Lunchbox

WowWiki has a nice macro page for each class. The druid page should have all of the macros that you are looking for, as well as a few other handy ones.

/w00t Azgalor

 

Lunchbox

I love these forums, good stuff. I answered one question, so now I'll ask one...

I play 2v2 mostly with a mutilate-rogue partner. We generally focus fire at first to quickly take down one opponent. Occasionally we split up for whatever reason and will each solo one person. Anyway, to the point, 3 classes give me trouble:

Warlocks
Shadow Priests
Frost Mages

Against equally geared, competent players, I'll lose these fights more than half the time. I'm sure there's a good way to beat these classes, I just haven't figured it out. And while I know that these are rock vs. paper matchups, I don't believe that anyone is unbeatable (*cough* locks+felhunters *cough*), regardless of class and gear, when you use the right strategy.

Anyone have any solid game plans for these matchups?

 

Veck

For Locks and Shadow priest the easy answer is probably to get some shadow resist gear. Without that you'll have to be a bit lucky with your crits I would say.

Personnaly I try keeping them cc'ed as much as possible. So opening with pounce, using maim to regain energy for more bursting. Trinket out of instant fears and use feral charge/bash to interrupt the next fear.

For Frost mages having lots of mana do be able to shift out of what they throw at you to keep chasing them down and hope there's a pillar near you where you can get out of los and throw a quick heal I would say.

 

Currylaksa

you start with:

/cancelform [stance:1/2/3/4/5/6]

then you can use

- /cast Travel Form(Shapeshift) or whatever form you like
- /cast Cyclone
- /cast Regrowth

I find it useful to bind the cat/bear/travel shapeshifts to the scroll wheel.

 

Lunchbox

I tried doing this a long time ago with Nature's Swiftness and Healing Touch, and it would not let me bind actions to mouse wheel scrolling (something about it being a button that cannot be held down). Has the mechanic changed, or is there a trick to this?

 

PsiVen

I've been enjoying our 3v3 team: MS Warrior + Feral Druid + Holy Paladin.

The druid is less susceptible to snares than a second warrior (much less than a rogue) because I can't BoF two people at once, more vulnerable than a warrior but much less than a rogue when threatened by melee, and has better CC than either. Our main problem is good frost mages on pal/war/mage teams, because either the DPS has trouble catching the mage or I eventually get sheeped without an escape.
Bleeds also make Feral+MS a great choice when you want to kill plate first, provided he's not a dwarf.

 

Currylaksa

Hmm I never had that problem, but if there is, /stopcasting should do the trick

 

Kink

My biggest beef currently is the incredible lack of +hit gear on our PvP set.

I am running about with only 3.4% to hit right now and I really notice when I miss a pounce, or a maim, very frustrating indeed!

I think I will start to gather all the DPS jewelery with +hit I can till I hit the PvP hit cap =\. There is a nice ring off Malchezzar I will try for, but I am a bit dubious about going for Romulos vial =\ other than the nice +hit, the proc is poor and I am sure our rogues won't be happy! Anyone know a source of +hit that can be obtained without sacrificng too many stats?

In fact are there ANY feral items with +hit? Seems this is quite a nasty itemisation hole for us. Lots of +Agi +AP +hit, but almost no +str +agi +hit items.

There is light at the end of the tunnel.
The only problem is, it's often an incoming train.

 

Leleth

There are simply no pvp items with chance to hit for feral druids around.
Options:
a) Use some rogue-pve-items (karazahn offers a nice neck and a ring with agi/+hit/+ap .
b) Sacrifice stamina and use +hit or hybrid gems.
c) Live without +hit, but be happy about the additional resilience/stamina.

Short: You have to choose between resilience, stamina and +hit.

I use option a) and therefore I feature only 300 resilience. I am rarely attacked though.

If you are the primary tank for your team I would suggest option c).
If your primary role is to supply burst damage you can live without +hit.

If your primary role is about disruption (pounce, maim, bash) you definitely want a 5% hit chance.

 

Tierce

Getting the 95 hit rating in my pvp gear has always been a struggle, but I've always been able to manage it. I used DFT for a long time as part of the solution. Now I just use a few Karazhan items and gems with +hit. Ring off Curator, Cloak off Aran, Cenarion Expedition helm enchant. I also unfortunately use the raven ring from Sethekk Halls and the blue helm from the Steamvaults quest. I have a romeo's poison vial that I tried to use, but was so disappointed with the proc rate that it's now permanently banked.

All that said, I'll be respec'ing to resto for Arenas after this weekend. Never though I'd be saying that.

Have you ever tried simply turning off the TV, sitting down with your children, and hitting them?

 

Anticor

Do any druids still use their Rune of Metamorphosis? I enjoy using it from time to time for kicks but I've never done testing to see if the mana saved shifting is enough to warrant keeping it equipped. I know, as a druid, the easiest way to kill another druid is to run them out of mana and often druid on druid fights would go in my favor because of that trinket...that was back during the lvl 60 days I haven't really put it to use in the TBC.

 

Currylaksa

With dedicated TBC feral itemization and reduced shifting costs, feral druids should have enough mana to shift constantly, unless they decided to mix in tab-cyclone and healbotting.

 

Solstice

I never thought I would but I started using this again for 2v2 recently. A good frost mage or even hunter can kite me oom without breaking a sweat while preserving most of their cooldowns and being able to lock onto them for 20 seconds without consuming mana can really tip the balance.

 

Siddown

http://www.warcraftmovies.com/movieview.php?id=42569

There's a link of "The Fat Cow and the Pro" a 2v2 Video of a Frost Mage/Feral Druid combo that in their European Battlegroup Season 1 2v2 Bracket finished 3rd with a 2500+ rating.

Not only is it a great video showing off a Feral Druid in action, it's the best Arena video I've seen to date, period...and this coming from a Rogue. Both players were frapsing at the same time, so they cut each fight together showing both points of view.

This Feral Druid heals, Cyclones, stuns and dishes out damage, so it's definitely worth the watch if you are interested in 2v2.

Armory Page from this season:

http://armory.wow-europe.com/team-in...ow+And+The+Pro

The Cow in question:

http://armory.wow-europe.com/charact...mane&n=Chrille

EDIT: Cleaned up an ugly paragraph

 

Vodkagrokka

In my experiences with feral druids (I myself am a 8/11/42 spec), they're not all that effective in arenas. The only situation when I've felt threatened by a feral druid at all is when I faced a team that had, I believe, [2 Rogues, 2 Feral Druids, 1 Resto Druid]. It was a full stealth team, and they all opened up on one person and beat the living shit out of him. Except, I healed through it somehow and we ended up winning.

Moral of the story: Feral Druids aren't the GREATEST for 5v5 arenas, but they can be utilized in such a way that they can be pretty good, like the team that I just described.

 

Kink

This comment really puzzles me. You play a druid. So you know how much shfiting costs. For me its a little over 600 mana per shift. I can shift 10 times then I am oom. That is hardly constantly =/.

But to contribute I would like to point out that World of Raids has some nice feral macros as well as some good information on how to set up feral shape shift macros etc.


And to the poster above, feral druids are maybe not the best slot for a team, but if you know what to do you can really be a very valuable member. On my feral I usually play the interrupt game. While my single target interrupt is not as good as my rogues, I can tab cyclone the DPS and really help out my healer. I also can decurse along with the mage and stay ahead of locks, backup heal and cyclone a healer as the assist train target gets to low hp, and then throw in some damage, shift to bear to charge/stun a healer after.

Really a feral druid MUST use all his abilities to be effective. I wear a combination of resilience, stam, high armour and int gear now. That way I am useless to focus fire because they cannot kill me (melee teams... caster teams are owie =), I keep a melee rooted with rank 1 root (often is dispelled) and keep 1 target cycloned. Shifting to Kitty form to help finish off a target, or to harass a squishy healer.

I finally feel that I actually bring something to a 5v5 team and while other classes may be able to replace me, I don't think my team gets any noticeable gan for doing so.

FYI I play with..

Feral/Elem shaman
Warrior/Rogue
Mage
Hunter
Pally/Priest

The mage is superb, excellent at focus sheeping and CSing. Our rating last season was very high, although most of us switched to different characters now and started late for season 2=). First few weeks were without a healer just to get our 10games and soem points in =). I find on my feral I always feel I have a LOT of options, more so than any other druid spec.

There is light at the end of the tunnel.
The only problem is, it's often an incoming train.

 

Kheletarr

It's very easy for a feraldruid to get enough hit, you just need to get it from outside sources like jewelry and gems. I'd agree that the lack of hit on the pvpgear would be an issue if we weren't able to get the needed amount of hit from other slots, but since we can I really don't see the problem

Assuming you're doing Kara/heroics:

Amu: Worgen Claw Necklace - Items - World of Warcraft or Choker of Vile Intent - Items - World of Warcraft

Rings: Band of the Exorcist - Items - World of Warcraft and Ring of a Thousand Marks - Items - World of Warcraft

Cloak: Royal Cloak of Arathi Kings - Items - World of Warcraft

The pvpmace gives another 20 hitrating coupled with surefooted (which is a nice feraldruid enchant) which adds 10 more. Fill out the rest with 8 hit or 4 agi 4 hit gems so you can reach the cap.


Hitrating is the single most important stat for any meleecentric character/spec. 4% isn't good enough, you need 5.2% or whatever the cap is. A missed pounce/bash/maim is just brutal


Edit: Here's one example how you can reach the hitcap without gimping your other stats:

The Armory

 

Adis

I would like to put down some numbers towards dispelling the myth that moonkin is a superior form to cyclone in.

As a feral druid, for a long time I dreamed of spec'ing balance to be more helpful to my team (for cc purposes), but never did since I didn't have the gear or the time to put into acquiring it. For some time I'd pondered that respec'ing 8 points from resto which I didn't really need (was 0/41/20) and putting them into balance might be useful, but didn't get around to testing it out until last week. I've found it has been very effective, all the caster form cc which I used to try unsuccessfully to do is now giving much better results.

But before going into that experience, here's the theorycrafted deal with moonkin survivability/effectivenss casting as compared to a feral druid in caster form.

Lets take the example of a moonkin with ~13k armour (55% mitigation) , vs my feral druid which has ~4250 (29% mitigation) in caster form in PvP gear with motw and kings (for general reference, this gives me ~16500 in bear). The reasons feral has more armour in bear than a moonkin does have already been outlined by other posters, these are pretty typical numbers. Obviously the moonkin is looking good so far compared to caster form, but we only need to introduce one very important stat to almost completely eliminate the advantage:

Dodge.

With motw and kings I have 28% dodge in caster form. I carry a solid quantity of agility not because I want to pew pew uber critz, but because agi overall provides good value in multiple areas - dodge included. A moonkin generally carries no agility whatsoever, and with 80 base agility and the base dodge chance for druids that equates to about 4% dodge with the above buffs.

So lets take a simplified walk through of 100 hits for 1k raw damage each:

After avoidance we have feral taking 72k, and moonkin taking 96k in raw damage.
After mitigation we have the feral taking 51k, and the moonkin taking 43k.

So yes, the moonkin has a damage soaking advantage vs melee, but it is nowhere near as large as people assume. But equally important, perhaps even more important, is the issue of interruptability.

Bear in mind of course that I'm working with the Control of Nature talent as a given. I have found taking it as a feral has increased my effectiveness in almost every circumstance over my previous more conventional zero balance build (and it is a definite 100% plus in 5v5 arena which is my primary interest). So we aren't talking about pushback from damage, but other forms of interruption.

Because feral has dodge, it means that 1/4 of all avoidable interupts (eg. Bash, Maim, Gouge etc) will fail to hit the feral which would have hit the moonkin. Further, feral has primal tenacity which means 15% of stuns which do land will be resisted (as will 15% of fears fwiw). If the feral gets silenced they can instantly bear and charge as an alternative to the cc they were trying to cast whereas balance has a double shift, and may not even have feral charge. Not to mention of course that a silenced or spell locked moonkin has its damage options removed or limited respectively - a feral who gets silenced or locked can go full offensive in response.

As a minor aside, a feral druid in caster form CAN heal without a shift - whereas a moonkin must shift. This is a very minor point however, since a feral druid healing is useless 95% of the time.

As the credible sages of feral druidness have said, being feral is not about choosing a single form and maxing it - it's about using your forms to best advantage. Since spec'ing into control of nature I no longer consider myself DPS, even though I can deal as much damage as any other DPS our 5v5 team fields other than the warrior, if I so choose. I now consider myself control, with burst DPS to add to finishing a kill that is ripe. The instant I changed my spec and mentality, our rating went from 1600 to 1700 in a short session and I expect it to keep going up for another 100 or so before we start hitting the wall against teams who are better practiced/more skilled and/or better geared.

Between Cyclone, Root, (Nature's Grasp), Feral Charge, Bash, Maim, (Warstomp) Druids are perhaps the most potent cc'ers in the game thanks to most of the abilities being on different DR's and short or no cooldowns. While a rogue can be more potent in both damage and cc when all his cooldowns are available - 30 seconds into the fight he's a spent force, compared to a druid who can go for minutes until his mana runs out from shifting (casting cyclone and root is NOT mana intensive, its the shifting to access your form's abilities that will eventually burn you out - tranquility can also save your group in rare circumstances at a brutal cost to your mana).

The other thing with the druid's cc arsenal is the fact that cyclone/root are most effective vs world of platecraft. In spite of the trinket buff, cyclone is still one of the best ways to deal with a pally (or a warrior for that matter), and in spite of second wind root is still useful against warriors. Warrior + Pally is uber and is everywhere. Druid neutralising both for 10 seconds making the battle a 4v3 with the 3 missing its two most OP members is therefore, also very uber and justifies a druid a spot in a 5v5 team of appropriate makeup (not to mention that there is time to deal a couple of k damage and/or feral charge a 3rd opponent during that lockdown). The only spec requirements to fill this role are Control of Nature and Feral Charge.

The irony is almost every PvP resto druid takes these talents outside the resto tree, and I believe that is what empowers them in (5v5) arena - not the fact that they are healing.

 

Kheletarr

The reason why moonkin is superior to feral in this aspect is that you're able to more fluidly do your job (cc and dps) and you don't need to burn precious mana on shifting. Also, dodge is overrated considering it's worth absolutely nothing when you're a) stunned and b) attacked from behind, while armor works all the time. On top of that dodge (just like armor) is only usable against physical damage and most teams only runs with one in the 5on5 bracket, warriors.

Don't forget that moonkins not only have control of nature, but also nature's reach which adds 20% to the range of cyclone and roots.

 

Kink

Appreciate the list. I have already made some changes to my gear and have a bunch of the items on your list. I cannot check the armory profile just yet (at work) so I will check that later. I think the main issue is not just the total lack of +hit, its sort of the suggestion that due to the total lack of +hit, do the item designers have any idea what a druid needs? And as the game progresses will they add druid items with +hit? Or will we still take the not ideal rogue statted gear with +hit?

There is light at the end of the tunnel.
The only problem is, it's often an incoming train.

 

Chuck

I found this thread basically having the same issues and beeing truely incapable of killing any healer who has the slightest clue of what he does (cookie cutter pve spec feral here)

In my book I'll just keep playing Arena for the nice points so I can get some nice items (got 2/4 Gladiator, 2/4 Merciless, the Merciless Maul) but I'm near to give up the idea of having a good ranked team with at least a chance against some setups but I always feel beeing a Warrior I'd aid my group _way_ more.

Anyhow, Blizzard promised to utilize Druids a bit more so they are more presented in Arena, I hope they keep the word and generally can only agree on rest of the thread.

www.kul-tiras.org - unofficial EU-Kul Tiras Community

 

• sadris

They actually said the opposite. Tom Chilton basically said, "Druids are fine, l2p"