing more often. The problem is that the latter didnt offer an upgrade - at least not that significant that worths talking about it- on the percentage of total dps slam represents. Even going from 6% to 10-12% which is double doesnt mean that you gained 4-6% more dps on that fight because simply you used slam more. This could happen for many reasons like prioritising by mistake slam over the other cds and i dont think i have to explain more.

Moreover, none can guarantee that you will actually utilise all your procs and this mainly comes from the fact that still slam is GCD. Scenario: You are sitting middle rage bar, you use HS, you get a proc, you see slam procing but on the same time BT and WW are ready for use. Of course the examples of how a proc can be wasted are numberless. BUT if slam was out of gcd.....that would solve many things and i really really doubt it would be so OP in pvp..

The fact that i dont like the choice of slam instead of lets say VR is personal preference indeed and my reason for that is simple. The last time i used slam in tbc was in gruul with a pug where i was just sitting full rage and on a dangerous threat position and i opened my spellbook to use it...( funny eh?) But now i am forced to use that ability in my fury rotation although blizzard actually listened after some years and moved improved slam talent to arms.....But if they had chosen VR instead like many players suggested it would offer balance around TG ( as they stated its their goal) and actually freeing 1 keybind (lol), besides the background of the tree was always connected with pure AP instead of weaponry like arms, at least untill TG was implemented.

Furthermore i cant follow you on that 'remarkable' scale with gear and / or temporary cds or even flurry uptime. Hasted attacking will boost the ratio of procs by its 1/3 since only the HS will be used more often and nothing else and assuming no execute usage.Also the chance to proc has nothing to do with gear besides more rage gaining aka more HS spam- a difference to proc which you wont even notice. As i said i cant see any worthy scale or significant increase to what that proc brings. Throw this to an era of ridiculous encounters, short lasted where bloodlusted dps is like 1/3 of total time and a personal rng covering crits to glancings that made my rng from +-100 in tbc to +-1500 and you get my picture.

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