Warning for Arythorn: 2. All opinions should be stated as succinctly as possible.

• Aldriana · 10/28/09, 1:03 PM

Post: Resto (PvE) Healing Discussion
User: Arythorn
Infraction: 2. All opinions should be stated as succinctly as possible.
Points: 0

Administrative Note:

Message to User:

Please don't quote-split.

Original Post:

Originally Posted by grimtage

RJing someone who stepped into a fire is pointless and stupid unless you're swiftmending them because they're standing in a fire, by the time 1 tick goes off someone else would have healed it . . .

I'm raid healing, it's my job to top them off. I guess I can make the assumption that "someone else would have healed it" every time a raid member takes damage . . . but I know our heal team and I know how we have coverage set. Also, even when someone gets out of the fire, there is a persistent DoT which a HoT like RJ is ideally suited to cover. If someone cast time heals them to full, the DoT will continue ticking. With a 1 sec GCD, I've dealt with that damage for it's duration -- tell me what spell or healing class is better suited to do this than RJ and a druid. But it's clearly "pointless and stupid" for me to heal it with RJ . . .

Originally Posted by grimtage

If you don't like doing, can't do or don't trust your other healers that's fine, but that's not what these forums are for; these forums are for getting the best out of your character and if you're not alleviating other people and giving your innervates away, then I'm sorry but you're not giving to the raid as much as you could be doing . . . In phase 2 if you use it more than once because of exactly the same damage (tank getting hit) then you're just weaving it in between HoTs, which is exactly what I'm trying to say to do. You don't just stand there twiddling your thumbs or uselessly RJing random people in the raid, you pop a heal on a tank when you get time . . .

It's the fact that I DO TRUST my other healers that causes me not to throw completely unnecessary Nourishes on the tanks. I do not need to be all things to all people. We have assignments of coverage. I give our Paladins a consistent underlay of hps (RJ, LBx3, RG) that they can rely on being there; they deal with the spikes and that underlay of hps gives keeps the incoming a bit more level and regular. This is synergistic. Me throwing Nourishes down on the tanks in addition is not required whatsoever. Honestly, 2 coordinated Paladins are plenty of burst coverage on the tank without me throwing Nourish in. We have two druids putting RJ, LBx3, RG on the tanks plus two Paladins with complete focus on them. The tanks have all the TLC they need and then some.

I guess I could junk some mana and GCD time on Nourishing them as well but there's no good reason given our heal team setup to do this . . . other than boredom or to maybe to take care of a nervous twitch. I mean theres always space bar for the nervous twitch and it doesn't cost any mana. Jump tree jump. Also, if I want to give my innervate away to someone else and provide the most value possible to my raid as you put it, I probably shouldn't waste mana by throwing down excess healing.

Originally Posted by grimtage

Trying to suggest that I advocated spamming Nourish and nothing else is not only insulting it's degrading us both, the whole point I'm trying to get across (and stated a few times) is that if you see 20% of your healing as SM/Nourish as often as a blue moon, then you could be offering more to your raid than you currently are . . .

The only thing that is insulting and degrading is your tone in general to multiple people on this board -- and now it's starting to be reflected in my tone as well. What I am saying is, if your Nourish/SM is upward of 20%, then you must be casting it more than occasionally and probably somewhat frequently back-to-back. There's no other way you are going to get it to 20% of your output. I'm further saying that, given my heal-team synergy, there is no good reason to be doing this. Maybe in yours there is. Your experience/setup does not equal everyone else's experience/setup. We run with 2 Paladins on tanks every night. They have it on lock. We run with 2 Druids on raid and we have that on lock. A fifth member of the heal team is a Holy/Disc priest that will switch spec/coverage as the fight demands or a Resto Shaman. The Priest/Shaman are there to provide burst healing on raid when necessary or additional coverage on tanks when necessary. We do a fine job of keeping everything upright with a zone coverage model and leveraging heal-team synergy. There are different ways of doing things -- your way is not the only way or even the best way. If it works for you great -- your tactics are completely unnecessary and superfluous in our setup.

Originally Posted by grimtage

When assigned to tank healing (10man Alga with 2 resto druids?) I find Nourish comes top of my healing, closely followed by RJ then lifebloom and then Regrowth and finally Swiftmend (WG is in there, but I omitted it as it's not always in the same spot). Nourish quite often takes up more than 40% of my healing doing this . . .

In 25 ToC heroics, my Nourish/SM is consistently less than 10%, very often lower than 5%. I use Swiftmend when it is necessary to get someone safe, not because it is currently off cooldown. Similarly, I use Nourish when there is burst damage that I personally need to cover. Other than that, I am providing a steady flow of hps to the raid and tanks that makes healing a lot easier for our healers that are cast-time bound.

When I am two-healing 10s with a Paladin -- absolutely Nourish takes on a much larger role in my output. But, while it takes on a bit more prominence in my output, it is still around 10% -- not 20%. Now, if I was primary tank healing with another druid as you talk about then, yes, I would expect my Nourish output to take a drastic jump as it would make complete sense. But when I am raid healing 10s or 25s, I've yet to find a heavy use of Nourish to be the most effective way to keep things upright.

Originally Posted by grimtage

The point I'm trying to make is not for tank healing, it's for raid healing when the raid isn't taking any damage. There are plenty of times when there's no damage on the raid and nothing you can see incoming either, and at these times if you've got all your HoTs up you have choices, and I believe the best choice is to throw Nourish. If you can give me a reason why it's a bad thing, then I will accept and stop these so far fruitless posts, but until then I will just point out that no one has told me why weaving in Nourishes is a bad idea.

20% Nourish / SM output may be a good idea or even be necessary given the dynamics of your heal team. The way I have our heal team built, Nourish at that level would be minimally-productive at best, counter-productive at worst. I'm glad it works for you. Stop insisting it's the only way that will work for others.