Infraction for Czarus: 6. Do not post unless you have something new and worthwhile to say.

Kaubel · 06/01/09, 9:38 AM

Post: Raiding Theory
User: Czarus
Infraction: 6. Do not post unless you have something new and worthwhile to say.
Points: 1

Administrative Note:

Message to User:

Seriously? Recruit players that fit your raiding schedule? What exactly made you think to copy/paste some long, generic "guide" to raiding on the message board of a top raiding guild where some of the most experienced players in the game also post? I know you're probably proud of your guild and its success, but this doesn't belong here.

And don't sign your posts.

Original Post:

Introduction from Surazc

This is not a complete "How To..." for leading raids. This is merely a compilation of the leaderships' experience throughout their course of leading large groups of people through virtual nightmares of coordination. It goes without saying that basic people skills are an absolute necessity if you are to lead a raid. You can enrapture your raiders through humor, keep them in line through discipline, lure them with promises of loot and gold, or just ask nicely if they would like to do something. Whatever the method, a Raid Leader MUST be able to keep at least 10 people motivated and in line with one another.

I play a pretty serious role in my guild being the primary composer, strategist, MT, and Loot Master... but I am not the GM. The GM handles everything on the administrative side of getting new recruits, following up with Class Leaders on how their recruits are doing, and making sure that the raids form up on time so that I can use my little pawns to kill bosses.

I use two theories for the guild raids and how they work. First, there is progression raiding (where sometimes we will die intentionally to achieve a specific goal, or to learn about specific abilities), and then there is farming. When I talk about raid theory below, I am discussing the former of the two.

Conducting Raids

Getting Started

When we first started attempting heroic instances the biggest problem we had was that we could not find a day which agreed for the members of the guild to all be on at the same time for any significant amount of time. When I joined I learned that there was no place either real or virtual which kept track of everyone's schedules. This was a huge problem.

I would have to say that there are two major problems that a raid will encounter during its lifetime (including formation) and they are: Assembly and Commitment

Assembly

Raid assembly is the formation of the raid. While scheduling or selecting members to come you must remember that this game is not their #1 priority. It is a secondary part of your raider's lives and their RL schedules are to be considered sacred when you figure out what day and time to raid. Ask someone if they can be on for Instance X at Day Y and Z hour. If they say no, find someone else, do not push it.

In order to circumvent this problem it is wise to recruit only members who fit a pre-made raid schedule that the leadership has decided on. If someone is serious about raiding with you and your guild then they will make changes to their RL schedule FOR you and they will be, at the least, semi-permanent.

Consistency is the key to avoiding the "we don't have enough..." issue. Members who are always on should be promoted to reflect this. They also, because of their consistency, receive priority on gear and invites. Once this is clear to those who join, they will either make an effort to be consistent or quit from frustration. Either way, you refine your resource pool from which to choose members during your formation.

On the note of assembly: Mass invites using the in-game Calendar are great for weeding out inconsistent players but are usually bad once you know your standard 32-34 players for 25 man content. Selectively invite only the consistent players to their prescribed raids unless a predetermined alteration is discussed. This keeps people who have no chance of being included in the group from getting too hopeful which will lead to mass invite declines and eventual Gquits.

Commitment

Commitment is closely related to Assembly. If Assembly is the inability to show up to a raid for the scheduled times then Commitment would be the inability to stay for the selected times.

You do not want to bring players into groups that can not stay committed to the instance. There are a great number of common sense reasons why this is and I will cover the largest ones below:

Finding a replacement (if you don't already have someone on standby) creates downtime
Some people are harder to replace than others
You are saving someone new to an instance thereby wasting a player resource

Taking the time to get a new guy into a raid (especially a 10 man if there is no warlock) creates downtime: You have to get to the instance if you're not already there, you have to catch up to the group, you need to get your buffs, etc. It's simply more efficient to keep the same 10 people for the entirety of the raid. In addition, you run the risk of having to re-explain and re-educate the new members on the fight at hand.

The second issue is just plain logic. If you choose a fantastic healer who can only stay for the first half of the instance and you have to replace him you may not be able to find a healer with the ability to keep up with the difficulty of the second half of the instance which will naturally be more difficult than the first half (*cuogh* Mimiron *cough*).

For large guilds that have hundreds of mains the last point may not be an issue; however, smaller guilds need to consider what it means to save your members to an instance ID. If you only have 40 members and they are all equally consistent, the 15 that can not get into the heroic instance de'jour may grab 10 members from another guild that you have good relations with and knock out another instance. Doing this brings more tools to the guild, more reputation, and ultimately flexibility... but it can not be done if you go around handing out your raid ID willy-nilly to every member in the guild.

This is why a good "core" is important. Not because they bring skill with them, but because you can plan some kind of regular schedule around them. Repetition is the key to success when you're dealing with an amorphous demographic (such as a large guild with inconsistent members) and it will do you wonders to have at least 12 people you can rely on consistently.

The Raid: Downtime

As all raids have a finite resource that can not be fiddled with (time). The ultimate challenge of any raid is to accomplish all its objectives in the time allowed. The only obstacle in fulfilling this goal is unused time, referred to as downtime. Any time your raid is not moving, or killing a boss, they are creating downtime.

A good raid will take as many precautions as possible to minimize downtime and maximize their "work time." This includes such measures as:

Anything gained in a raid belongs to the Gbank. Make it clear at the start.
If someone argues with your leadership, and their point has no solid base, kick them. You don't need raiders wasting everyone's time trying to argue a bad idea.
Call people out on their mistakes. It makes the group less inclined to screw up and waste time.
Running a radio-bot in the background at low volume helps.
Schedule breaks. This leaves no one an excuse to "ninja-afk" unless it is an emergency
Have your weakest healer be the designated resurrection guy in case someone dies on trash
Move as a majority. Designate "Loners" to skin / engineer / mine / herb. They will catch up.
Designate a main-assist. This person is in charge of selecting the kill order and enacting it.
Have a combat happy tank in charge of pulls. Make sure he has a raid-monitor to watch healer mana.
AoE is not always the answer. Single Target damage is more efficient and will result in less downtime than AoE.
CC is best whenever possible. Use the same mark for the same person every time.
The tank in charge of pulls will get the next pack of mobs when you're down to one remaining enemy. (Exception: CC packs)
Only rebuff before bosses. You do not need to buff between trash pulls.
Designate buffers. Set up assignments for paladins. Buy reagents from the Guild Treasury and hand them out before starting.
Jokes are okay when the raid is moving along just fine. If you wipe, consider calling for vent silent
When in doubt of linked packs, or aggro range, kill it. It's safer to spend 3 minutes killing trash than 7 minutes coming back from a wipe.
Never link meters in raid chat. Kick people who do. Everyone is running recount. They have the exact same information as you do. People who link meters only do so to boast (which you don't need) or dis (which you REALLY don't need) and should be removed before their trouble spreads.

These are the things we do that I can think of off the top of my head. Everything has a method to it so that if the first system fails, the next logical step takes its place. I.E: MT dies, OT is designated as Add-tank, so OOT picks up the boss; MA dies, he calls new MA, new MA is now MA.

The single biggest steps you can take to reduce downtime are: 1) Don't use a DKP system OR Put a time limit per item if you must use one. 2) Designate your rezzers. 3) Enforce the "Clear and Go" mentality. People who horde around the boss don't get loot. 4) Schedule your breaks

Just by doing those four things you can reduce your downtime by about 40%. Before I joined and put these systems in place, raids would take anywhere between two to three days @ 4 hours a day to clear Heroic Naxx just because of all the downtime and confusion in between trash. After we got everyone used to the new system (took about 2 weeks and numerous Gkicks) raids were reduced to about 3 Hours for heroic Naxx (which includes 5 minute breaks after every boss: one hour of forced downtime).

The Raid: Bosses

Step 1) Form a composition of the best players in the guild (dictated by position hierarchy, better players are given better rank). All officers, class leaders, the GM, and anyone listed as Sr. Raider is mandated to attend.

Step 2) Identify raid strength and weakness. Are we low on healing? Have we Biased Melee DPS or Ranged DPS? Do we have at least one of each class, etc. Make raid aware so that they know what to be careful for (clumping, taking avoidable damage, etc.)

Step 3) Identify boss abilities. We do a "dry run" where we don't actually attempt to kill the boss. On complex fights this may repeat a couple times until everything the boss does is identified

Step 4) Delegate Strategy. I come up with a strategy and positioning scheme which suits the current raid's strengths and weaknesses.

Step 5) Kill. There is no practice. We've already seen what the boss does and there are no more surprises. We move on to the next boss and repeat.

When it comes to Farm raiding, a couple of prerequisite steps take place:

1) Everyone in the guild reads the forums at least once a week. Post-Raid discussion between the officers regarding the fights (which is recorded in Ventrilo) is uploaded to the website on a fight by fight basis.

2) Members and raiders who were not in the instance watch the kill video and then listen to the video without the commentary to identify things on their own, and then again with the commentary from the CLs and officers to bring their attention to specific things that they may have not noticed or did not deem important

3) Members and raiders discuss the fights in the forums with questions about specifics on a boss-by-boss basis inside the guild forums. No question is foolish and no one is reprimanded for asking anything. If it helps them stay alive in their individual runs, then it should be cultivated.

4) They raid. 1 Officer (in charge of strats and loot) and a CL (in charge of keeping things moving) lead the run with the now-educated raiders and members. These groups do not follow step three (dry runs) and form an amorphous strategy based on what they have done in the past (the 10-man groups are mostly friends and have played together for a while).

The Raid: Loot

We believe the loot is a tool to kill bosses. It is not a reward to be earned, it is something you are entitled to which enables you to do your job (killing bosses) better. To this end, the best performers get the best tools. In all raids, we decide who gets what loot based on a loot council system. The officers and the CLs all get a vote (CL's only if someone from their class is legitimately in the run for an item) and decide via majority who is the best person to receive the new loot based on their performance v. need. Whoever has the best ratio gets the item.

While the ML is handling loot (in 10 mans the CL has equal input for distribution of items), the rest of the raid moves forward to kill trash as led by either a Class Lead (for 10 mans) or an Officer (for 25 mans, picked before and announced before the raid starts). The ML catches up and the raid continues smoothly. This system minimizes downtime and keeps everyone focused on what is truly important: Progress. All members in the guild know that in time, they will get gear... they don't complain because they wear the Guild's Tag and they know what that means.

Managing Raids & Raiders

Goal-Oriented Raiding

When you raid, it is important to keep your raiders motivated. Monotony will start to set in once the instance is on "farm" status so it is imperative that you keep your raiders focused on a unifying goal. Your goal can be anything you want it to be. "Have 10% less deaths through the entire raid," or "Kill Boss XYZ in at least 20 less seconds," or "Get achievement ABC." Without a unifying goal people will feel like they're just repeating the same content every time (which they are) and this will lead to burnout. If you keep your raiders feeling like they're always making progress by fulfilling the current goal, you will stave off burnout and keep a focused raid.

The Average Raider

You need to define in your mind what you believe the "average raider" is and use that as the golden standard for what your raiders, as individuals, need to be able to do. If you believe the average raider should never die to a void zone or "fire" effect, then create raid policy which enforces this. I know it seems extreme to say something like, "Dying to void zones disqualifies you from getting loot," but you will never see anyone die to void zones during the raid.

Your definition of the "Joe Raider" for your guild may be another guild's definition of "Raid All-star." This is not impossible and in fact can be seen in numerous guilds around the world. You must always judge your players on what YOUR basis of "average" is. If your average raider pulls 50% more DPS than the "standard Class XYZ" then everyone of that class in your guild should be able to pull at least 50% more DPS than the class standard for your server / continent / world etc.

You must always remember: Asking someone for your guild's definition of "average game play" is NOT wrong. They are in the guild because they met some kind of standard you imposed, demanding them to live up to that standard is something you should not have to do.

On that note, do not recruit people to your guild / raids who do not measure up to your definition of "average."

Player Attitudes

I just finished this extremely verbose description of setting a standard for game play, but what about attitude? Players may put out identical statistics but have totally different views on your leadership, guild style, the weather, etc. How do you deal with individual player attitudes which may affect your raid in a negative way?

Edited in:
DISCLAIMER - These are player attitudes, not statements about player skills based on stereotypes. It is possible to have an Elitist who is not at the top of the meters, it is possible to have a young "Old Guy," it is possible to have any stereotyped player fit the player attitude of a given raider below but NOT possess the skills to go along with that mentality.

The Elitist

This is the guy who calls everyone below him on the damage meter or healing meter or whatever meter they can find, "Inferior." He makes a point of being the best by his own standard of measurement and refuses to help others improve because they will then encroach on his territory as numero uno. He will expect all BiS gear to go to him regardless of his attitude and will cite statistics such as "superior rotation," or, "better attendance." Whatever it takes to keep himself the best, he'll do it.

The Elitist can be a blessing if your raid is full of General Custers as they will continue to strive in their quest to overthrow the Elitist, but more often the not the Elitist is a tremendous burden on the raid. He will cause drama over loot where there is none, demand things of other players when it is not his place, and be generally a detriment rather than an asset.

Point out that no matter how good he is, he can not solo the boss who hits him for 18K. It's either your way, or no way. The Elitist will only show respect to The Big Dick, The Loot Master, or other Elitists and because of this should be removed from your raids and your guild ASAP.

The Pessimist

These raiders will use words or phrases such as "impossible," or "can not be done!" They become easily discouraged and will usually ask for a wipe if more than 3-4 people die in an attempt at a boss. Wiping often on trash (if it happens) will cause the Pessimist to drain the morale of your raid, this is either because they lost their faith in the raid or because they are easily frustrated or annoyed with failure and have developed a sour attitude.

The Pessimist is something that no one wants to have around. People don't like being told that they are going to fail, especially over and over again from the same guy. The Pessimist will generate anger towards him and invite unwanted drama into the raid because of his attitude. When you confront him about his attitude he will often defend himself with something akin to, "It's just my opinion man."

To deal with this gloom caster you must remind The Pessimist of all the times he said something was impossible and the raid pulled through. Remind him that everything can not be perfect all the time. He may eventually turn around into a General Custer. If that doesn't work, simply warn him (or remind him) that his attitude is becoming unacceptable for the raid. He can either shelve it, stay quiet, or leave.

The Inattentive

The Inattentive is a pretty easy case to describe and treat. This is the raider that doesn't pay attention to dynamic events in an encounter such as flame waves, void zones, stalactites, polarities, etc. Anything that requires you to have an active attention span will either kill him, severely injure him, or worse: kill someone else.

Dealing with the Inattentive is simple: issue a warning, then remove him. Someone who can't pay attention to a computer screen for 3 - 10 minutes isn't going to perform at your average level anyway.

General Custer

General Custers will always try and beat the odds. They will take on the impossible and try their hardest even if things look grim. Though the tenacity is a wonderful trait, their fatal flaw is that they never learn. A Custer will get frustrated if the rest of the group can't accomplish a new goal, regardless of how difficult it is, and will continue to push for harder and harder challenges... even if your raid hasn't done the easy ones yet.

Custers will not always be the best of their class, but they will inspire other players to try things that they may have not considered otherwise. This is a difficult balance to keep and thus discretion is paramount when you deal with Custers. If they make a suggestion and the raid seems willing to give it a shot, go for it and commend them privately for being a go-getter. If the raid does not want to try, privately tell Custer that it will be added to the schedule for next week if the raid agrees.

Sometimes a Custer will be adamant that something is done his way. If this happens, remind them of their previous failed ideas, and he will most likely back down. If they continue to press the issue then you should remind them (again, privately) that the group has decided to not go through with his decision and that the Custer should respect that. Custers rarely bring Drama because they enjoy the thrill of the "content's edge" and know that without a consistent group, they will be unable to accomplish their goals.

The Usurper and the Ninja

The Usurper will attempt to take over your raid by discussing new strats, calling for things over Ventrilo or raid chat, and generally disrupt your normal flow of operations. Usurpers are almost always new recruits who managed to hide or control themselves through their application and interview process, or, are PUGs with an attitude.

Usurpers will not back down from you and will never stop trying to do things their way. Unlike a Custer, they think that they are the leader. Raiders will start to resent them and the raid will lose its focus.

The Ninja will present in many forms: He can be a vent ninja and never sign on for a raid, he can not have an addon which is required installed (and think he can get away with it), he may randomly go AFK without warning. The Ninja is someone who believes that he is an exception to the rule or -worse- that he is above it. He will end up wasting your time with frivolous crap and argue to the end of the earth that he is right.

The Ninja and the Usurper should both be dealt with in the same fashion: Get rid of them ASAP.

The Old Guy

The Old Guy is usually not the quickest on the keyboard. He is set in his ways of how to play and won't abide how to play his class from any of the "younger generation." He is usually a keyboard turner or a button clicker. He will perform either at or below your average level of play for your guild / raid.

Old Guys are the leading cause of raid wipes on fights with target specific area effects such as the General Vezax fight simply because the timing is so strict that you can't afford to be using your keyboard to turn, or be in the middle of clicking a button with the mouse and then pivot.

Old Guys should never heal because they most likely also do not know how to use, and refuse to learn how to use, macros.

The Old Guy will only ever take advice from other Old Guys and will become rapidly agitated if a player younger than him attempts to improve his game play or tell him how he needs to do something.

If you have an Old Guy but can't carry him on a specific fight, simply ask him to sit out for the fight. Most of them won't struggle at all and will in fact wish you luck.

Summary

Every guild, and every raid leader, has their own way of doing things. No single method of conducting a raid or running a guild is perfect and they all have their respective strengths and weaknesses; that being said, this is how we do things. We believe that asking for the application of common sense and intelligence to a game is not too much to ask for and our policies reflect that mindset.We aggressively protect our method because not only are we comfortable with it, but it works. It also has the added benefit of keeping loot whores and drama mama's out of the ranks of not only the raids the guild runs but also the guild itself.

I hope that this guide has given you at least ONE gem of wisdom for how to improve your raids. Be it in dealing with players, or in saving time, I hope that you garnered something from this monstrosity of a text wall.

We wish you good luck in your endeavors in the World of Warcraft,
Tainted Retribution
Mug'thol US
Alliance